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Old 11-10-2015, 05:14 PM   #1
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Repaint

Hi All,

interested on opinions, observations, and recommendations in regards to a repaint on our Fibreglass hull. We currently have Alexseal on her and it has serviced us well and we have it buffed and waxed once a year. Regardless of this I am always open minded about what is currently the best product to use and the reasons for it.

over to any one who would like to comment.

Cheers Chris D Liberty Australia
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Old 11-10-2015, 06:21 PM   #2
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I think Alexseal is probably one of the top 2 part paints out there. As good as a paint is, it's only as good as the prep and the applicator. When we painted Hobo that's what we wanted. After discussions with the local painters I found a few who would try Axelseal but the "man" was Nigel if you wanted your boat painted. His medium was Awlcraft 2000. He was also willing to try Axelseal, but we decided we'd
stick with the proven mix of Nigel and Awlcraft. Every artist has his medium.
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Old 11-10-2015, 07:15 PM   #3
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Quote:
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I think Alexseal is probably one of the top 2 part paints out there. As good as a paint is, it's only as good as the prep and the applicator. When we painted Hobo that's what we wanted. After discussions with the local painters I found a few who would try Axelseal but the "man" was Nigel if you wanted your boat painted. His medium was Awlcraft 2000. He was also willing to try Axelseal, but we decided we'd
stick with the proven mix
of Nigel and Awlcraft. Every artist has his medium.
Awlgrip certainly is one of the top paints (Best IMO). As Larry mentioned, it's all about the prep; every boat painter has the paint he prefers and has proven experience with; stick with the preferred paint of the painter or switch painters to one who uses the paint you desire. Think mine turned out ok.

Ted
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Old 11-10-2015, 10:16 PM   #4
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thanks Guy's

Ted , just a question on the Awl grip , does it have a clear coat to finish off with, and can Awl grip be buffed and waxed ?

Chris D Liberty Australia
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Old 11-10-2015, 11:37 PM   #5
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I think LarryM is quite wise to use the paint that the painter is comfortable using. Different coatings have their own idiosyncrasies. I had a boat painted with Awlcraft, and was happy with it. It would touch up and buff out well. Last year I used Alexseal because the painter was using it. I saw his work, and the Alexseal rep was just a few miles away if needed. I think the job turned out in a spectacular way. The "depth" in the color was amazing.

You can go on the Awlgrip website, and there are instructions for the way to maintain it. They have a complete line of products for maintenance.
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Old 11-11-2015, 07:12 AM   #6
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thanks Guy's

Ted , just a question on the Awl grip , does it have a clear coat to finish off with, and can Awl grip be buffed and waxed ?

Chris D Liberty Australia
Hi Chris,

I'm not aware of a clear coat for Awlgrip. You can definitely wax and buff it. Waxing is recommended at least once a year. While you can compound it to some degree, the shine is in the surface of the paint. This is not a paint you wet sand and compound to restore original shine. Thus waxing is important to maintain the surface shine.

Ted
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Old 11-11-2015, 10:45 AM   #7
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Originally Posted by Moonstruck View Post
I think LarryM is quite wise to use the paint that the painter is comfortable using. Different coatings have their own idiosyncrasies. I had a boat painted with Awlcraft, and was happy with it. It would touch up and buff out well. Last year I used Alexseal because the painter was using it. I saw his work, and the Alexseal rep was just a few miles away if needed. I think the job turned out in a spectacular way. The "depth" in the color was amazing.

You can go on the Awlgrip website, and there are instructions for the way to maintain it. They have a complete line of products for maintenance.
Ok, help me out here.
Awlcraft is not a product of Awlgrip but Alexseal is, Right?
If upkeep is pretty much the same as FG why choose paint, other than shine and color choices?
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Old 11-11-2015, 11:35 AM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Liberty2015 View Post
thanks Guy's

Ted , just a question on the Awl grip , does it have a clear coat to finish off with, and can Awl grip be buffed and waxed ?

Chris D Liberty Australia
Awlgrip and Awlcraft 2000 are manufactured by US Paints. Alexseal is a newer product manufactured by Mankiewicz Coatings.

Awlgrip is a different product than Awlcraft 2000. Awlgrip is a polyurithane manufactured by US Paints. When it cures a fine clear coat rises to the surface. This clear layer is what makes the end result "shiny". Because the clear layer is so thin, it isn't recommended to compound or "buff" Awlgrip. Yes, it can be done, but there is very little product to remove to restore shine. Most of the time you will end up with a nice shiny hull that flattens to a dull finish as soon as the check to your detailer clears. Some painters will finish a topcoat with a coat or two of "clear". In theory this ends in a more durable finish with a thicker gloss, but it is not necessary and not typical. Awlgrip can be applied by brush (roll and tip) or spray. Awlgrip was originally formulated a long time ago, but due to EPA restrictions has had to reformulate numerous times. Current Awlgrip product is not as wonderful as it once was. Additionally, Awlgrip is nearly impossible to repair. This is because the repaired area can't be wet sanded and polished to blend the new material into the old. Typically, an entire large area (think the side of your hull, or house side) is painted just to repair one small scratch. Alternatively, a square around the scratch is masked off, sanded, faired, primed, and painted. This leaves a square paint patch that is obvious when you are up close.

Awlcraft 2000 is a newer product also manufactured by US Paints. Unlike the original Awlgrip, Awlcraft 2000 is an Acrylic Urithane. Awlcraft 2000 is much softer and less durable than the original Awlgrip, but is much more forgiving to apply. Awlcraft 2000 can only be applied by spray. Brushing (roll and tip) is not recommended as it is nearly impossible to get consistent results. Unlike Awlgrip, Awlcraft 2000 can be buffed to restore the glossy finish. This is because there is acrylic "shine" all the way through the paint thickness. Old oxidation is removed and new "shiny stuff" is revealed in the process. Awlcraft 2000 is the easiest of the three mentioned paints to repair. Instead of having to mask off an entire large panel section to paint, you can simply repair the immediate chipped/scratched material and wet sand/polish to blend in the repaired material.

Alexseal was invented/formulated by the same guy that created the original Awlgrip back in the 60s' or 70s'. In my opinion, it is the best of both worlds. It is a standard two part polyurethane so it is as tough and durable as the original Awlgrip. It can be sprayed or brushed (roll and tip). It has shine all the way through so it can be polished to restore the finish. Because it can be polished, it can be easily spot repaired as well instead of painting an entire masked off section.

With that said, those are three very good paints. I started off with Awlgrip and made the move to Alexseal because of it's capabilities. I painted my 70 footer stem to stern in Alexseal and I'm very happy with the results. With that said, I *highly* recommend sticking to whatever your painter is familiar with. It doesn't make sense to pay for the guy's education in a new product. Additionally, the top-coat is the easy and satisfying part. 99% of the work is the preparation of the sub-strait. The top coat will only augment how good or bad of a prep job was done.

Here are some photos of the "process":
https://goo.gl/photos/KwGZ7Zx7XKo6sVf48



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Old 11-11-2015, 03:13 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Liberty2015 View Post
thanks Guy's

Ted , just a question on the Awl grip , does it have a clear coat to finish off with, and can Awl grip be buffed and waxed ?

Chris D Liberty Australia
Chris
Data sheets for both Awlgrip & Awlcraft list a clear topcoat - I believe this is optional as opposed to most automotive finishes where it is part of the normal system.

I did some research on these before tackling some spot repair on my Mainship - I'll attach a file that summarizes my findings and has a few useful links... especially the last one comparing Awlgrip & Awlcraft.
I did not topcoat w/ clear and I don't believe Mainship used it.

A friend that does some body repair was the one that sprayed my Awlcraft and commented that it worked easily and he had little / no learning curve from his usual automotive finishes.

Note: Ability to repair, buff, and recommended maintenance are very different for these 2 finishes and I think it is wise to head the Mfg recommendations.
Attached Files
File Type: pdf Mainship Hull Paint Info.pdf (317.6 KB, 15 views)
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Old 11-11-2015, 03:28 PM   #10
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Sterling paint is a preferred air craft paint. Because I like the looks of it on aircraft I painted a boat with it. Great result and would use it again.
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Old 12-01-2015, 04:02 AM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Panacea View Post
Awlgrip and Awlcraft 2000 are manufactured by US Paints. Alexseal is a newer product manufactured by Mankiewicz Coatings.

Awlgrip is a different product than Awlcraft 2000. Awlgrip is a polyurithane manufactured by US Paints. When it cures a fine clear coat rises to the surface. This clear layer is what makes the end result "shiny". Because the clear layer is so thin, it isn't recommended to compound or "buff" Awlgrip. Yes, it can be done, but there is very little product to remove to restore shine. Most of the time you will end up with a nice shiny hull that flattens to a dull finish as soon as the check to your detailer clears. Some painters will finish a topcoat with a coat or two of "clear". In theory this ends in a more durable finish with a thicker gloss, but it is not necessary and not typical. Awlgrip can be applied by brush (roll and tip) or spray. Awlgrip was originally formulated a long time ago, but due to EPA restrictions has had to reformulate numerous times. Current Awlgrip product is not as wonderful as it once was. Additionally, Awlgrip is nearly impossible to repair. This is because the repaired area can't be wet sanded and polished to blend the new material into the old. Typically, an entire large area (think the side of your hull, or house side) is painted just to repair one small scratch. Alternatively, a square around the scratch is masked off, sanded, faired, primed, and painted. This leaves a square paint patch that is obvious when you are up close.

Awlcraft 2000 is a newer product also manufactured by US Paints. Unlike the original Awlgrip, Awlcraft 2000 is an Acrylic Urithane. Awlcraft 2000 is much softer and less durable than the original Awlgrip, but is much more forgiving to apply. Awlcraft 2000 can only be applied by spray. Brushing (roll and tip) is not recommended as it is nearly impossible to get consistent results. Unlike Awlgrip, Awlcraft 2000 can be buffed to restore the glossy finish. This is because there is acrylic "shine" all the way through the paint thickness. Old oxidation is removed and new "shiny stuff" is revealed in the process. Awlcraft 2000 is the easiest of the three mentioned paints to repair. Instead of having to mask off an entire large panel section to paint, you can simply repair the immediate chipped/scratched material and wet sand/polish to blend in the repaired material.

Alexseal was invented/formulated by the same guy that created the original Awlgrip back in the 60s' or 70s'. In my opinion, it is the best of both worlds. It is a standard two part polyurethane so it is as tough and durable as the original Awlgrip. It can be sprayed or brushed (roll and tip). It has shine all the way through so it can be polished to restore the finish. Because it can be polished, it can be easily spot repaired as well instead of painting an entire masked off section.

With that said, those are three very good paints. I started off with Awlgrip and made the move to Alexseal because of it's capabilities. I painted my 70 footer stem to stern in Alexseal and I'm very happy with the results. With that said, I *highly* recommend sticking to whatever your painter is familiar with. It doesn't make sense to pay for the guy's education in a new product. Additionally, the top-coat is the easy and satisfying part. 99% of the work is the preparation of the sub-strait. The top coat will only augment how good or bad of a prep job was done.

Here are some photos of the "process":
https://goo.gl/photos/KwGZ7Zx7XKo6sVf48




Hi this is great information Panacea , and aligns with what my research is also indicating. Thanks.

Also your paint job is superb, and I love the slight colour change between the hull and Cabin ? , at least I think it looks that way in the photo's. Are you able to share the colour with me ?

Cheers Chris D Liberty Australia
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Old 12-01-2015, 05:21 AM   #12
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Great work Brian. How did you do your decks?

I had a woody done in Awlgrip 35 years ago. The choice then was Imron or Awlgrip. The woodie Awlgrip held up nearly 20 years under the next owner. I'm casually watching an Alexseal job on a Westport. Being done indoors in the PNW. Those coatings don't like raindrops when being applied.
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Old 12-01-2015, 06:55 AM   #13
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"I painted my 70 footer stem to stern in Alexseal and I'm very happy with the results."

Way back for a roll and tip Awlgrip application the recommendation was to paint vertically.

Is Alexseal done vertically , or horizontally?
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Old 12-01-2015, 07:13 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Liberty2015 View Post
Hi All,

interested on opinions, observations, and recommendations in regards to a repaint on our Fibreglass hull. We currently have Alexseal on her and it has serviced us well and we have it buffed and waxed once a year. Regardless of this I am always open minded about what is currently the best product to use and the reasons for it.

over to any one who would like to comment.

Cheers Chris D Liberty Australia
Haven't had time to read all the answering posts, but as a fellow Aussie, who has always used the line of marine paints which started as the Kiwi product Epi-Glass, then bought out by or merged with a US co and re-emerged as Interlux over there, and International here and in NZ, you can't go wrong with International perfection 2 pack. I have had two boats re-painted over tired fibreglass gelcoat with this product, my trawler just 4 years ago, and it is a better finish than any gelcoat, so what else can you say.
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Old 12-05-2015, 09:33 AM   #15
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Also your paint job is superb, and I love the slight colour change between the hull and Cabin ? , at least I think it looks that way in the photo's. Are you able to share the colour with me ?

Cheers Chris D Liberty Australia
Thanks! I did the house sides Vestal White and hull sides Kingston Grey. Very happy with the results.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sunchaser View Post
Great work Brian. How did you do your decks?
We live aboard full time so our decks get a lot more use/traffic than a typical weekend use boat. I decided against a standard Alexseal/non skid and opted for the easier to repair Kiwigrip. The stuff is an absolute cakewalk to apply and small sections can be repaired by simply cleaning/degreasing and then rolling on new material. We spend a lot of time barefoot and I like the slightly rubbery texture. My only complaint is Kiwigrip holds a lot of dirt. Some quality time with a box of Magic Erasers and an application of Woody Wax helps mitigate this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FF View Post
"I painted my 70 footer stem to stern in Alexseal and I'm very happy with the results."

Way back for a roll and tip Awlgrip application the recommendation was to paint vertically.

Is Alexseal done vertically , or horizontally?
Personally, I spread the material with the roller vertically, then horizontally with less pressure, then tip out vertically. With the proper amount of reducer and high-density foam "hotdog" rollers tipping out isn't necessary unless you see a sag or drip or to "cut in" to a corner. I work horizontally about 3 feet at a time.

I sprayed my house and hull, but rolled and tipped my transom and foredeck. Rolling and tipping the large areas would have been way too much work since 3 or 4 coats is needed and you must sand the entire thing with 320 or scratch with a burgundy scotchbrite pad between coats. I usually end up with 5 coats since Alexseal goes on so thin. It feels more like varnishing than painting! You can spray 5 coats in one day. Brushing takes a week or more.

I just bought a 1975 Gulfstar 36 MK II that I will be painting with my Son. I've always liked those old Gulfstars and it will be fun breathing some life back into her.
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