Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 02-01-2012, 11:36 AM   #1
Senior Member
 
7tiger7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 239
How many, and what size, bilge pumps do you have?

Hi Everyone,

My boat has 3 bilge pumps. I'm thinking of changing them out - they appear to be original to the boat (1984), and putting larger pumps in.

I'm thinking of putting in three pumps, each 2,000 gph. But, thinking of going larger perhaps, but worried of going TOO large. Is there such a thing as TOO large a bilge pump, if I can fit it in the bilge? I don't want to upgrade hoses though - prefer to keep the current hoses - so that may limit my pump size.

Any preference on Jabsco or RULE? I have had VERY bad luck with the new "smart" RULE pumps...*

I prefer the old fashioned float switches.
__________________
Advertisement

7tiger7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 11:56 AM   #2
Scraping Paint
 
City: -
Country: -
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 13,748
How many, and what size, bilge pumps do you have?

Our boat is probably considered under-pumped by today's "don't leave the dock without 500 backups for every system crowd." I consider it under-pumped myself, but so far have not been motivated to do anything about it.

As built, GBs of our vintage had only one bilge pump, a manual one. At some point most owners or dealers would have installed at least one electric pump. This is the case in our boat. So we have a reasonably high-capacity electric pump in addition to the American Marine-installed manual pump.

The pump is a Rule, but not one of the so-called smart pumps.* It is controlled by a float switch which I mounted on a thick block of Plexiglas to position the float a bit higher than the pump, which is what the bilge pump people recommend.

But that's it. Obviously the boat has survived the last 39 years with this arrangement or however long it's had an electric pump of some sort. In the 13 years we've had the boat the electric pump has only gone off once on its own (as opposed to being tested) and that was when the intake filter in the fresh water line before the pump cracked and started leaking at a pretty good rate into the bilge. We were on a cruise at the time so were alerted to the problem by the cycling of the pump. We had a spare filter so it was an easy fix. But the boat wasn't taking on water, it was just moving water from the tanks to the bilge.

We also carry a portable electric pump that we bought at Home Depot for the purpose of pumping out the water tanks for the winter, a practice we abandoned many years ago. But we still have the pump and its hose fittings so that could be considered to be a "backup" bilge pump, but you'd have to be there to use it and it needs AC power to run.

I'd like to add a second 12vdc bilge pump--- it would be relatively easy to install and plumb. We just haven't gotten around to it yet and perhaps never will.

PS--- Just read Conrad's following post and he makes a good point I hadn't thought of.* We, too, have a shower sump pump in the engine room that could be used as a bilge pump if necessary.* And along those lines, the engines themselves, assuming they are running, can be used to evacuate large volumes of water from the bilge.


-- Edited by Marin on Wednesday 1st of February 2012 01:01:17 PM
__________________

Marin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 11:58 AM   #3
Guru
 
Conrad's Avatar
 
City: Calgary
Country: Canada
Vessel Name: Blue Sky
Vessel Model: Nordic Tugs 42 Hull #001
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,553
RE: How many, and what size, bilge pumps do you have?

We have 2 electric Rule bilge pumps on our 32 footer, plus a Whale Gusher manual. Don't know the size of the Rules, but they are the old fashioned type c/w float switches - which have been replaced twice on one pump in the last two years.

The manual pump has a long suction hose that can be moved around depending on where the water has collected. It is currently an open ended hose but we are considering putting a strum box on the end to slightly lower the suction point. Another possibility is incorporating a check/non-return valve in the strum box.

We also have a shower sump pump that in theory could be used in an emergency.

I think the key is location location location.
Conrad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 12:22 PM   #4
Senior Member
 
7tiger7's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 239
RE: How many, and what size, bilge pumps do you have?

Yes, if I count my shower sump pumps (two) I have a total of 5 pumps. And, I could shut off one of the engine raw water intake through hulls, cute the hose and use that to pump water out of the bilge by engine. I've seen, in SAIL magazine, people set up a Y valve in their raw water intake - one hose picks up water from through hull, other hose lays in bottom of bilge with a filter. I'm sure you could move ALOT of water with two engines running and picking up water from the bilge.
7tiger7 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 01:05 PM   #5
dvd
Senior Member
 
dvd's Avatar
 
City: California Bay Area
Country: US
Vessel Name: BOOSTER
Vessel Model: Nordic Tug 37
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 362
RE: How many, and what size, bilge pumps do you have?

When I bought the boat last summer it had three bilge pumps, two sump pumps, four float switches and a funky manual On-Off switch which got one, sometimes two, of the pumps running most of the time. All were plumbed to the same hose outlet. Wiring was everywhere with some power coming direct from the battery and some from the panel. The manual bilge pump had a one-way valve which was corroded shut. I cleaned out what looked like a junkyard in the bilge and got one reliable float switch and pump working tied to an Auto-Off-Manual switch and the manual pump working. It's OK for now, but it's relatively high on my list to install a second, reliable high flow pump. Whale makes a nice-looking pump which can be mounted remotely and has an electronic switch/pickup for the bilge. Pros - easy access to the pump for maintenance, Cons - pump has to "suck" from bilge as well as "push" to outlet. Anyone had experience with these?

dvd
dvd is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 02:09 PM   #6
Guru
 
Conrad's Avatar
 
City: Calgary
Country: Canada
Vessel Name: Blue Sky
Vessel Model: Nordic Tugs 42 Hull #001
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,553
RE: How many, and what size, bilge pumps do you have?

This is getting interesting.

DVD touched on a question I have, and that is the advisability of having a check valve in a bilge pump system.*

Our forward pump pushes the water (you hope it's water!) up about two feet before it exits through the hull; this in an approximate 5 foot hose run. When the pump stops the entire contents of the hose then drains back through the pump into the bilge, which is counter to the objective. A check valve at the pump discharge would presumably eliminate that issue.

However, as DVD mentions, if the check valve doesn't open in a timely fashion nothing gets pumped at all.

Another possible advantage to a remote bilge pump is that in tight quarters (directly under an engine for example) there may only be enough headroom for a pickup. I would think, although I've never had any direct experience, that a remote pump would be more than powerful enough to suck and push enough to get everything out - assuming that it is self priming.

Oh, and I would definitely have a separate hose/through hull for each pump; you don't want any restrictions in an emergency.
Conrad is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 02:53 PM   #7
Master and Commander
 
markpierce's Avatar
 
City: Vallejo CA
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Carquinez Coot
Vessel Model: 2011 Seahorse Marine Coot hull #6
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 10,254
RE: How many, and what size, bilge pumps do you have?

Not counting the shower sump, the Coot has three bilge pumps.* There are two electrical, 2000 GPH pumps: one under the forward cabin and one deep in the keel below the engine.* They both have float switches.* There is also a manual pump, capacity dependent upon the one pumping the handle.
markpierce is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 02:55 PM   #8
TF Site Team
 
Larry M's Avatar
 
City: JAX, FL
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Hobo
Vessel Model: Krogen 42-120
Join Date: Nov 2008
Posts: 5,725
RE: How many, and what size, bilge pumps do you have?

We have a 3700 GPH in the forward bilge plus an a high water alarm*in addition to the automatic float switch.* There is also a 500*GPH shower*sump pump that we could use in an emergency.

In the engine room/aft bilge we have a 2000 GPH with float switch and a high water alarm.

In the emergency leak bag we have a 3700 GPH pump (DC) with*20 foot leads and sized alligator clips with 25 feet of collapsible 1.5" hose with the idea we could use it in either bilge.* It's been tested but never used as intended.

*
Larry M is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 03:20 PM   #9
Guru
 
Tidahapah's Avatar
 
City: Mooloolaba
Country: Australia
Vessel Name: Tidahapah
Vessel Model: Bert Ellis Timber motor cruiser
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,779
RE: How many, and what size, bilge pumps do you have?

Bilge pumps , where do I start?
My main electric bilge pump in the Eng Rm is a rule 3000, activated by a normal float switch.
There are 3 main watertight compartments, the other 2 don't have sepearte bilge pumps but are connected thru the bilg pumping manifold that is pumped vai an electric clutch , main engine driven jabsco 1 1/4 " pump.
With this I can pump any individual compartment, this pump is also the deck/fire hose pump.
Also ther is a large diaphragm hand bilge pump that will pump from all 3 compartments.

The major back up is a submersible 240 Volt sump pump for my boat or another that I can get alongside.

There is no point in installing a pump with larger outlets than your existing hoses unless you are going to change them.
Tidahapah is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 03:22 PM   #10
Guru
 
Steve's Avatar
 
City: Thibodaux, Louisiana
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Gumbo
Vessel Model: 2003 Monk 36
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,605
RE: How many, and what size, bilge pumps do you have?

We have a 2000 Rule with float switch, and a whale gusher both OEM. I have often heard the manual us not really very useful if you get a leak. When no one is around nothing happens, and that in an emergency the flow will probably be more than one could keep up with you will probably be busy locating or trying to fix the leak, I don't really know what the capacity of these whale manual pumps is even with a scared pumper. I do carry a 110V. basement type pump which might be useful or not depending on the circumstance and if anyone is on board. I do plan to install an additional 2000 Rule 12V pump probably the same as the existing bilge pump but with the float mounted higher. I do have a very loud high water alarm mounted higher than the existing pump.
I pray none are tested in an emergency!
Steve W
Steve is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 03:36 PM   #11
TF Site Team
 
dwhatty's Avatar
 
City: Home Port: Buck's Harbor, Maine
Country: USA
Vessel Name: "Emily Anne"
Vessel Model: 2001 Island Gypsy 32 Europa (Hull #146)
Join Date: Sep 2008
Posts: 2,730
RE: How many, and what size, bilge pumps do you have?

Quote:
markpierce wrote:
Not counting the shower sump, the Coot has three bilge pumps.* There are two electrical, 2000 GPH pumps: one under the forward cabin and one deep in the keel below the engine.* They both have float switches.* There is also a manual pump, capacity dependent upon the one pumping the handle.
Same here. The manual one has a hand operated selectable valve so that one can choose between pumping the forward compartment (forward of the engine room bulkhead) or the aft compartment.
dwhatty is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 06:19 PM   #12
Guru
 
City: North Charleston, SC
Country: USA
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 4,390
RE: How many, and what size, bilge pumps do you have?

Well, this seems like a good time to get an answer to a question I have concerning my boat.

My bilge is divided into three sections. One forward where the holding tank is located, one in the center under the engine, and one aft.

The forward and aft sections each have a bilge pump but not the center section. Water has to build up to perhaps seven inches in depth before it overflows into the aft section and is pumped overboard by the aft bilge pump. This actually happened to me once when a water hose came off its fitting.

My educated guess is that this layout is intentional and is intended to keep from pumping oil overboard in case of an engine failure. That's the best I can come up with, perhaps someone can post an official reason. The boat was built in Canada in 1999.
rwidman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 06:38 PM   #13
Guru
 
swampu's Avatar


 
City: Biloxi, MS
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Cajun Rose
Vessel Model: Biloxi Lugger
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 1,144
RE: How many, and what size, bilge pumps do you have?

Nothing, nada..I've got a small one that I run every now and then buy wiring it up to a 12v. Of course the boat doesn't run yet so there is really no need. When it does run there are about 5 pumps and two "crash" pumps which are the 1 1/4" jabsco hooked to the 671's.
swampu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 06:40 PM   #14
Scraping Paint
 
City: -
Country: -
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 13,748
RE: How many, and what size, bilge pumps do you have?

Quote:
rwidman wrote:
My educated guess is that this layout is intentional and is intended to keep from pumping oil overboard in case of an engine failure.
*It is certainly plausible.* The narrowboats used on the canals in England, for example,*have separate bilge compartments under their engines and these compartments are separated from the rest of the boat's bilge by high sides, more than a foot in some cases, particularly on the older boats that used air-cooled Lister diesel engines.

Even if this was not done deliberately on your boat it seems like a*very good feature to have.
Marin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 06:45 PM   #15
Guru
 
swampu's Avatar


 
City: Biloxi, MS
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Cajun Rose
Vessel Model: Biloxi Lugger
Join Date: Jul 2011
Posts: 1,144
RE: How many, and what size, bilge pumps do you have?

Quote:
Marin wrote:rwidman wrote:
My educated guess is that this layout is intentional and is intended to keep from pumping oil overboard in case of an engine failure.
*It is certainly plausible.* The narrowboats used on the canals in England, for example,*have separate bilge compartments under their engines and these compartments are separated from the rest of the boat's bilge by high sides, more than a foot in some cases, particularly on the older boats that used air-cooled Lister diesel engines.

Even if this was not done deliberately on your boat it seems like a*very good feature to have.

*I've got some oil catch basins under my mains.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	img_0808.jpg
Views:	85
Size:	175.8 KB
ID:	9910  
swampu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 06:56 PM   #16
Guru
 
Steve's Avatar
 
City: Thibodaux, Louisiana
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Gumbo
Vessel Model: 2003 Monk 36
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,605
RE: How many, and what size, bilge pumps do you have?

Quote:
rwidman wrote:
Well, this seems like a good time to get an answer to a question I have concerning my boat.

My bilge is divided into three sections. One forward where the holding tank is located, one in the center under the engine, and one aft.

The forward and aft sections each have a bilge pump but not the center section. Water has to build up to perhaps seven inches in depth before it overflows into the aft section and is pumped overboard by the aft bilge pump. This actually happened to me once when a water hose came off its fitting.

My educated guess is that this layout is intentional and is intended to keep from pumping oil overboard in case of an engine failure. That's the best I can come up with, perhaps someone can post an official reason. The boat was built in Canada in 1999.

My 2003*Monk is Canadian built also, the area of the bilge below the engines is separated and has no bilge pump, like*the Camano.

Maybe a Canadian regulation?

Steve W
*
Steve is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 07:23 PM   #17
chc
Senior Member
 
chc's Avatar
 
City: Essex, MD
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Scooter
Vessel Model: 1984 Californian 34 LRC
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 310
RE: How many, and what size, bilge pumps do you have?

I have one Rule 3700 pump w/attached float switch & a Rule high water alarm located in the forward bilge area. In the aft part of the engine room, I have a Rule 2000 pump w/ a float switch. There is also a Whale manual located in the engiine room on the forward bulkhead; probably useless in a sinking situation; who wants to sit in a flooding engine and work a manual pump.
chc is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 07:27 PM   #18
Guru
 
Forkliftt's Avatar
 
City: Biloxi Mississippi
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Patricia Louise II
Vessel Model: 1983 42' Present Sundeck
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 2,433
RE: How many, and what size, bilge pumps do you have?

I have a smaller size Rule with the Water Witch bilge switch I recently installed in place of the float switch, and a separate Rule 3700 I installed about 2 years ago that is a few inches higher than the small pump. I installed a new through hull and lines for this pump and I have it wired into the horn for a high water alarm.
Forkliftt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 07:39 PM   #19
Guru
 
Keith's Avatar
 
Vessel Name: Anastasia III
Vessel Model: Krogen 42
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 2,716
RE: How many, and what size, bilge pumps do you have?

I have 2 "normal" ones. The other one is a high water, emergency bilge pump that sets off a very loud alarm outside if it activates. The main and emergency both have Ultra pump switches:

http://www.wolfwire.com/tefgel/pumpswitch.htm
Keith is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 02-01-2012, 08:13 PM   #20
Senior Member
 
HeyJude's Avatar
 
City: Boerne, Tx
Country: USA
Vessel Name: HEY JUDE
Vessel Model: Kadey Krogen 36 Manatee #46
Join Date: Jan 2011
Posts: 220
RE: How many, and what size, bilge pumps do you have?

I have two, both Rule 3700, the primary in the ER, other under the galley, ~ 12" higher. I have a fiberglass pan under the engine & transmission, to catch any oil leak I assume.
__________________

HeyJude is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
what size packing to use? Daddyo Power Systems 4 03-26-2012 12:58 PM
Avatar size? JohnP How To Use The Forum, Site News & Account Concerns 4 02-27-2011 07:27 AM
What size pump ? Dswizzler General Discussion 1 12-28-2010 09:09 PM
Waste pumps rochepoint Other Trawler Systems 15 07-31-2009 04:26 AM
Font size Arild How To Use The Forum, Site News & Account Concerns 1 10-12-2007 04:25 AM




All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:26 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012