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Old 05-06-2014, 11:11 AM   #21
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I was expecting the comments and debate about polyester vs epoxy. Although I agree with the fact that epoxy is a better material, I decided to go with the simpler to work with/cheaper polyester resin. My thought process was very simple: my boat is 35 years old and it was made with polyester resin that was most likely not as good as the products we have today. It lasted many years without any problems (and some parts of the boat are as good and solid as the day it came out of the factory). I have built and repaired stuff with polyester resin years ago that is still very solid and doesn't let any water in. Another reason: I'm not going to keep the boat for another 35 years and many many things will fall apart before my new cabin top. I'm also in Canada which means that the boat sits on the hard completely protected by shrink wrap 7 months out of 12. It's not like it's exposed that much to rain and water. And if for no other reason: what I'm doing now, no matter the product I'm using, will make things a LOT better than it was before I started and somehow give resell value to the boat.

As for the little boards some people asked about, I have no other reason than to replicate how it was originally built. Maybe I could have done it differently. Would it make a difference in the overall scheme of things and the final results? I don't know.

Thank you for all the good comments and the encouraging words. It is a massive job and I'm in a race against time as all the boats have in to be in the water by June 2 at my marina. It will be a tight fit since there's a lot more work to be done.
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Old 05-06-2014, 12:31 PM   #22
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I understand your point and the fact you're in Canada and on the hard winters makes sense. Good luck with your time frame.
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Old 05-06-2014, 05:32 PM   #23
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Poly shrinks, not epoxy. Sandable filler makes epoxy fillets easier to sand. Properly mixed epoxy gives longer working times and a much slower set than poly. Clean up spills and drips befor they harden, epoxy REALLY sticks, not so much with poly. Sometimes you can easily peel up drips and spills with poly. Epoxy is either harder and more brittle or much more flexible than poly, pick what you need for the application. Over wood a 2 to 1 U.S. Composites thin mix works great. For filler use the regular 2-1 epoxy, it needs less aggregate added to get the consistency needed. Poly is easy to use, anyone can do it. Education is important with epoxy.
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Old 05-06-2014, 10:53 PM   #24
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Finished the frame tonight and managed to cut and position the most complicated plywood piece between the window and the hatch.

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Old 05-07-2014, 02:19 AM   #25
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Quote:
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polyester resins can only bond using the first two of these, which greatly reduces their utility as adhesives and in marine repair.

Agreed, but, You can only bond epoxy over poly but not poly over epoxy.


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Old 05-07-2014, 08:14 AM   #26
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Or poly to poly for that matter, its just not a good adhesive. Great for building things tho. What are you planning for the windshield to cabin roof joint and how are you going to seal up around the hatch ?
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Old 05-07-2014, 08:44 AM   #27
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Can we get over the poly/epoxy discussion? Maybe start a new thread if you're really into this stuff. Just saying.

I'll overlap the fiber glass over the windshield frame a bit (maybe an inch or so). If you look carefully you'll see that there's a bit of white paint on the wood. The previous owner glassed over the original cabin and used a similar technique.
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Old 05-07-2014, 10:08 AM   #28
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.The previous owner glassed over the original cabin and used a similar technique.

PO ??? Crikey! How many times has this been done? Could be material choice ?.. Just sayin ... LOL



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Old 05-07-2014, 10:09 AM   #29
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Nice job on that cut. There are very few easy cuts on boats and when making complicated angle cuts it really gets you thinking.

Who needs crossword puzzles when you do this stuff?
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Old 05-07-2014, 10:12 AM   #30
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Greetings,
Just a question to the great mass of the unwashed who are contributing to this rebuild. Would there be any advantage or disadvantage to running a large bead or filet of caulk or sealant along the seam between the lower part of the window frame and the new decking before glassing over? Looking good Mr. F.
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Old 05-07-2014, 10:32 AM   #31
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How hard would it be to remove hatch

I see two potential problems. Water intrusion between the hatch frame and plywood deck and plywood deck to windshield frame. How do you plan on sealing these intersections?
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Old 05-07-2014, 10:36 AM   #32
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That is a great question. In my rebuild, I used thickened epoxy with the strongest bonding material available and no caulking. The builder used a shit glue and lots of caulk. The glue came loose and was non existent and the caulk just made matters worse when I removed the bad wood.

This rebuild is using poly, which isn't a strong glue so the question of using a caulking comes into play.
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Old 05-07-2014, 10:47 AM   #33
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PO ??? Crikey! How many times has this been done? Could be material choice ?.. Just sayin ... LOL
Good point. I think there was some water intrusion and instead of fixing the problem properly like I'm doing, he simply glassed over the whole roof hoping the problem would disappear.

It's not clear from the pictures (I will take some close-ups next time) but the plywood actually extends about an inch under the windshield frame. This has two advantages in my mind: it give solidity to the entire roof as it will bond with what's in place and it will make sealing the joint easier. By overlapping the fiberglass on the window frame I think I'm in business.

It's the same thing for the hatch. The plywood extends about 1/2 an inch under the hatch frame creating a tight fit. With the resin, the fiberglass and the gel coat, I don't see how water could make it's way anywhere. Plus there's a gentle curve that drives water away from the hatch and the windshield so it's not like water will be sitting there trying to make it's way inside.
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Old 05-07-2014, 08:01 PM   #34
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Maybe because polyester resin will not remain "stuck" to the wood. It has been proven thousands of times over. Over the course of time and temp cycles it WILL turn loose and allow water intrusion again. Had you not used wood as a substraight it would have no potential for rot. About any of the modern core materials would work and for that small of any area would have probably cost about 5 times as much as inferior ply and who knows what framing wood. Even ACX pine ply and pine lumber saturated with CPES is way superior to just plain wood and rot potential is all but eliminated. The poly will seperate from the wood. Again. Probably sooner than later. What I look at and think when I see these kind of repairs is, what else has been done like this. The construction could have been better originally and could definitely be done better now than originall. The window and hatches present a speciall problem for sealing that will be tuff for any procedure.
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Old 05-07-2014, 08:22 PM   #35
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Greetings,
I think a re-read of post #27 is in order (first paragraph). I am quite enjoying this photo essay. Not the way I would have done it but I'm not doing it and it's not my boat. Your boat appears to be under shrink wrap. Nice and dry, out of the wind and softly back lit by the light diffusing through the plastic. One could almost...
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Old 05-11-2014, 09:55 PM   #36
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Got a lot done this weekend. Finished the plywood, waterproofed it, filled the srew holes and seams and put on the first layer of glass.

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Old 05-11-2014, 10:13 PM   #37
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Looking good! You're making good progress on your project.
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Old 05-11-2014, 10:30 PM   #38
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Looks like the glass wetted down nice. Good Job!!
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Old 05-11-2014, 11:58 PM   #39
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Looking good

How many layers are you applying. You mentioned finishing up with gel coat? Are you worried about print through from the glass fabric?
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Old 05-12-2014, 08:49 AM   #40
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I'm planning on doing 3 layers. The first 2 are cloth from a big roll I already had and I bought some 1.5 oz matte for the top layer. I'm planning on finishing with gel coat. I understand this will be the tricky part in terms of appearance. Still investigating on how to do it properly. Would like to spray but it would be very difficult to work in such a small space and to cover all the wood, etc. to protect it from fumes.
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