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Old 06-18-2009, 12:04 PM   #1
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Cable Crimper

I need to crimp a 1/2 dozen or so terminals onto #6 AWG battery cable and am thinking I can use one of these gizmos.* I realize it's not the perfect solution, but it looks reasonable, much, much less expensive than buying a proper crimping tool and a lot less hassle than running back and forth to West Marine to use theirs.*

Anyone had experince with this low tech, low buck tool?

Thanks
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Old 06-18-2009, 01:13 PM   #2
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RE: Cable Crimper

Those things work quite well, but because it makes a better mechanical connection than electrical since it only crimps a small area compared to a proper crimping die, I would also solder the connection to prevent corrosion forming inside the shell.
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Old 06-18-2009, 05:00 PM   #3
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RE: Cable Crimper

Quote:
RickB wrote:

Those things work quite well, but because it makes a better mechanical connection than electrical since it only crimps a small area compared to a proper crimping die, I would also solder the connection to prevent corrosion forming inside the shell.
*I would use heat shrink to keep moisture out on battery cable, it makes everything look neat and clean along with keeping moisture out.
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Old 06-19-2009, 04:37 AM   #4
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Cable Crimper

Depending on the size , as a rag bagger we have a Nicropress cable tool on the smaller heavy wiring like #6.

It does crush the hell out of the terminal end .

There are mixed opinions on soldering BIG (04) starter sized wiring.

WE use a discarded cable cutter die ground to have flats on the ex cutting edge.

This crush locks the heavy terminals in a number of rings and seems impossible to pull off, we have tried.

So the mechanical portion of the requirement is done.

WE do chose to use a plumbers ladle filled with molten solder to dunk the end into on starting circuits.For the electrical requirement.

So far 35 years and no failures,

FF



-- Edited by FF on Friday 19th of June 2009 04:39:10 AM
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Old 06-19-2009, 05:45 AM   #5
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RE: Cable Crimper

Thanks for the suggestions, but I think I may have found an even better, low cost solution.

http://www.harborfreight.com/cpi/cta...emnumber=66150

I realize Harbor Freight doesn't sell top-of-the-line tools, but for casual use .....

I can't walk through their stores without finding something I just have to have.* Talk about impulse buying!
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Old 06-19-2009, 06:13 AM   #6
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RE: Cable Crimper

Harbor Freight - the new Sears! At around $50, that hydraulic crimper looks like a pretty good deal. They have a retail outlet near me, which I avoid like the plague unless I have a written shopping list.
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Old 06-20-2009, 04:52 AM   #7
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RE: Cable Crimper

To get a "proper" (made both mechanically and electrically ) terminal end requires some concern.

We use Anchor wire and Anchor terminal ends and the Anchor brand crush tool.

IT will only release after sufficient force is used to "cold flow) the solder.

THE requirement for a good end.

Weather the Chinese Hyd unit has any such protection is open to inspection.

So I would dip any Chinese ends in a solder dunk, to be sure on the electric requirement .

FF
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Old 06-22-2009, 08:04 AM   #8
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RE: Cable Crimper

The anchor crimp tool makes the best connection, but its a pretty expensive tool. Online they sell for about $180.

FYI solder is a big ABYC no no on boats.
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Old 06-23-2009, 04:33 AM   #9
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RE: Cable Crimper

"FYI solder is a big ABYC no no on boats."

I understand their reluctance on starting cable , usually unfused, a starter can create enough heat to actually melt the solder and spray it out of the terminal end.


Not a hassle with well crimped ends as there should be little room for solder.

I think the ABYC fears builders that will use JUST solder for both the mechanical and electrical requirements .
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Old 06-23-2009, 07:36 AM   #10
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RE: Cable Crimper

Quote:
troy994719 wrote:
FYI solder is a big ABYC no no on boats.
ABYC Standards and Technical Information Reports for Small Craft
July 2008 -2009

E-11AC and DC Electrical Systems On Boats

11.14.5.7 Solder shall not be the sole means of mechanical connection in any circuit. If soldered, the connecton shall be so located or supported as to minimize flexing*of the conductor where the solder changes the flexible conductor into a solid conductor.

EXCEPTION:* Battery lugs with a solder contact length of not less than 1.5 times the diameter of the conductor.

I haven't received*my new standards manual yet, but I have not been informed that this has changed recently. Please refrain from giving advice based on ABYC standards if you are not familiar with them.
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Old 06-23-2009, 08:01 AM   #11
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Cable Crimper

Well hell, RickB... if you'd just answer the questions faster, none of us would ever need to come in here and make mistakes, except to ask you a question.

-- Edited by Keith on Tuesday 23rd of June 2009 08:02:16 AM
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Old 06-23-2009, 08:09 AM   #12
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RE: Cable Crimper

Solder or no solder aside ... FF mentioned an issue that I'm also struggling with - the starter cable.

Mine goes straight from the battery to the engine, unfused.* I "thought" it was supposed to run through the main battery switch first, but that's a long run and back with some heavy cable.* I've see drawings of both configurations.* Is it* a matter of convenience and/or preference?

I am trying to sort out the Frankenstein wiring on my boat that has been through at least 2 previous owners.
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Old 06-23-2009, 09:03 AM   #13
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Cable Crimper

*

*
My apologies, but Just reading that rule sure looks to me like they want you to stay away from soldering.
*

*
Are you referring to the main switch on your DC panel?
It should have a disconnect switch, if you have a starter hang you will not be able to shut it off. You would have a real mess by the time you got the battery cable disconnected!
If you have a run from the battery bank to the starter now it would be easy to add some kind of switch. Something like this BlueSea switch would be inexpensive, they also make one with a remote mount switch that you could put outside the engine room.

http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs...9&classNum=297
*
*


-- Edited by troy994719 on Tuesday 23rd of June 2009 09:12:23 AM
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Old 06-23-2009, 10:38 AM   #14
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RE: Cable Crimper

Quote:
troy994719 wrote:
My apologies, but Just reading that rule sure looks to me like they want you to stay away from soldering.
*
Are you referring to the main switch on your DC panel?
It should have a disconnect switch, if you have a starter hang you will not be able to shut it off. You would have a real mess by the time you got the battery cable disconnected!
I'm definitely staying away from solder, I'm going to depend on a good crimp.

Yes, the main switch on the DC panel.* The current set-up is a cable from 1 batt bank (+) straight to the engine.* There is also a pair of smaller cables going from the + to the switch.* They appear original and I'm guessing they used 2 small cables instead of 1 large one becuse that's what they had laying around.

The other batt bank (+) goes straight to the DC panel switch.

I'm still deciphering exactly what's what under the hood but it appears that the "Off-1-2-All" switch may be determining where the charge goes.* It does also shut everything down in the "Off" position.

Either 1, 2 or All on the switch will start the engine.* So I'm sort of scratching my head and saying, "Huh?"

Electricity mystifies me at the best of times.* Because of multiple rewirings, no color code discipline and multiple previous owners I spend a lot of time sitting and looking at stuff wondering, "WTF?".

*

*

*

*
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Old 06-23-2009, 12:22 PM   #15
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RE: Cable Crimper

Quote:
Keith wrote:

Well hell, RickB... if you'd just answer the questions faster, none of us would ever need to come in here and make mistakes, except to ask you a question.

-- Edited by Keith on Tuesday 23rd of June 2009 08:02:16 AM
If you don't want answers don't ask the questions. If you only want answers from certain people don't ask in public. If you don't want specific information don't read* answers that give references to source documents.

I* could care less if you want to play boat fixer in total ignorance, neither I nor any of my family will be on your boat so do what you want. The results are between your and your (or your guests) insurance company and lawyers.*

ABYC standards are not compulsary, they are advisory. You can do whatever you want. As an ABYC member, I would prefer that those who contribute advice or information they claim to be ABYC*"rules" at least know what the standards are.

*
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Old 06-23-2009, 03:50 PM   #16
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RE: Cable Crimper

You get so irritated so easily rickbee....
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Old 06-23-2009, 05:19 PM   #17
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RE: Cable Crimper

I only get irritated about things I care about.

But, as the old saying goes, I do not suffer fools gladly.*
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Old 06-24-2009, 03:49 AM   #18
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RE: Cable Crimper

"Just reading that rule sure looks to me like they want you to stay away from soldering."


"11.14.5.7 Solder shall not be the sole means of mechanical connection in any circuit. If soldered, the connecton shall be so located or supported as to minimize flexing of the conductor where the solder changes the flexible conductor into a solid conductor."

"I'm definitely staying away from solder, I'm going to depend on a good crimp.


READ the "rule" again ,

As stated they simply do not want solder to be the ONLY fastening to a terminal end.

Mechanically , AND electrically is required for a proper connection.

With out the proper tool ($$$) to assure cold flow , only solder can assure the electrical connection was made.

Either you spend the CA$H to do it right , or you do the best you can.

In our business of outfitting , most owners will not pay to rewire the entire vessel so the only choice is to take loose every wire , touch solder the usually crimped auto terminal ends and reinstall with star washers , and hope for the best.

And folks wonder why I don't usually love TT's.
House wire and auto crimps , and splices hidden behind overheads , is a start.

FF
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Old 06-24-2009, 06:45 AM   #19
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Cable Crimper

Please tell me your not going to get started on the TT and Mainship dream killer rant again!

-- Edited by troy994719 on Wednesday 24th of June 2009 06:55:11 AM
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Old 06-24-2009, 06:50 AM   #20
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RE: Cable Crimper

Quote:
troy994719 wrote:
Please tell me your not going to get started on the TT and Mainship dream killer rant again!
Let the kill-joys rant all they want about TT's.* I now have a fun, running and safe boat that cost me less than the cars most of my co-workers drive.*
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