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Old 04-26-2016, 07:23 AM   #21
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Originally Posted by kulas44 View Post
Dave Gerr goes into great detail about tank installation in his book "boat owners mechanical and electrical" IIRC or similar. 3M 7200 is the next step past 5200, horrible stuff. Sets up harder than 5200. Just another "small" thing that most folks here have never heard of. That list is long.
Hmm... I guess I'm one of those folks that has never heard of either of those two "small" things. Gere's book by that name nor 3M 7200.

I've heard of 3M 740 and 760 but never 7200. Can you post a link?
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Old 04-26-2016, 07:52 AM   #22
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Ok, I did say I mis spoke, so the book is By Dave Gerr, Boat Mechanical Systems Handbook. Concerning tank coatings p. 85, under the heading of Aluminum Tank Preservation. As for 3M 7200, I cant find a thing. Its been at least 10 years since I used any (if that was in fact 3M 7200) and I think I got it at West Marine in Galveston Tx. I re gooped some salon windows with it. Lately I have been using Window Weld polyurethane when I need a permanent "stick". Mostly because of availability. For the tank/neoprene application 5200 would be ok.
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Old 04-26-2016, 10:18 AM   #23
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Just musing here but I wonder if something like Rhino Liner spray truck bed coating would be ok. It tough as heck to stand up to the abuse some of it sees in pickup truck beds.

Just as long as the prep. is done.



I'll look up Dave Gerr's book. I don't have them all clearly, even though I thought I did.
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Old 04-26-2016, 10:30 AM   #24
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I have used truck bedliner on a couple of aluminum boats. No primer, just straight to the clean metal. It takes a beating pretty good. Metal prep is important. Rougher is better, and etch with acid. I like ExtremeLiner sold on ebay. Its a 2 part polyurethane. Comes with instructions and spray gun. For a tank I would use the finest rubber granules. I know you dont really need nonskid on a fuel tank, but the rubber is a big part of why this type of polyurethane is so tuff. And it looks good.
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Old 04-26-2016, 11:29 AM   #25
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And like older powder coatings...I have seen thousands of examples of both fail. Boh in truck beds and aluminum boats. Once one tiny part fails...it seems to spread faster than the most horrible cancer can.

While both can work like majic...it has never seemed like the majority to me though.
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Old 04-26-2016, 12:57 PM   #26
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I have good experiences using the Loctite PL S30 on all kinds of metal, wood, fiberglass.
It is a softer rubber than 5200 and a lot cheaper to buy. A couple times had some issues sticking to select spots on pine wood, which when I peeled off some of it, there was pine sap, so surface contamination prevented the adhering. PL S30 is designed for exposure to hot sun, the rain, made to stick to wood and metal on roofs.

I found it also sticks underwater on the boat. I have also sealed up several through hulls using it.

I also repaired a 3 inch ripped rubber exhaust hose end. I mixed up PL s30 with 1/32 " milled fibers, smeared it on an acetone cleaned hose and into the tear. Then wrapped several overlapping layers of FG wall board tape going down the hose 4 inches, fully saturating the FG tape.
Then smeared on a top layer. Waited 2 days, and was like a new hose.
This hose originally tore when it was stuck and I had a very hard time getting it off.
So now I use Rector seal T plus 2 on all the hose and fittings.
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Old 04-26-2016, 01:05 PM   #27
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ps is correct, lots of bad looking jobs out there. Aluminum can be the most difficult to coat. I will say that I've never had a problem with coal tar epoxy on an al tank. It may be the only thing nastier than 5200. And, it aint cheap. Spraying is not really an option and after roller/brush application it looks like it was rolled and brushed. If you want a lifetime tank it does work. And its proven.
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Old 04-26-2016, 01:13 PM   #28
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We are having a similar problem. We just found a slow leak at the weld of the starboard diesel tank and the connector to a shutoff valve - luckily just before we were supposed to launch yesterday. We are now pumping out many gallons of fuel, then the discussion of whether a repair is possible or how to get the 325 gallon tank out (and probably the port one as well ... 30 year old black steel). Cut the tank up? cut into the fiberglass side of the boat? and looking for skilled personel/marina/boat yard on the US side of Lake Ontario near Point Breeze and Rochester....

I wish our tanks could come out easily as it appears yours will!!
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Old 04-26-2016, 04:01 PM   #29
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Delia, when I changed both tanks 8 yes ago,I had a A frame set up in the sallon moved motors to floor level,cut tank up threw out the door. New tanks had to be smaller to fit through rear salloon window. I can do most of my work so labor was low. Just had to do it again as weld started leaking,weld was contaminated and fuel weaken weld . This time
I had a crane/Pettibone lift come through the port window and the tank was removed thru the starboard window. Engine was lifted to floor level ,tank was removed ,easy access once engine out of way then engine back on stringers as tank was repaired. Then repeated to put tank back in. Don't wish it task to anyone, but it can be done,with carefully planning,knowledge of what needs to be done,and plenty of beer. Good luck!!!
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Old 04-26-2016, 05:41 PM   #30
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I will say that I've never had a problem with coal tar epoxy on an al tank. It may be the only thing nastier than 5200. And, it aint cheap. Spraying is not really an option and after roller/brush application it looks like it was rolled and brushed. If you want a lifetime tank it does work. And its proven.
I will vouch for the coal tar. It has heavy solids and does not get pinholes in it. It's the pinholes that kill a coating.
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Old 04-26-2016, 06:50 PM   #31
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Sorry to hear that Delia Rose. A real kick in the slats. All I can offer is empathy.
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Old 04-26-2016, 08:26 PM   #32
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When I had to replace 4 fuel tanks on my old Phoenix, I called the manufacturer of the tank (on the tank label). They still had the original drawings of all the tanks. They made up all 4 using 0.125" instead of 0.90" and shipped them to my house.
The AL corroded where the neoprene support strips were glued to the tank. Looked like gray toothpaste. The bare AL looked like hell but was still solid.
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Old 04-26-2016, 09:34 PM   #33
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In my previous life I had a guy who used to manufacter Aluminium boats tanks. If you can find the leak in situ. and you can get at it, you can often just tap the leak with a ball peen hammer and you will close the hole by spreading the material around the hole. If the leak is in the weld it is even easier, you have more material to work with. It is a permanent fix as it is only using the parent material. I saw him doing often, all his tanks had to be pressure certified as they were being made for Govt the Govt would check them before he was paid.
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Old 04-27-2016, 07:48 AM   #34
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Just waiting for space to come alongside at my yard to start defueling. Unable to effectively inspect until the tanks are pulled.
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Old 04-27-2016, 04:58 PM   #35
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Has anyone thought of talking to bladder/ fuel cell replacement, could be a lot easier . Cut the top out or part of the top large enough to get the bladder into the old tank . The bladder manufacturers can fit all your required inlets and out lets.
Must be worth a call ?
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Old 04-27-2016, 06:18 PM   #36
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It is not. Stop gap measure at best. Do it right or do it over.
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Old 04-27-2016, 06:32 PM   #37
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They made up all 4 using 0.125" instead of 0.90" and shipped them to my house.
A nearly one inch thick tank must must have been pretty heavy.
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Old 04-27-2016, 06:37 PM   #38
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. Stop gap measure at best. Do it right or do it over.
A bladder is definitely not a stop gap , they are used in race cars approved by international mining standards Approved by Formula 1. Have been used by the military for years as they can be made pretty much bullet proof . Most off road race cars have bladder tanks inside a holding tank. The mine trucks often have semi trailers with bladder tanks as cargo as they dont have a problem with them splitting, as you might in really rough country. They can be
divided to carry different types of fluid. Here in Auz their was a very common brand of off shore game fishing boats that had fuel tanks glassed in , when they start to leak they often cut the top out fit the bladder make a door out of the cut out top , they have been doing it for 20 years I know of.
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Old 04-27-2016, 07:54 PM   #39
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Ok, try to sell a boat with bladders. It would be like trying to sell your house that has central heat and air but it dont work so you put in window units. That just tells me the PO was to cheap to do it right and begs the question of "where else did he cut corners ?" I'm fully aware of fuel bladder applications from race cars to coast guard training vessells and I am not saying they wont or dont work. Just not for this. I feel the same way about putting in plastic tanks instead of replacing the as installed tank. If I looked at a boat to buy that had either it would need to be an above average boat in every other way, and still would be suspect. I would make an offer that would allow for proper tank replacement.
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Old 04-27-2016, 08:22 PM   #40
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Just a thought, have you bought a new car in the last 20 years, have a look underneath , pound to a penny it has a plastic fuel tank.
I really think your analogy is not relevant. Comparing apples with apples If you bought a brand new boat with fuel bladders in it would you think they were inferior? Like wise would you go back to your car manufacturer and demand he put a steel tank in the car. I recall 20 or 30 Years ago GMH and Ford started putting plastic fuel tanks in all their cars here in Auz , there was all kinds of press jockies who were writing about ,they will burst they will have static electricity blah blah. Hasnt been mentioned since , they are safer in a crash they dont conduct static electricity. Maybe bladder tanks are better, I am no authority . JOF
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