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Old 08-28-2015, 12:47 PM   #1
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Sea Hawk Paint Execs Go To Prison For Selling TBT Paint

Although this story apparently broke last December, I only heard about it recently.

A marine coatings company and two executives who pleaded guilty in October to willfully conspiring to obstruct the Environmental Protection Agency by selling a known pesticide were fined more than $1 million and sentenced to prison time.

Sea Hawk Paints executives get prison terms in banned-coating case | Trade Only Today
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Old 08-28-2015, 01:09 PM   #2
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Wow, that's news to me too. Always been happy with their CuKote products and customer service. Never used the Biocop stuff referenced in the case. Will be interesting to see if they survive.
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Old 08-28-2015, 01:41 PM   #3
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Will be interesting to see if they survive.
I use to play softball on a team that regularly played against the team at a minimum security federal penitentiary. That place was like a college campus for white collar criminals- coed population, cells that were more like dorm rooms than anything else, TVs, gym etc., etc. I'm sure these guys will get similar treatment.
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Old 08-28-2015, 05:03 PM   #4
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From all that appears, they knowingly violated and tried to cover it up. To me, it's very clear cut. While one may think the product wasn't really dangerous, next time it might be. I would also never buy a product they manufactured. What will they do next time?

As to white-collar prison, I'm sure they'll get that. It's still prison though. You're still removed from family and friends and home and you lose the chance to do whatever you would have in that time period. For them, the imprisonment is really just the loss of freedom and they will be required to do some things and live in conditions they probably never have.
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Old 08-28-2015, 05:23 PM   #5
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Kinda like being in the military and deploying but without being shot at...some prison....
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Old 08-28-2015, 06:39 PM   #6
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Like everything it's not so much the crime but the coverup that does them in. Umm Hill?
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Old 08-29-2015, 08:39 AM   #7
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Like everything it's not so much the crime but the coverup that does them in. Umm Hill?
The idea of prison is to deprive one of his freedom. Yes, the minimum security prisons are somewhat like a college dorm and there are recreational opportunities in spare time but prison work is ordinarily required during the work week. How do I know? I used to visit a cousin who spent 5 years at the minimum security prison near Williamsport, PA. Being in any prison, even a minimum, is not fun. The rules are strict and the prisoner cannot go home at night. The idea that these places are some sort of country club is wholly erroneus.
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Old 08-29-2015, 08:54 AM   #8
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Try boot camp.....then deployment....

We used to call the "Wind Class" icebreakers the "Prison Class" because federal prisoners were guaranteed more personal space and being imprisoned closer to their family than the accommodations on those WWII Era ships and the fact you were in the Arctic or Antarctic and got one 10 minute radio patch home a week. Yep those tough rules sure are punishment.

Removal of freedom when there may be a big bank account when you get out has to be divided by years served by dollars left.

When it equals more that what you can earn as the average taxpayer does in that time..hardly tough punishment..
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Old 08-29-2015, 09:09 AM   #9
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Try boot camp.....then deployment....

We used to call the "Wind Class" icebreakers the "Prison Class" because federal prisoners were guaranteed more personal space and being imprisoned closer to their family than the accommodations on those WWII Era ships and the fact you were in the Arctic or Antarctic and got one 10 minute radio patch home a week. Yep those tough rules sure are punishment.

Removal of freedom when there may be a big bank account when you get out has to be divided by years served by dollars left.

When it equals more that what you can earn as the average taxpayer does in that time..hardly tough punishment..
Perhaps there is big bank accout, perhaps not. Perhaps the ill-gotten gains will be forfeited under the RICO provisions. One would hope. If not, we are stuck accepting the fact the prison time is dictated by sentencing guidelines which take into consideration many facts including mitigating factors. I would think there are no mitigating factors in this case. The good thing about Federal prisons is that there is no parole. A Federal prisoner will typically serve at least 11 months for each year of a sentence, if he is a good boy. In my cousin's case, home was 5 hours away. In five years, I visited 3 times, his mother about the same. No one else visited. Prison, any prison, is not fun and, even it were close to home thus facilitating visitations, it's a prison!
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Old 08-29-2015, 09:24 AM   #10
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If a proper conviction and sentence...lets hope so.
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Old 08-29-2015, 11:16 AM   #11
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In this day and age of constant state and federal budget cuts what's the point of paying for people like that to go to "prison" ?

Oh wait, I know, it's because prisons are more and more becoming privatized and in order to keep them in business we need to create customers for there services.

I think we would better served as a society if non-violent criminals where made to pay fines and do long term civic service. Instead of in many cases costing us substantial amounts of money to house them while getting little or nothing in return.
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Old 08-29-2015, 01:02 PM   #12
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In this day and age of constant state and federal budget cuts what's the point of paying for people like that to go to "prison" ?

Oh wait, I know, it's because prisons are more and more becoming privatized and in order to keep them in business we need to create customers for there services.

I think we would better served as a society if non-violent criminals where made to pay fines and do long term civic service. Instead of in many cases costing us substantial amounts of money to house them while getting little or nothing in return.
Very good point and that's why many favor house arrest. However, I do think prison does somewhat serve as a deterrent to white collar criminals, probably most so than the general population. However, I also believe in fines, believe in community service. And I would sentence them to brief prison terms, but I'd require them to pay all those costs.
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Old 08-29-2015, 01:58 PM   #13
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Goldman-Sachs...
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Old 08-29-2015, 02:15 PM   #14
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CuKote was the best ablative bottom paint I have ever used. It would outlast anything without fouling. Great stuff.
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Old 08-31-2015, 01:29 PM   #15
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Just waitng to see what consequences there are for the EPA honchos regarding the Gold King/Animas River fiasco. Wait - that's different - kinda like Goldman-Sachs.
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Old 08-31-2015, 02:47 PM   #16
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Just waitng to see what consequences there are for the EPA honchos regarding the Gold King/Animas River fiasco. Wait - that's different - kinda like Goldman-Sachs.
It may take a while for the dust to settle on that. Often full consequences aren't really known for a couple of years. First priority is dealing with the fiasco, second is assigning fault. The fact it was within a government agency does definitely complicated it.

I once saw a case of a habitual polluter where chemicals were reaching the source of water for several communities. Everyone was furious nothing was being done to the owner. Well, they needed his help in cleaning it up. They needed to know everything that had contaminated the water. And they needed his company's manpower. He also knew his level of help might play a role in his punishment. Still 2 1/2 years later formal charges were filed and a plea agreement reached. The agreement said no prison time (5 years suspended) but the judge refused to accept that and assigned him 6 months minimum prison time (refused to suspend all five years).

I know companies charged with clean ups of sites from damage 25 years earlier before there were standards. One thing to know too is if you buy a company or facility, their past sins do come along with them, they attach to the property regardless of legal entity.
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Old 08-31-2015, 03:03 PM   #17
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Just waitng to see what consequences there are for the EPA honchos regarding the Gold King/Animas River fiasco. Wait - that's different - kinda like Goldman-Sachs.
No, not like Goldman-Sachs or Sea Hawk, for that matter. The EPA didn't intentionally screw the American people or the environment.
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Old 08-31-2015, 03:35 PM   #18
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First, they did it - see how far "I didn't intend to" gets you with the Feds/State environmental regulators.

Second - failure to notify - > 24 hours after they knew about the release, they still had notified nobody. Try that as a civilian.

Third - > 3 weeks following the incident, EPA finally releases documents (late on a Friday afternoon, of course) related to the incident - all heavily redacted - redacted ? Redactions are used for active criminal investigations or matters affecting national security - here, cause they're feds, it's pure CYA.

If you're part of the annointed class - "mistakes were made". If not - off with their heads.

As to the "country club prisons" - maybe that's the way it is on the west coast, but I would not recommend a stay in the more normal, minimum security facilities here in the interior - they don't operate that way.

Ankle bracelets, home/work confinement, and damn well work off the fines +. While paying for their own food, lodging, and medical care.

psneed - used the same terminology for the old "fleet" diesel submarines - no jurisdiction in the western world would have issued a Certificate of Occupancy - even in the 60s.
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