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10-18-2019, 10:55 AM
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#1
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Veteran Member
City: San Diego
Vessel Name: Wiggle Room
Vessel Model: Spendrift 58
Join Date: Sep 2013
Posts: 41
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Flush Raw Water System
I would like to acid flush the raw water systems of my Cat 3208 engines. Does muriatic acid mixed 15 to 1 with fresh water make a good flushing chemical. The commercial flushes seem expensive.
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10-18-2019, 11:10 AM
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#2
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Guru
City: Mississippi
Vessel Name: ADAGIO
Vessel Model: CHB Present 42 Sundeck
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 920
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Barnacle Buster is about $80/gal and makes 5 gal after mixing with water. Works great, but I'm sure someone can chime in with a 'homemade' version that works also, using the same chemicals.
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10-18-2019, 11:38 AM
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#3
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Moderator Emeritus
City: Au Gres, MI
Vessel Name: Black Dog
Vessel Model: Formula 41PC
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 21,185
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I use BB also, worked great.
__________________
Boat Nut:
If you are one there is no explanation necessary.
If you aren’t one, there is no explanation possible.
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10-18-2019, 12:05 PM
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#4
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Senior Member
City: La Conner, WA
Vessel Name: Carousel
Vessel Model: Bayliner 4788 (1998)
Join Date: Jun 2018
Posts: 249
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I'm a Barnacle Buster believer also. I put the mix in a 5 gallon bucket then circulate it though the system with a cheap bilge pump. Be sure to remove any engine / cooler zincs when using it.
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10-18-2019, 12:13 PM
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#5
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Valued Technical Contributor
City: Litchfield, Ct
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 6,785
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I worked in the chemical cleaning industry early in my career. We used a 30% solution of muriatic acid in water for dissolving heavy water scale on heat exchanger tubes, the same thing at work in your raw water system. That dilution gives you a solution that is about 10% HCl by weight as commercial muriatic acid is about 32%.
We found that scale dissolving capability dies off at about 5% HCl by weight or about 6 parts water to 1 of acid.
So 15:1 is way too low.
Barnacle Buster is based on phosphoric acid I think. It doesn't produce the same irritating fumes that muriatic acid does, but it doesn't work as well. But it seems to work well enough.
David
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10-18-2019, 12:57 PM
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#6
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Guru
City: Gig Harbor
Vessel Name: Kinship
Vessel Model: North Pacific 43
Join Date: May 2015
Posts: 9,046
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I started flushing the raw water system with fresh water after every use. My hope is that it will reduce the buildup of deposits and rust.
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10-18-2019, 01:13 PM
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#7
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Guru
City: Seattle, WA
Vessel Name: Pau Hana
Vessel Model: 1989 PT52 Overseas Yachtfisher
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 2,676
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Another voter for Barnacle Buster here- worked wonders on my 3208TAs.
__________________
Peter- Marine Insurance Guru at Novamar Insurance Group (206-350-5051) & tuna fishing addict!
1989 52' PT Overseas yachtfisher
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10-18-2019, 02:08 PM
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#8
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Guru
City: Duvall, Wa. USA
Vessel Name: Beach Music II
Vessel Model: 2003 Mainship 430 Trawler
Join Date: Aug 2014
Posts: 1,040
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Our engines get flushed with fresh water during the 2 hour trip from the locks to our slip in Lake Washington. This winter I will be removing and checking the heat exchangers, oil coolers, exhaust elbows, and aftercoolers for the first time in their life after 17 years and 2000 engine hours. I'll report on what I find.
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10-18-2019, 04:26 PM
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#9
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Guru
City: Nanaimo
Vessel Name: former owner of "Pilitak"
Vessel Model: Nordic Tug 37
Join Date: Feb 2018
Posts: 1,703
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My cooling system (raw water side) was completely "cleaned" off the engine in early 2017. Just today, I replaced my gear oil cooler with a new one that has zincs (the old one does not). The saltwater side of my old gear cooler was "spotless", however, I freshwater flush my engine as often as I can, and store the engine with a solution of "salt away" inside for the winter. I have an oil pan heater that runs throughout the winter and freezing temps are rare here in southern (coastal) BC.
I am a big believer in the benefits of freshwater flushing, and it only takes about 10 minutes to do it.
Tom
__________________
Tom
Nanaimo, BC
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10-18-2019, 07:19 PM
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#10
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Guru
City: Upstate,SC
Vessel Name: Shipoopi
Vessel Model: derilic sailboat
Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 2,884
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__________________
This is my signature line. There are many like it but this one is mine.
What a pain in the transom.
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10-21-2019, 07:52 AM
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#11
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Senior Member
City: Watch Hill RI
Vessel Name: Puffin
Vessel Model: Nordic Tug 32/34
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 172
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I did a Barnacle Buster recirculating flush of my engine several years ago. It did a good job, and it's much cheaper than Rydlyme. For the last couple of years I've been using a product called "Acid Magic". It's a buffered (no skin irritation) muriatic acid product used for cleaning pools. Costs about $10 per gallon. I've been up in a fresh water river slip for the last several years, so I end up doing a fresh water flush coming and going. Now as part of winterization, I pour in a 10:1 solution of Acid Magic into raw water side, let it sit for an hour or so, then flush with 6 gallons of fresh water and a box of baking soda to neutraize any acid, followed by a fresh water flush. Don't forget to plug you're raw water hose going into any dripless shaft seal. Any acid MAY cause damage to the bellows. After 14 seasons, I had a leaking gasket on my Cummins 6BTA heat exchanger. Replaced the end cap and gasket this year and interior of heat exchanger was perfectly clean.
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10-21-2019, 09:25 AM
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#12
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Guru
City: Palmetto
Vessel Name: Wanderlust
Vessel Model: 1999 Jefferson Rivanna 52'
Join Date: Feb 2018
Posts: 713
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As David said, 15:1 is a weak enough ratio to be pretty much ineffective. He knows chemical stuff.
Muriatic acid is "old school" and was the solution to use for years. I've seen a couple of times where, used wrong, it can actually damage thinner metals. Makes me leary of the stuff.
Barnacle Buster is Phosphoric acid with a couple of other non-corrosive chemicals added in. It dissolves organic matter without damaging metal or rubber. Instead of paying $80 per gallon for Barnacle Buster, I go to Home Depot and pick up a gallon of phosphoric acid in the paint department for about $17. I fill a 5 gal bucket about half full and pour in the acid. It's a little stronger than the recommended mix of BB but it does the trick very nicely on our engines, generator, and a/c units.
John
__________________
John Easley
USCG 100 ton Master
1999 Jefferson Rivanna 52’
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10-21-2019, 09:44 AM
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#13
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Senior Member
City: Seattle
Vessel Name: Mabuhay
Vessel Model: Grand Alaskan
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 399
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I haven't done this before and would love to see pics of your setups, adapters for tapping into the cooling systems hoses and such. Heck, bonus if you have Cat 3196 mains? Thanks
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10-21-2019, 10:09 AM
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#14
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Valued Technical Contributor
City: Litchfield, Ct
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 6,785
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Here are a couple of pics of the setup to circulate Barnacle Buster through the raw water system of a Yanmar 6LY.
The first is the bucket with the hose to the injection elbow pulled off and stuck in the bucket. There is a small bilge pump in the bucket which discharges to the clear braided hose in the picture. The hose taped to the injection elbow is a water hose to supply water to it so I could run the engine periodically to keep it warm. Outside temps when I did this were in the mid 40s.
The second pic is of the discharge hose connected to the outlet hose from the removed raw water pump using pvc fittings. Note the mounting place for the pump is blanked off so I could run the engine and not get oil all over the place.
Other engines can be done more or less the same way. If it isn't easy to get to the raw water pump discharge, then remove the impeller, reinstall the outer plate and hook up to the raw water supply hose from the strainer. Make sure and clamp off any raw water hose to the prop shaft gland and remove all zincs and reinstall the brass plugs.
David
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10-21-2019, 10:29 AM
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#15
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Senior Member
City: Seattle
Vessel Name: Mabuhay
Vessel Model: Grand Alaskan
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 399
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Thanks!
Why do you need to clamp off the prop shaft gland, is the flushing fluid bad for the gland?
Btw I like your fresh water adaptor to the top of your raw water strainer.
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10-21-2019, 10:38 AM
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#16
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Guru
City: Annapolis
Vessel Name: Ranger
Vessel Model: 58' Sedan Bridge
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 7,088
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Quote:
Originally Posted by w8n4sun
Why do you need to clamp off the prop shaft gland, is the flushing fluid bad for the gland?
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If you mean the dripless shaft seal hose, it's because the "product" (BB, Rydlyme, whatever) disappears overboard out through the shaft seals if used in a recirculating process.
-Chris
__________________
Chesapeake Bay, USA
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10-21-2019, 11:10 AM
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#17
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Senior Member
City: Seattle
Vessel Name: Mabuhay
Vessel Model: Grand Alaskan
Join Date: Jan 2018
Posts: 399
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D'oh, that was a dumb question!
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10-21-2019, 12:19 PM
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#18
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Moderator Emeritus
City: Au Gres, MI
Vessel Name: Black Dog
Vessel Model: Formula 41PC
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 21,185
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It is a PITA to remove my impellers to recirculate the BB so I used a Sea Flush to suck the BB into the engine through the strainer. When the 5 gallons has been sucked in I shut down the engine and let it sit for about 7 hours then start the engine and flush the BB out the exhaust. My engine temps dropped 5 degrees on one engine and 10 degrees on the other engine. Doing it this way takes about 5 minutes to get the BB into the engine.
__________________
Boat Nut:
If you are one there is no explanation necessary.
If you aren’t one, there is no explanation possible.
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10-21-2019, 01:04 PM
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#19
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Guru
City: Palmetto
Vessel Name: Wanderlust
Vessel Model: 1999 Jefferson Rivanna 52'
Join Date: Feb 2018
Posts: 713
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Comodave
It is a PITA to remove my impellers to recirculate the BB so I used a Sea Flush to suck the BB into the engine through the strainer. When the 5 gallons has been sucked in I shut down the engine and let it sit for about 7 hours then start the engine and flush the BB out the exhaust. My engine temps dropped 5 degrees on one engine and 10 degrees on the other engine. Doing it this way takes about 5 minutes to get the BB into the engine.
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My impellers are easy to get to and I still use the Sea Flush approach. So darned convenient!
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10-21-2019, 01:18 PM
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#20
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Moderator Emeritus
City: Au Gres, MI
Vessel Name: Black Dog
Vessel Model: Formula 41PC
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 21,185
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Yes, the Sea Flush is definitely a great system. I am getting ready to use mine to winterize my engines hopefully on Thursday if the yard gets the other boats in the barn so we can go in last. No affiliation just a really satisfied customer.
__________________
Boat Nut:
If you are one there is no explanation necessary.
If you aren’t one, there is no explanation possible.
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