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Old 01-21-2013, 06:22 AM   #21
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It's not a "no brainer". You use your brain to decide if it will help based on the conditions where you cruise and visibility while cruising.
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Old 01-21-2013, 09:29 AM   #22
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If I boated regularly on the Western Waterway system and the northern Gulf ICW, I think it's a great tool for spotting tows (and them spotting you) that are often hidden from radar by the twists and turns. Sometimes the radio traffic is confusing and you need to understand where the landmarks and mile markers are.

In our cruising all along the eastern seaboard, I decided it fell into the "nice to have" category, so it is on The List, but way down the rankings. I understand the desire to be better seen by the big guys, but in our case we present a very good radar target, certainly not true of a lot of boats out there, even equipped with most reflectors.
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Old 01-21-2013, 09:55 AM   #23
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The ability for search and rescue to have last known position less than 5 minutes old is huge too. Push the DSC button and the world knows you're in trouble.
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Old 01-21-2013, 10:19 AM   #24
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This is a similar discussion to 50 years ago for seat belts in cars, 30 years ago for motorcycle helmets, 20 years ago for safe sex, 10 years ago for packing a firearm and today for gun control. Safety is sometimes hard to grasp.
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Old 01-21-2013, 10:48 AM   #25
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Yeah. It can be very handy as well. My friends and family follow me when I'm out. If I were running late they can check in on my position. I can observe and know the intent of vessels around me. I can make contact with a touch of a button through DSC. I don't have to guess how fast that ferry is moving or what our intercept will be. It's a black box solution. You install it and forget about it.
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Old 01-21-2013, 11:12 AM   #26
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When we buy a new VHF it will also have AIS, but right now I ma to cheap and we do not leave the dock that often, certainly not in conditions it would be needed as we have radar. However until I become UN cheap we use http://www.marinetraffic.com/ais/ which is free on the web world wide. In the Everett AIS shows the two Mukilteo ferries, two commercial tugs both at dock, and one pleasure boat at dock. It also shows their name, speed and heading, a general description of the vessel and predicted course and range. However it does not show the hundred or so small pleasure boats out there fishing.

Most if not all of the larger commercial ships/ferries/trawler/charters are required to have AIS and those are what I worry about the most. Most large vessels stay with in the shipping lanes and ferries have a specific route. Anyway its on the want list, maybe next year it might be moved to the MUST HAVE list.

So the question is since I can see them will it make much of a difference if they can see me? I think NOT being large commercial vessels its difficult to change course and speed, and what about the hundred os smaller pleasure boats. Very few pleasure boats in the Puget Sound have AIS which are pink on color which is my favority color.

Anyway check out your area to see how many and what kind of vessels have AIS?
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Old 01-21-2013, 01:19 PM   #27
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This is a similar discussion to 50 years ago for seat belts in cars, 30 years ago for motorcycle helmets, 20 years ago for safe sex, 10 years ago for packing a firearm and today for gun control. Safety is sometimes hard to grasp.
I would like to see your explanation for comparing AIS to gun control.
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Old 01-21-2013, 03:28 PM   #28
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This is a similar discussion to 50 years ago for seat belts in cars, 30 years ago for motorcycle helmets, 20 years ago for safe sex, 10 years ago for packing a firearm and today for gun control. Safety is sometimes hard to grasp.
If seat belts only worked for about 10 percent or less of the crashes (or any of the other safety deviced you mentioned) I doubt they would be mandated.

I've just traveled 800 miles from Jersey to Savannah and I would say that less than 1 percent of the traffic I encountered was required to have AIS.....now if it was mandatory for not only every vessel out there...AND every hazard had an AIS instead of a small plastic buoy or nothing marking it...your argument would BEGIN to make sense.

A Radar right now is at least 10 times more effective (and based on my travels) more than 99 times effective in reducing my chances of collision.

Should RADAR be mandatory on all vessels?
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Old 01-21-2013, 05:00 PM   #29
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A Radar right now is at least 10 times more effective (and based on my travels) more than 99 times effective in reducing my chances of collision.
Just imagine how effective they would be if you had two radars!
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Old 01-21-2013, 05:47 PM   #30
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Just imagine how effective they would be if you had two radars!
That may have just opened Pandora's box for some....half won't see how your comment fits and the other half won't get what you mean.....

glad it's happy hour!
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Old 01-21-2013, 05:50 PM   #31
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This is a similar discussion to 50 years ago for seat belts in cars, 30 years ago for motorcycle helmets, 20 years ago for safe sex, 10 years ago for packing a firearm and today for gun control. Safety is sometimes hard to grasp.
Nice thought however that is far from what I am seeing these days.

Distractions from a proper look out is what I am seeing and dealing with. Guys spending way too much time on "toys" in the wheel house in ristricted visability.

And

NOT LOOKING OUT THE DAYUM WINDOW !


Just sayin.
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Old 01-21-2013, 05:55 PM   #32
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This is a similar discussion to 50 years ago for seat belts in cars, 30 years ago for motorcycle helmets, 20 years ago for safe sex, 10 years ago for packing a firearm and today for gun control. Safety is sometimes hard to grasp.
Actually...safety is easy to grasp...
Risk management is the more difficult for some...usually the ones stuck on the principle "safety at all costs"....
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Old 01-21-2013, 06:17 PM   #33
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That may have just opened Pandora's box for some....half won't see how your comment fits and the other half won't get what you mean.....

glad it's happy hour!
That is exactly the reason I have a basck up radar on the wnt list, but broad band short range for more detail. It will be moved from the want list to the MUST have list the same time AIS is. One for long rang eand the other for short range better detail. The same reason we hae two depth one set at 150+ ft and the other a fish finder for more detail under 150 ft.
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Old 01-21-2013, 06:22 PM   #34
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The first quote was actually mine......and no I couldn't see that traffic as they didn't have AIS which is what I pointed out...the big guys had them on Radar and were playing controller....

But if I had RADAR...I could have been watching them all and enjoying my beer and sandwich with my feet up....
geezzz....just put the auto pilot on and enjoy your beer no need for radar.
A couple of years ago a nice 55 footer on the wayt to Catalina island was on auto pilot but the designated watchman decided to go join the party on board and the vessel smacked into the cliffs there at hig speed. ais ounldnt have done them much good either.
If i had the money i would buy one of those 19 inch screened chartplotters that allow you to dispaly radar, weather systems, chart, as over lays. The display alone is like $5000 then the other goodies but whenb you get down to it isnt the enhanced safety worth spending the money on?
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Old 01-21-2013, 06:24 PM   #35
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so what i am getting from your posts is that most of the hazards out there don't have ais so maybe for now the $200 would be better spent on other more important items?
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Old 01-21-2013, 06:30 PM   #36
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Most "hazards" don't, but every commercial container ship, aircraft carrier, and barge being towed around does. It's your $200, spend it on your wishes.
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Old 01-21-2013, 06:36 PM   #37
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geezzz....just put the auto pilot on and enjoy your beer no need for radar.
A couple of years ago a nice 55 footer on the wayt to Catalina island was on auto pilot but the designated watchman decided to go join the party on board and the vessel smacked into the cliffs there at hig speed. ais ounldnt have done them much good either.
If i had the money i would buy one of those 19 inch screened chartplotters that allow you to dispaly radar, weather systems, chart, as over lays. The display alone is like $5000 then the other goodies but whenb you get down to it isnt the enhanced safety worth spending the money on?
Safety/Risk Management is a mindset from a way of doing things/practicing/training...NOT material objects (which are just tools).

You can do a boatload of cruising without a lot of electronics. Now if you are the type who will push on after dark or in bad weather...sure...those electronics are the difference between it being too work like and recreational fun boating....safety/risk management is more how you apply having those tools combines with your skill set and a bunch of other variables to make the voyage more (for lack of a better word) SAFE.

I just went 800 miles, Jersey to Georgia, winter cruising with a cheap laptop, free charts, a 15 year old Furuno chartplotter/fishfinder (no charts) that was given to me, and all I had to do was buy the $29 GPS antenna for the laptop and a $99 transducer for the sounder. I hardly even look at the stuff as it doesn't tell me much more than what the chartbook would or even easier...SEEING THE MARKS WITH BINOCULARS!!!!

Again...travel at night, bad weather or even in a faster boat and those electronics do make it nicer....but for most cruising...they don't make it safer because the weak link is still attached to the helm.
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Old 01-21-2013, 06:39 PM   #38
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Most "hazards" don't, but every commercial container ship, aircraft carrier, and barge being towed around does. It's your $200, spend it on your wishes.
absolutely false....I had to dodge numerous tug/barge combos on the Chesapeake that did NOT have AIS...and for dodging those other guys...stay out of the shipping channels for the most part and they aren't much to worry about then....but there are thousands more that will ruin your day that just don't and probably never will have it.
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Old 01-21-2013, 06:53 PM   #39
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Safety/Risk Management is a mindset from a way of doing things/practicing/training...NOT material objects (which are just tools).


I just went 800 miles, Jersey to Georgia, winter cruising with a cheap laptop, free charts, a 15 year old Furuno chartplotter/fishfinder (no charts) that was given to me, and all I had to do was buy the $29 GPS antenna for the laptop and a $99 transducer for the sounder. I hardly even look at the stuff as it doesn't tell me much more than what the chartbook would or even easier...SEEING THE MARKS WITH BINOCULARS!!!!

Again...travel at night, bad weather or even in a faster boat and those electronics do make it nicer....but for most cruising...they don't make it safer because the weak link is still attached to the helm.

..........your absolutely right. Free charts?? Where do you get those?I'm one of those that loves the electronic gadgets but i also like simplcity. There is a free application for your smart phone that will do the gps tracking, My Tracks, anywhere and it then downloads the charts when you reenter cell phone areas. But i still find it useful to find my way home in the fog ro when hiking and get turned around. I saw a demonstration by an avid sound boater that uses nothing but his cell phone and the $15 navionics app with there charts. You still must purchase the charts but they are also cheap like 10-15 dollars. I don't have much radar experiance and none with the new systems but it seems to me like they are still a bit iffy and can miss object close to you so there is no substitute for the ol eyeball. I guess with a trawler you are always going snail speed so speed isnt a factor
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Old 01-21-2013, 07:01 PM   #40
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you get the charts and other important pubs from here...
Nautical Charts & Pubs

this is the name of the free charting software...google it to find it's home...

OpenCpn
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