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Old 06-07-2018, 09:10 AM   #1
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Replacing older Rule 2500 Bilge pump - with Rule 2000 or 3700/4000?

I have three bilge pumps (forward/mid/aft) on my Grand Banks 36 (wood - 1970). The mid pump died - a Rule 2500. My replacement choices are a Rule 2000 or a Rule 3700 (or might as well a Rule 4000). The amp draw on the 3700/4000 is so much higher which is my main concern (15.5 amps). Any thoughts or suggestions?
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Old 06-07-2018, 09:19 AM   #2
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Replace it with the largest Rule pump that uses the same size discharge hose.
If you pumps running your last problem will be amp draw.

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Old 06-07-2018, 09:36 AM   #3
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Just make sure that the wiring will support the larger pump. You can lookup the wiring size required on Blue Seas web site. Just measure the distance to the pump and back to ground. They have a chart that will tell you what size wire is needed based on the distance and amp draw of the new pump. Also check that the circuit breaker is sized correctly.
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Old 06-07-2018, 09:42 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keysdisease View Post
Replace it with the largest Rule pump that uses the same size discharge hose.
If you pumps running your last problem will be amp draw.



And put a second one with an alarm in a bit higher. It will stay clean and always be ready back up the first one. It's worth a another above water skin fitting to avoid any backflow issues trying to share one discharge point.

IMO two mid size pumps cover the risk of flooding your engine much better than one big one.
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Old 06-07-2018, 09:49 AM   #5
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Thanks - its a 1970 wood boat - not a lot of water comes in but the mid pump runs every once in a while - I already have two 2000s (fore/aft) and an emergency 1000 so I wondered if 6000 worth of bilge pumping is not sufficient?

Also - they each have their own discharge points
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Old 06-07-2018, 10:09 AM   #6
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As others have said, install the biggest pump that will support the discharge hose diameter, and make sure the wire and breaker size is ok for the amperage- at least 12 gauge for a 15 amp pump.



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Old 06-07-2018, 10:13 AM   #7
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Our surveyor recommended 150 gph per foot of boat. So for a 36’ boat that would be 5400 total gph. Having said that I want as much as I can get.
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Old 06-07-2018, 12:30 PM   #8
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I don’t recall Rule making a 2500. Did you mean 1500? If so go with the 2000 as the hose is the same size.
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Old 06-09-2018, 09:47 AM   #9
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I added two rule 3700. I also added a 10 gauge wire to feed both pumps.. I split off about 3 feet of 12 gauge for one of them . One pump sits up on a 2x6 so it is never wet. Both pumps hose I used a pool hose 1.5 inch size. Those pool hoses flow water fine and are very flexible smooth on the inside. The outlet I used black polypropylene 1.5 inch street elbows glued into the wood hull with 5200. Black Pl roof and flashING is fine for this. The cut off pool hose end I glued into the street elbow with same poly adhesive. Each pump has its own wet switch, but I wired a single manual switch using a 40 amp cube relay to turn both on just for emergency use.
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Old 06-09-2018, 04:02 PM   #10
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Here are pics of the hose and glued in thru hull.
One pic shows the OEM tiny 3/4 copper pipe for comparison.
Has worked great. After gluing in, I sanded it flush with the outer hull.
The plastic fitting took the white paint fine.

It has been 4 years since I did this on the last haulout.

At the time, I also reworked my Rule 2000 hose and thru hull. The prior owner simply pushed a bigger hose over the littler hose and left the Rule 2000 to pump through a tiny 3/4 hose. Not good. I went to an electrical supply shop and bought 12 foot of liquid tight non metallic conduit, 1.25 inch diameter, basically a grey flexible PVC hose. Did the same type idea except I used a 1.25 inch white PVC street elbow. And it has worked great. Those pumps can move a lot of water, as long as the head is low. The Rule 2000 calls for a hose size of 1 1/8 inch, but the 1.25 inch hose has worked fine.
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Old 06-09-2018, 04:26 PM   #11
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With a wood boat it never hurts to have the bigger pump. 3700 gph is about 60 gpm. Probably 50 gpm with hose and fitting losses. It doesn't take too big of a hole to do 50 gpm.

For high amps pumps, if you're controlling the power from some distance away, it's better to use a relay so the power goes directly to the pump and the switch just operates the small coil in the relay. It doesn't hurt to run one wire size larger.
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Old 06-09-2018, 05:09 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sdowney717 View Post
I added two rule 3700. I also added a 10 gauge wire to feed both pumps.. I split off about 3 feet of 12 gauge for one of them . One pump sits up on a 2x6 so it is never wet. Both pumps hose I used a pool hose 1.5 inch size. Those pool hoses flow water fine and are very flexible smooth on the inside. The outlet I used black polypropylene 1.5 inch street elbows glued into the wood hull with 5200. Black Pl roof and flashING is fine for this. The cut off pool hose end I glued into the street elbow with same poly adhesive. Each pump has its own wet switch, but I wired a single manual switch using a 40 amp cube relay to turn both on just for emergency use.

Do you have a 40 amp fuse or breaker feeding those two pumps. Any smaller and you will trip. Also check the voltage drop with both running. At 31 amps total that will result in a voltage drop of 0.32 volts for every ten feet of 10 gauge wire length (count both ways).


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Old 06-09-2018, 05:23 PM   #13
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Do you have a 40 amp fuse or breaker feeding those two pumps. Any smaller and you will trip. Also check the voltage drop with both running. At 31 amps total that will result in a voltage drop of 0.32 volts for every ten feet of 10 gauge wire length (count both ways).


David
Yes, 40 amp breaker. And to get the true amp load, the pump has to be actually pumping water not air. My 10 gauge wire is 6 feet from the main power buss under the wheel.
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Old 06-09-2018, 05:31 PM   #14
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This circuit lets you use one manual switch to run 2 separate pumps (BP)and keep each pump on a seperate automatic switch (FS). I wanted to do that as might as well turn on both 3700 pumps for testing or in an emergency, you want them both to run. Sometimes we all know the automatic switches fail.

the circuit prevents backfeeding, so one automatic switch can not turn on both pumps.
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Old 06-09-2018, 05:54 PM   #15
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Sdowney717, I’ve got to say I really hate your thru-hull. While I love 5200, I would never rely on it alone to hold a thru-hull in place. Why not use a real mushroom head thru-hull?
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Old 06-09-2018, 07:00 PM   #16
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Sdowney717, I’ve got to say I really hate your thru-hull. While I love 5200, I would never rely on it alone to hold a thru-hull in place. Why not use a real mushroom head thru-hull?
4 years and counting and never been a problem. Maybe if someone took a sledgehammer and smashed this, but the outlet is still about 6 or 7 inches above the water.

What I like about this, it makes the turn up, so the hose lays flat against the inner hull which keeps the hose out of the way. And no hose clamp to worry about. After I glued this in, I could not budge it, solidly attached. You could sand the plastic which gives the polyurethane even more grip. Its not coming apart ever, the wood would have to rot first.
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