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Old 08-17-2012, 07:54 AM   #1
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What Caulk to Use?

We are painting and re-gel-coating parts of Hobo. In the process, all of the exterior hardware including port-hole o-rings, railings, swim platform brackets, hatches, mast base, dinghy chalks, etc, will be removed (pilot house windows and doors no) When I put things back, what caulk (s) is recommended? How about UV resistance? We have used 3M 4000 UV with poor results. I know not to use 5200. Everything is gasket-ed so I am looking more for a sealant than adhesive. SikaFlex has a good following but I haven't been able to determine which one (s) would be applicable. With the exception of the swim platform brackets, everything is above the water line. So which ones would you use and have had good experience with?
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Old 08-17-2012, 08:02 AM   #2
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I like Boatlife polysulfide for mounting stuff. Been around and used successfully since WWII. I still haven't found anything white that stands up well to UV. That 4000 UV turned to powder after a couple of years here on the Gulf Coast.
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Old 08-17-2012, 08:38 AM   #3
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Greetings,
Mr. Larry M. As a result of my recent "un bedding (UGH) and rebedding" of a hatch, I would be VERY adverse to using anything but Dolphenite (sp). NOT adhesive, flexible, user friendly and CAN EASILY BE REMOVED/REPLACED IN THE FUTURE!!!!!
Sorry, still cursing damn PO for using caulk....
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Old 08-17-2012, 12:55 PM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Larry M View Post
We are painting and re-gel-coating parts of Hobo. In the process, all of the exterior hardware including port-hole o-rings, railings, swim platform brackets, hatches, mast base, dinghy chalks, etc, will be removed (pilot house windows and doors no) When I put things back, what caulk (s) is recommended? How about UV resistance? We have used 3M 4000 UV with poor results. I know not to use 5200. Everything is gasket-ed so I am looking more for a sealant than adhesive. SikaFlex has a good following but I haven't been able to determine which one (s) would be applicable. With the exception of the swim platform brackets, everything is above the water line. So which ones would you use and have had good experience with?
Exactly what were your poor results with 3M 4000 UV?

Why not 3M 4200 ? It's pretty popular for that use.
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Old 08-17-2012, 01:37 PM   #5
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On the recommendation of the experienced shipwrights on the GB owners forum we use Dolfinite for bedding that does not require any adhesive properties and Sikaflex for bedding that does.

The only thing to watch out for with Dolfinite is that it will dry out when exposed to air. So, for example, while we used it to bed the window frames on our boat, after the frame is installed and the Dolfinite has "cured" to a certain extent we run a faired seam of Polyseamseal around the edge of the joint where the frame meets the cabin side. The Poyseamseal prevents the Dolfinite from drying out from the exposed edge in.

We have started on a long-term project of removing the teak grabrails from the boat in pairs, taking them home, stripping them, and refinishing them properly. We are reinstalling them using Sikaflex because we want some adhesion in the bedding.

We have used 3M 4200 with success before we switched to Sikaflex and based on our experience I would not hesitate to recommend it if someone for some reason didn't want to use Sikaflex. I use black Lifecaulk on the tips of the deck screws I reseat but other than that I haven't been impressed with the product, at least as far as deck seams are concerned. Their bedding products may be fine but since we've had outstanding success with Sikaflex we've had no reason to try them.
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Old 08-17-2012, 02:07 PM   #6
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I am down to three:

3M 5200 Applications I do not want to come apart of plan on taking apart.
3M 4200 - Applications I plan on taking apart.
Boatlife - Teak Deck For the teak decks.

The other is Epoxy for things I defiantly do not want to come apart and do not intend to take a part.

Every year on the gunnel and rub rail, even the 5200 has failed, so now I first epoxy with 5200 over. Around the salon windows I epoxied so moisture/water could not get/seep in, and used 4200 to set the windows.
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Old 08-17-2012, 02:41 PM   #7
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Quote:
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...I still haven't found anything white that stands up well to UV. That 4000 UV turned to powder after a couple of years here on the Gulf Coast.
I also have had poor results with the 3M 4000 UV. It doesn't hold up in the tropics. The caulk in the picture is less than 3 years old.
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Old 08-17-2012, 02:46 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by RT Firefly View Post
Greetings,
Mr. Larry M. As a result of my recent "un bedding (UGH) and rebedding" of a hatch, I would be VERY adverse to using anything but Dolphenite (sp). NOT adhesive, flexible, user friendly and CAN EASILY BE REMOVED/REPLACED IN THE FUTURE!!!!!
Sorry, still cursing damn PO for using caulk....
RT and Marin: I agree on the Dolfinite for windows and hatches but I'm not sure about things that flex like stanchion bases. I think I'm looking for something that some elasticity to it maybe?
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Old 08-17-2012, 02:48 PM   #9
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I would not use Dolfinite to bed stanchion bases. I would use Sikaflex for that.
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Old 08-17-2012, 02:50 PM   #10
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[QUOTE=Marin;99215]... We are reinstalling them using Sikaflex because we want some adhesion in the bedding...[QUOTE]

Marin: What number Sikaflex are you using?
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Old 08-17-2012, 03:52 PM   #11
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Beats the hell out of me. It's the only one Fisheries Supply stocks on the shelf. The number 291 comes to mind but I could be misremembering that. I just bought a new tube last week for bedding the forecabin top grabrails but I just picked the tube off the shelf and didn't look at the label other than to make sure it said Sikaflex and Black.
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Old 08-17-2012, 04:49 PM   #12
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I've been re-bedding with butyl tape and am happy with the results. It's flexible and easily removable.
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Old 08-17-2012, 05:54 PM   #13
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Beats the hell out of me. It's the only one Fisheries Supply stocks on the shelf. The number 291 comes to mind but I could be misremembering that...
Marin: I found the Sikaflex guide and it sounds like it is the 291. The Sikaflex guide says for bedding SS fittings to use Sikaflex 205 cleaner then use the 210-T primer. From the GB forum and what you have done in the past, is everyone really using the primer and/or cleaner? We only want to do this once.

http://www.bluemoment.com/downloads/...nehandbook.pdf
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Old 08-17-2012, 06:32 PM   #14
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I've never seen any reference to using the cleaner on the GB forum but that doesn't mean people aren't using it. I will pose your question to the GB folks and see what they say and let you know.
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Old 08-17-2012, 07:43 PM   #15
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I'm using more Dolfinite now.I bedded in a plywood platform on the bow about
1 1/4" x 18" x 22". Put on plenty of Dolfinite and started turning the bolt nuts like the head studs on an engine. Tighter and tighter. There were quite a few holes from bolts in the past. I figured that would be OK. But I thought the Dolfinite was going to set up much more than it did. Months and months later every time the sun warmed up the deck more and more tan Dolfinite goo would ooze out and fall down on the bunk. Had many Dolfinite droppings on our bedding. I should probably take it up, plug the holes and re-install. I'll use the dolfinite though and taking up the plate wo'nt be much of a problem.... because I used Dolfinite. I did make a nice fat bead of 291 Sikaflex all around the base.
I plan on using some Boatlife as I hear it works better than most on teak. Frequently I use Boatlife in the very small tubes just because it comes in the small tubes and numerous sealing jobs only require a very small amount.
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Old 08-17-2012, 07:47 PM   #16
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Dolfinite doesn't cure in the same sense that stuff like Sikaflex, 3M, etc, do. It will dry out over time if air gets to it. But I'm not suprised at the experience you had, Eric. That's kind of what Dolfinite does. Next time, don't give it a way to escape.

On the plus side, if you bed a window frame in Dolfinite and ten years later have to remove that frame to replace a broken pain or deteriorated track, the frame will come right off with no strain or forcing or risk of breaking the frame if it's wood or bending it if it's metal. Which is why we use it for these kinds of applications.
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Old 08-17-2012, 08:16 PM   #17
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From the GB forum and what you have done in the past, is everyone really using the primer and/or cleaner? We only want to do this once.

http://www.bluemoment.com/downloads/...nehandbook.pdf
Here is an answer to your question from Bob Lowe, founder of the GB owners forum and probably one of the most experienced shipwrights and yard owners around.

"If you want it [Sikaflex] to stick to the surfaces then the cleaner and primer will help. However when I want to achieve this I just coat the surfaces with CPES. Works great."
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Old 08-18-2012, 06:45 AM   #18
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Eveey thing on a boat needs rebedding in time ,DOLPHINITE.

If the stanchon bases wiggle , reinforce them , or the deck or install proper blocking.

What doesnt get rebedded often enough will leak, the big reason for punky decks and PH on so many TT.
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Old 08-18-2012, 07:15 AM   #19
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I've been re-bedding with butyl tape and am happy with the results. It's flexible and easily removable.
I hadn't thought of the butyl tape and for some of our hardware I can see where it would be a good application. Compass Marine does a nice little write up. Thanks.
http://www.pbase.com/mainecruising/rebedding_hardware
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Old 08-18-2012, 07:56 AM   #20
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Eveey thing on a boat needs rebedding in time ,DOLPHINITE.

If the stanchon bases wiggle , reinforce them , or the deck or install proper blocking.

What doesnt get rebedded often enough will leak, the big reason for punky decks and PH on so many TT.
I don't have enough guts or believe Dolfinte should be used on everything. I will still use a polyurethane type caulk maybe some butyl tape where I want some adhesion and a sealant.
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