Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 07-18-2019, 01:17 AM   #1
Newbie
 
City: Newport
Country: USA
Join Date: Jul 2019
Posts: 1
Need some help troubleshooting 4045 John Deere

Hi there I am new to the site and right off the bat I need some help with my John Deere 4045TFM75

It has been a long saga and for the life of me I can not figure it out.

Here is what I have done so far.

1.New filter in the Racor water separator 20 micron and new secondary filters.
2.added 5 psi marine electric lift pump between the tank and Racor.
3 New mechanical lift fuel pump
4 New injection pump ,fuel temp sensor and 4 new injectors installed and timed by John Deere marine mechanic.
5.added mechanical fuel pressure gauge at exit of secondary fuel filter before it goes to injection pump
6 changed out return fuel line to the tank
7 rerouted fuel vent hose so there it had no low points to catch fuel and block vent
8 inspected and cleaned every plug and connection through out the wire harness
Including grounds.
9. Changed out Murphy power view gauge
10 New Ecu installed by John Deere Mechanic

And I keep having the same problem
I will start the engine and fires up fine every perfect no hesitation at all
And it might run great for a few days

But it dies and I can not get it started
It throws code spn 1076 (Fuel Inj Pump Control Valve) FMI 5. (High Resistance)


And will not restart until maybe 30 to 60 mins
Later if will fire up and run great again.

The last time I thought I had it with new injection pump it ran good for two weeks but the just on the way back to the dock just before landing it died again

When it happens I feel a small stutter the 20 sec later it dies no matter what throttle position

At idle I have 6 psi fuel pressure and great flow under load it drops maybe to 3.5 psi

I took the return line off and found that the hose had an adapter with a 1/8 hole
changed it out to a little bigger opening and seems to flow fine
No change in fuel pressure.

I also took the return off and put a 3/8 clear hose and just ran it back to the fuel fill to see if there where any air pockets that would show up but just some very very small bubbles hardly noticeable fuel temp coming out is 120 degrees

It feels like the ecu is shutting down the fuel pump and will not let it fire back up

Engine temp has never been over 183 degrees

Anyone have an idea where to look?
__________________
Advertisement

Tiki is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2019, 01:47 AM   #2
Guru
 
kapnd's Avatar
 
City: hawaii
Country: usa
Vessel Name: #31
Vessel Model: ex-Navy MUB 50 fish/cruise
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 529
If it were a mechanical motor, I’d say it’s your fuel shutoff solenoid, but not sure if your electronic controlled even has one of those!
__________________

__________________
You can lead a horse to water,
But you can't make him ski...
kapnd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2019, 02:04 AM   #3
Guru
 
AusCan's Avatar
 
City: Adelaide
Country: Australia
Vessel Name: Kokanee
Vessel Model: Cuddles 30 Pilot House Motor Sailer
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 2,854
Welcome to the site.

Sounds like you've been chasing this problem for a while. I can understand your frustration.

I'm not familiar with JD's but there are a few other members that will chime in, no doubt?
Just wondering, Was the above work done because of theis problem, or have you done the work trying to sort out the problem. Also -does this occur when running off either tank or just one?
AusCan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2019, 05:35 AM   #4
Guru
 
Ski in NC's Avatar
 
City: Wilmington, NC
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Louisa
Vessel Model: Custom Built 38
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 5,265
Put a clear line between tank and first component in fuel system (not sure what that is based on the text) and see if air is coming from the tank. Some engines do not handle even a little bit of air.

A hint given is that there is air showing up in the return. That came from somewhere.

Also, what does the fuel pressure do just before and during a stall?
Ski in NC is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2019, 05:41 AM   #5
Guru
 
O C Diver's Avatar
 
City: Fort Myers, FL... Summers in Crisfield, MD
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Slow Hand
Vessel Model: Cherubini Independence 45
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 7,424
I have the exact same motor. My guess, and its only a guess is the wiring harness connector at the ECU. I had the engine quit twice on me with some error code I don't remember. At the time, I was in Lake Superior. Got my JD dealer on the phone and his suggestion was to remove, inspect, and reinstall the injection pump electrical plug and the ECU plug. Did that, the engine started and ran normally. His explanation was that there is very low voltage and amperage traveling through the connectors. A dirty pin connector increases the resistance. The ECU interprets that as a component (injector pump control) problem. Reseating the connector wipes the pins and plugs clean. The second time I had the problem, I knew what it probably was. Pulled the plug assembly on the ECU, inspected it, sprayed the connector with an electronic cleaner / enhancer / corrosion inhibitor. It was either Corrosion X, or Pro Gold. I think Corrosion X, but don't remember for sure which one. Problem has not reoccured in 1,500 hours. If that is the problem, I guess it could be on either end of the wiring harness. The likelyhood is the ECU harness as the connector doesn't have as nice a sealing system.

Hope this helps. If not, I would change the wiring harness as my interpretation is an intermittent electrical problem between the injector pump and the ECU.

Ted
__________________
Blog: mvslowhand.com
I'm tired of fast moves, I've got a slow groove, on my mind.....
I want to spend some time, Not come and go in a heated rush.....
"Slow Hand" by The Pointer Sisters
O C Diver is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2019, 06:29 AM   #6
FF
Guru
 
FF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 19,521
A hunk of gunk in the fuel tank could be plugging the fuel pickup..
FF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2019, 07:57 AM   #7
Guru
 
djmarchand's Avatar
 
City: Litchfield, Ct/Punta Gorda, Fl
Country: USA
Vessel Model: Atlas Pompano 23
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 4,698
I think Ski is on the right track.

Also are you sure your electric pump is pumping? If not it can create a pressure drop which will produce an even higher vacuum than normal downstream. That will pull in more air. Normally you do not need an electric pump.

Are you sure that the Racor was assembled properly when you changed the filter? There is a gasket and check valve that if assembled backwards, can leak. Instructions on how to reassemble it come with the filter.

Finally, I would reinstall the restriction orifice in the return line. I suspect it is there for a reason.

David
djmarchand is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2019, 09:06 AM   #8
Guru
 
twistedtree's Avatar
 
City: Gloucester, MA
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 4,837
I agree that tracking down any possible air in the fuel lines is a good first step, and probably easiest fix.


But it doesn't explain the error code. FMI means that the current level for something associated with the injection pump (based on SPN 1076) has dropped below any normal value. A bad plug connection or harness seems more likely. But let's hope for an air leak. That would be easier and cheaper to fix.
__________________
www.MVTanglewood.com
twistedtree is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2019, 09:28 AM   #9
Guru
 
cardude01's Avatar
 
City: Victoria TX
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Bijou
Vessel Model: 2008 Island Packet steadysailer
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 4,239
Need some help troubleshooting 4045 John Deere

Iím betting on the ECM harness also. Electronically controlled engine relies on good clean connections, but the salty marine environment will lead to corroded connections eventually.

This recently happened to my radar connection. Corrosion at a plug was causing intermittent radar problems. CorrosionX on the plug cleared it up.
cardude01 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2019, 10:01 AM   #10
Guru
 
O C Diver's Avatar
 
City: Fort Myers, FL... Summers in Crisfield, MD
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Slow Hand
Vessel Model: Cherubini Independence 45
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 7,424
One of the things to understand on the 4045 ECU is that it does diagnostic checks I think every second. So, if it sees a resistance value of the injection pump control coil that is out of the allowable range, you get a warning. Unfortunately, a momentary resistance value may not keep the injection pump from working, but the computer doesn't know that.

Ted
__________________
Blog: mvslowhand.com
I'm tired of fast moves, I've got a slow groove, on my mind.....
I want to spend some time, Not come and go in a heated rush.....
"Slow Hand" by The Pointer Sisters
O C Diver is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2019, 10:29 AM   #11
Guru
 
psneeld's Avatar
 
City: AICW
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Freedom
Vessel Model: Albin 40
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 19,633
From an engine guru....


......might be a clue......High resistance ... where is the most likely place for an ECU to see "high resistance"? In the cable that supplies the signal. ........

OC Diver has it nailed when he suggests cleaning the connectors. That should have been the first step. That is the first place to start looking for an ECU issue on modern engines, especially when the ECU tells you what to look for.
psneeld is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2019, 10:48 AM   #12
Guru
 
drb1025's Avatar
 
City: Bellevue, WA
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Fiddler
Vessel Model: DeFever 46
Join Date: Oct 2012
Posts: 596
I had a similar problem with my 4045. The mechanic couldnít figure it out and the JD rep agreed to replace the injection pump, Ecu, and wiring harness. The engine has been fine for 1,100 hours.
drb1025 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2019, 11:27 AM   #13
Senior Member
 
greysailor's Avatar
 
City: Matagorda Bay
Country: Republic of Texas - USA
Vessel Name: Salty
Vessel Model: 2005 Defever 44
Join Date: May 2013
Posts: 192
All this makes me love my mechanical JD4045's even more! Best of luck chasing those wayward electrons, Tiki....🤯
__________________
Fair winds,
Luke
greysailor is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-18-2019, 11:35 AM   #14
Guru
 
City: Between Oregon and Alaska
Country: US
Vessel Name: Charlie Harper
Vessel Model: Wheeler Shipyard 83'
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 1,527
Oh! The joy of electronically controlled diesels! Problems like this are exactly why I won't have a non mechanical engine.
Lepke is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-19-2019, 05:43 AM   #15
FF
Guru
 
FF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 19,521
"Problems like this are exactly why I won't have a non mechanical engine."

I agree , but the newer the boat , the more chance an electric nightmare may be below decks.

For most displacement boats the diesel electronics may cause a growing popularity for gas engines.A V6 or V8 with a carb. is really reliable, even after a thunderstorm.

If all that's needed is 20- 80HP many gas engines would work fine.

In some cases 3 or 4 new engines could be purchased for the price of an injection pump, or set of injectors. This becomes really important when the techs begin to throw parts at a problem they do not understand.
FF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-19-2019, 09:20 AM   #16
Veteran Member
 
DCDC's Avatar
 
City: New Orleans
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Stella
Vessel Model: Seaton 56
Join Date: Sep 2017
Posts: 65
Stella has twin Deere 6068's, electronic with Bosch VP44 injector pumps. I have had similar, but maybe not exactly the same, issues. Both times I ended up changing the injector pump. I ordered replacements and changed them myself but still expensive.

The Bosch pump seems to be somewhat delicate as it is lubricated by diesel flowing through versus other designs which are oil lubricated. If they lose fuel flow for very long they lose lubrication. There are also a few flow/pressure control valves that may stick due to fuel contamination. There is some online information on the pumps as they are (where?) used on Cummins engines for Dodge trucks and for diesel engines in Europe.

I was told by a Deere service rep that they no longer make new pumps so I ended up buying re-manufactured versions. The first time I went to a local injector shop and ordered through them as it was less expensive than Deere. This pump failed after 250 hrs (unfortunately at anchor in the Bahamas) so I ordered the next replacement from Deere.

I have a pdf copies of various Deere and Bosch maintenance/troubleshooting manuals which may be relevant for your engine. I looked up fault code 1076 but there was not much in the way of troubleshooting detail as the advice is faulty connector or faulty pump. They have detailed instructions for a lot of sensor and wiring problems if you are handy with a good multimeter. I can send you copies if you PM me.

A Deere tech should be able to connect a laptop with Deere diagnostics to your engine and maybe give you more detailed information if connected when the engine shuts down.

My problem was not intermittent, the engine stopped and would not restart after multiple attempts over several days and making sure there was adequate fuel flow with no air and that connectors/sensors/relays/fuses were OK.

Engine started immediately after changing the pumps and bleeding the system of air.
DCDC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-19-2019, 11:31 AM   #17
Guru
 
O C Diver's Avatar
 
City: Fort Myers, FL... Summers in Crisfield, MD
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Slow Hand
Vessel Model: Cherubini Independence 45
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 7,424
I have about 2,400 hours on my injector pump. Other than the connector hiccup, it's been flawless. The dealer strongly recommends the fuel additive / conditioner / lubricant which I add religiously. In the relative scheme of things, their electronic engines are extremely reliable. Between marine, agriculture, logging, mining and generators, they have to be in the hundreds of thousands produced.

Ted
__________________
Blog: mvslowhand.com
I'm tired of fast moves, I've got a slow groove, on my mind.....
I want to spend some time, Not come and go in a heated rush.....
"Slow Hand" by The Pointer Sisters
O C Diver is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 07-19-2019, 12:42 PM   #18
Guru
 
koliver's Avatar
 
City: Saltspring Island
Country: BC, canada
Vessel Name: Retreat
Vessel Model: C&L 44
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 3,050
Quote:
Originally Posted by O C Diver View Post
I have the exact same motor. My guess, and its only a guess is the wiring harness connector at the ECU. I had the engine quit twice on me with some error code I don't remember. At the time, I was in Lake Superior. Got my JD dealer on the phone and his suggestion was to remove, inspect, and reinstall the injection pump electrical plug and the ECU plug. Did that, the engine started and ran normally. His explanation was that there is very low voltage and amperage traveling through the connectors. A dirty pin connector increases the resistance. The ECU interprets that as a component (injector pump control) problem. Reseating the connector wipes the pins and plugs clean. The second time I had the problem, I knew what it probably was. Pulled the plug assembly on the ECU, inspected it, sprayed the connector with an electronic cleaner / enhancer / corrosion inhibitor. It was either Corrosion X, or Pro Gold. I think Corrosion X, but don't remember for sure which one. Problem has not reoccured in 1,500 hours. If that is the problem, I guess it could be on either end of the wiring harness. The likelyhood is the ECU harness as the connector doesn't have as nice a sealing system.

Hope this helps. If not, I would change the wiring harness as my interpretation is an intermittent electrical problem between the injector pump and the ECU.

Ted

I did the exact same fix on my old autopilot. When it would quit, pulling the multi-pin connectors off and spraying them with WD40 would give me a few years trouble free, then I would need to do it again.
Simple to try.
__________________
Keith
koliver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-19-2019, 01:33 PM   #19
Senior Member
 
Boat's Avatar
 
City: SchoolHouse Branch
Country: USA
Join Date: Jul 2018
Posts: 439
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiki View Post


It throws code spn 1076 (Fuel Inj Pump Control Valve) FMI 5. (High Resistance)

How did you get your trouble code?


Out of curiosity, I searched and saw this for the first time:


https://blog.diesellaptops.com/2016/...ostic-options/


Quote:
John Deere has recently been in the news because of their strict opposition to allowing farmers, equipment owners, and repair shops access to the information they need to repair and maintain their vehicles. If you read the main stream news, you would be left to believe that John Deere diagnostic with a computer is impossible. Well, we are here to help dispel that myth and give some more exposure to some tools that actually do perform diagnostics on John Deere. There are actually several solutions in the market, some of which we will cover in this post.
Boat is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-21-2019, 06:08 AM   #20
FF
Guru
 
FF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 19,521
It is still my belief that our fear of electronics makes electronics the first thought with engine failure.

Engines have been stopping for many decades long before electric injectors.

I would try an outboard fuel tank, with pressure bulb , hooked to the engine directly.

This would eliminate many possible failure points the computer could not capture.
__________________

FF is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:14 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012