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Old 06-04-2015, 07:06 PM   #41
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Originally Posted by MurrayM View Post
Our boat is waaaay further down the Cetol disintegration path as it sat for years in the open before being sold.

Our first priorities were working on and upgrading the engine, battery system, etc, and have now started to chip away at the exterior woodwork as weather and house renovations permit.

Still deciding on letting it go silver (Badger does have 'workboat' heritage after all) or maybe pure tung oil. At the pace I'm going, it'll be a next year decision anyways!

As you can see from the last photo, the PO's weren't too careful with their masking tape application...
In post #7, the second piicture, is this ready for the Cetol application? I have the whole boat to do this fall and I need to know where to stop the prep.
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Old 06-04-2015, 07:52 PM   #42
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Greetings,
Mr. HW. Re: pic' #2. My opinion only...For simple sealing purposes only, with less regard to final appearance, yes that surface is ready. For a more appealing final appearance nope it's not. The method I would use is scrape the surface, with a very sharp scraper to "fresh" wood, sand and then start your coating process. (There's a thread somewhere dealing with scraping but good luck with ME remembering where it is). If you overcoat as in pic' #2 you will most definitely see the graying through the finish.
I have found scraping to be much more efficient and quicker that simply sanding. A very sharp scraper minimizes sanding.
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Old 06-04-2015, 08:32 PM   #43
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Scraping and a heat gun work wonders. Almost like magic but not quite.
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Old 06-04-2015, 09:06 PM   #44
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Marty,
I've not used acetone on my teak. Not had any problems w adhesion either.

Quite a few raves for Cetol but I still don't know what the stuff is.

One thing that can be said for it is that my paint store stocks it but more significantly Alaskans use lots and lots of Cetol. Very popular. I've tried just about everything else though.
SIKKENS CETOL:

From the MSDS sheet; Section #3 ( Composition/Information on ingredients ).

Appears to be Linseed Oil with a proprietary combination of vehicles, driers etc....etc.

If you don't have a full time deck hand to worry about the varnish, then this stuff and others like it, moves up on the list of things to stock which will more readily enable you a few more minutes to enjoy life. After all, when the time runs out.......that's it.
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Old 06-04-2015, 11:13 PM   #45
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Right rudder,
Raw Linseed oil and turpentine is primarily what I used to mix my own oil finish. I also included a little spar varnish and Japan Drier. I think there's something else but I can't remember what. A time or two I used some Penetrol. Outside of Alaska boiled Linseed oil would probably work better. My rails were a little sticky but I was always able to sit on the rail and get up w clean and dry pants. After a fresh coat water would bead up .. Big Time.

If you used 1/3 Tung oil, 1/3 Turpentine and 1/3 spar varnish w a little drier you'd have a very high oil coating. Don't know if it would "dry" though. Dayly's Sea Fin Teak Oil and Sikken's may be related. I always thought the secret to an easily maintained clear finish was to create no "build". Sea Fin does have build and requires basically the same treatment as varnish IMO. alkyds is the base of most oil based paints. It was said earlier that Sikkins had alkyds in it so I'm think'in Sikken's is probably a medium high oil, Linseed oil and alkyd resin finish. Sikkins is probably closer to a paint than traditional varnishes. The mystery ingredient probably gives it it's foggy orange look and they probably found a substitute for the "orange" ingredient and launched their new "clear" coatings. But if they continue the Orange product it may indicate the Orange substitute isn't as good as the "orange".
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Old 06-05-2015, 12:32 AM   #46
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Quote:
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In post #7, the second piicture, is this ready for the Cetol application?
Nope...just before and after photo's showing how bad it was and what it looked like right after the Cetol was removed.
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Old 06-05-2015, 01:30 AM   #47
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10 Coats of anything is too much for me! What's the drawbacks of just oiling the teak wood? Every few mos or so just wipe it down with an oil soaked rag.
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Old 06-05-2015, 07:12 AM   #48
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Greetings,
Mr. HW. Re: pic' #2. My opinion only...For simple sealing purposes only, with less regard to final appearance, yes that surface is ready. For a more appealing final appearance nope it's not. The method I would use is scrape the surface, with a very sharp scraper to "fresh" wood, sand and then start your coating process. (There's a thread somewhere dealing with scraping but good luck with ME remembering where it is). If you overcoat as in pic' #2 you will most definitely see the graying through the finish.
I have found scraping to be much more efficient and quicker that simply sanding. A very sharp scraper minimizes sanding.

I agree. Keep cleaning/scraping. You're almost there so don't stop now.
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Old 06-05-2015, 07:55 AM   #49
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10 Coats of anything is too much for me! What's the drawbacks of just oiling the teak wood? Every few mos or so just wipe it down with an oil soaked rag.

It gets dirty and moldy. Your be better if just keeping it clean and unfinished.
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Old 06-05-2015, 10:54 AM   #50
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10 Coats of anything is too much for me! What's the drawbacks of just oiling the teak wood? Every few mos or so just wipe it down with an oil soaked rag.
I tried that for awhile. The first two weeks looks beautiful and then starts going down hill. After two months it is dirty and black and you start all over again. I got tired of it after about three cycles and went the 7 coats of Cetol route and haven't looked back.
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Old 06-05-2015, 11:39 AM   #51
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I tried that for awhile. The first two weeks looks beautiful and then starts going down hill. After two months it is dirty and black and you start all over again. I got tired of it after about three cycles and went the 7 coats of Cetol route and haven't looked back.
Ready,
Can you elaborate on "dirty and black". Do you mean the wood just darkened due to the oil? What type of oil did you use? Where is your boat kept, climate? After the oil did the Cetol adhere properly? How did you prep for Cetol after the wood being oiled?
Thanks for your help.
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Old 06-05-2015, 11:57 AM   #52
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Thanks, thats what I thought. Im used to 2 part teak cleaners for small bits of trim. My Monk is a whole lot more! Going the Cetol Natural teak and Gloss route.
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Old 06-05-2015, 12:28 PM   #53
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10 Coats of anything is too much for me! What's the drawbacks of just oiling the teak wood? Every few mos or so just wipe it down with an oil soaked rag.
Here's how mine looked w my own mixed oil. The deck plate w the cleats is w spar varnish but the cap rails are in oil. Mostly linseed oil and turpentine. Recoated every 6 weeks or so w a brush. Was a bit sticky as it never did really dry. Probably in California it would be objectionably sticky w the hot sun. I never did try the rag app but I did get dirty runs that I didn't bother to clean up. Dosn't turn or anything like that if you keep at it and my brush app took very little time but then I didn't clean up the drips. Also others may have gone black from lack of turpentine. I mixed my oil w turp because it's a natural fungicide. One could add other fungicides as well and perhaps zinc of some sort. Maybe w a rag one could apply much thinner coats that may work better.

Re the "dirty and black" here's an extreme example of it. (2nd pic) Lots of oil and then 2.5 years of neglect. But as you can see my wife just takes it off.
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Old 06-05-2015, 01:04 PM   #54
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Ready,
Can you elaborate on "dirty and black". Do you mean the wood just darkened due to the oil? What type of oil did you use? Where is your boat kept, climate? After the oil did the Cetol adhere properly? How did you prep for Cetol after the wood being oiled?
Thanks for your help.
We are in the Florida Keys.

The oil we used is Amazon Golden Teak Oil. There was some on the boat when I got it. I used it and then bought some more. It looks great when first applied but then gets dirty and black as time goes on. The black looks like mold of some kind. It is the same black you see on every boat with teak that has been neglected. I would clean it with a soft brush and a bucket of water with ammonia added to it. Rinse it and then let it dry before applying the teak oil. The other problem with oil is that it feels tacky, which probably facilitates atracting dirt and dust.

People told me that since I had been oiling the teak that varnish or anything else for that matter would not adhere to the teak. But I just cleaned it like I normally would only I did it twice and then cleaned it really good with acetone. It has been a couple of years now and it still looks great.

It took me a week of cleaning, scraping, sanding, and taping to get it ready. The next week I spent about two hours a day laying a coat of Cetol every morning. The first two coats were Natural Teak the last five were Clear Gloss. I did a light sanding in between every other coat. I want it to look nice but it is not a show boat. We were very happy with the way it turned out. Beautiful brightwork adds so much to a boat. I cannot stand to see new boats today with no brightwork.

When doing the brightwork the worst part is the sanding and that I think is why so many people do not want to do it. I found that with a heat gut and a good scraper it really cuts down on the sanding and actually gives you a better job as you are only removing the old coating and not any wood. When you have done everything you can with the scraper then you break out the sandpaper.

As always the above is only my opinion and experience.

This is a link to a couple of blog posts about refinishing our brightwork.

Living Aboard MV Walkabout: October 2013
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Old 06-05-2015, 03:34 PM   #55
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READY2GO,
Tung oil .. Linseed oil ect is fungus food.
Need to maintain an anti-fungus program using oil.
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Old 06-05-2015, 04:10 PM   #56
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A caution on linseed oil. A rag soaked in linseed oil can smolder and self ignite. Dont let used rags lay around.
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Old 06-05-2015, 06:11 PM   #57
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What I have read, tung does not mildew but linseed will.
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Old 06-05-2015, 06:41 PM   #58
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Psneeld,
I think they are both equally prone to grow black mould but Alaskans disagree. They frequently say tung oil dosn't work and turns black. Never heard any coments up there about Linseed oil.

High Wire,
Seems I got lucky. So the natural oils grow black mould and fire?
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Old 06-05-2015, 06:50 PM   #59
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Here is just one of many sources I have read that says pure tung does not mildew.....

https://www.canadianwoodworking.com/...ebunking-myths




The comparison is to boiled linseed oil
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Old 06-05-2015, 07:02 PM   #60
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OK so someomne else says it dosn't mildew. Do you actually think Tung oil dosn't mildew?

I see the comparison you present uses boiled linseed oil. I've never heard of boiled Tung oil. I don't know why. Do you? I've never used boiled LO .. always "raw". And the fungus likes the raw LO just fine.

There was an extensive thread on oil finishes some time ago and finishes were presented that I think were nothing but Tung oil. Not likely that would be possible if the Tung oil turned black from fungus like linseed oil does. So what you and your references say is probably true. Dosn't seem likely though. I have a quart of Tung oil and I use it as an additive.
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