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09-07-2017, 08:19 PM
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#1
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TF Site Team
City: Paris,TN
Vessel Name: Slo-Poke
Vessel Model: Jorgensen custom 44
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 3,749
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Varnish Maintenance
After 3 years it's time for some varnish maintenance. We hit the aft sections of cap rail with 220 grit today and the plan is to apply two or three maintenance coats . The weather is going to be just right for next few days . We are just going to do sections at a time .
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09-07-2017, 08:24 PM
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#2
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TF Site Team
City: Paris,TN
Vessel Name: Slo-Poke
Vessel Model: Jorgensen custom 44
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 3,749
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Using Epifanes high gloss .
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09-07-2017, 09:11 PM
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#3
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TF Site Team
City: California Delta
Vessel Name: FlyWright
Vessel Model: 1977 Marshall Californian 34 LRC
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 13,728
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If I had an admiral with Joy's brush talents, I'd be doing more varnishing, too!
I know I should be working on it more, but playing onboard is sooo much more fun!
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09-07-2017, 09:22 PM
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#4
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TF Site Team
City: Paris,TN
Vessel Name: Slo-Poke
Vessel Model: Jorgensen custom 44
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 3,749
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I'm sure we won't get it all done, it's good cruising time around here also and William (knock on wood ) is running the best since we've owned him . It's taken 5 years but we've worked out a lot of bugs .
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Marty
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09-07-2017, 09:29 PM
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#5
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Master and Commander
City: Vallejo CA
Vessel Name: Carquinez Coot
Vessel Model: penultimate Seahorse Marine Coot hull #6
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 12,559
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My tactic is to have no exterior wood.
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Kar-KEEN-ez Koot
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09-07-2017, 09:31 PM
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#6
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TF Site Team
City: Paris,TN
Vessel Name: Slo-Poke
Vessel Model: Jorgensen custom 44
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 3,749
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Quote:
Originally Posted by markpierce
My tactic is to have no exterior wood.
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That's a good one to have . Maybe on our next boat .
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Marty
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09-07-2017, 10:19 PM
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#7
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Guru
City: Sydney
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 1,646
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Even my Weber BBQ has wooden handles it gives it character it separates it from a garbage bin
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09-08-2017, 07:14 AM
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#8
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Senior Member
City: Woodbridge UK
Vessel Name: MV Content
Vessel Model: Fellows & Stewart 58' Pilothouse Cutter
Join Date: Dec 2013
Posts: 116
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What is the epifanes going to top of?
I've got Cetol on my rails: would the epifanes stick to that?
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09-08-2017, 07:38 AM
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#9
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TF Site Team
City: Paris,TN
Vessel Name: Slo-Poke
Vessel Model: Jorgensen custom 44
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 3,749
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We are applying this on top of 3 year old Epifanes . We replaced all the the teak 4 years ago and Epifanes is the only varnish this teak has ever seen .
If the Cetol is in good shape and not flaking off I would think that if you scuff up the Cetol and apply Epifanes thinned for the first coat it would work . I would talk to the Epifanes guys first . Some finishes are not compatible with each other . If you're happy with the Cetol it might be best to stick with it .
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Marty
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09-08-2017, 09:40 AM
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#10
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Guru
City: Concrete Washington State
Vessel Name: Willy
Vessel Model: Willard Nomad 30'
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 18,743
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Oil based (Epifanes) should be compatible w any other oil based coating. I could assume Cetol is oil based but I really don't know what it is. But if it's well cured, sanded and cleaned there should be no problem w compatibility.
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Eric
North Western Washington State USA
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09-08-2017, 12:21 PM
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#11
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TF Site Team
City: Paris,TN
Vessel Name: Slo-Poke
Vessel Model: Jorgensen custom 44
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 3,749
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Yes Al , I'm a lucky guy . Joy just sent me these pics from the boat today . She is laying on the varnish today while I'm at work . She says it goes on like butter .
I will do all the prep work , and keep those high quality brushes she likes clean as long as she wants to lay down the varnish .
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09-08-2017, 02:29 PM
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#12
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Guru
City: Concrete Washington State
Vessel Name: Willy
Vessel Model: Willard Nomad 30'
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 18,743
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"She says it goes on like butter"
Nice thick varnish is a joy to put on.
A pain to take off.
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Eric
North Western Washington State USA
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09-08-2017, 02:56 PM
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#13
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TF Site Team
City: Paris,TN
Vessel Name: Slo-Poke
Vessel Model: Jorgensen custom 44
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 3,749
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nomad Willy
"She says it goes on like butter"
Nice thick varnish is a joy to put on.
A pain to take off.
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Eric I think you know me better than that .If you put on right there's no reason to take it off .We thin Epifanes at least 20% before applying .
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09-08-2017, 06:58 PM
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#14
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Guru
City: Concrete Washington State
Vessel Name: Willy
Vessel Model: Willard Nomad 30'
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 18,743
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Marty,
We thin McKloski's spar varnish only on prep coats.
We use turpentine and kerosene to thin first and second coats about 1/3 each. As we go less kerosene and more varnish. Kerosene is used only as a penetrant and before any build. Then less turp until we're at 100% varnish.
All varnish needs to come off after several years but ours is holding up really well in our covered moorage. Only problem now is dust.
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Eric
North Western Washington State USA
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09-08-2017, 08:17 PM
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#15
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TF Site Team
City: Paris,TN
Vessel Name: Slo-Poke
Vessel Model: Jorgensen custom 44
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 3,749
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nomad Willy
Marty,
We thin McKloski's spar varnish only on prep coats.
We use turpentine and kerosene to thin first and second coats about 1/3 each. As we go less kerosene and more varnish. Kerosene is used only as a penetrant and before any build. Then less turp until we're at 100% varnish.
All varnish needs to come off after several years but ours is holding up really well in our covered moorage. Only problem now is dust.
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Yes we usually wind up at something close to 100% at the final coats but Epifanes is so thick especially if it's a can that has been opened a couple times.
If it gets too hard to flow I add a little Penatrol , maybe a capful. Then it glides. I also add Penatrol to oil base paint to help it flow.
__________________
Marty
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09-11-2017, 06:52 PM
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#16
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Guru
City: Between Oregon and Alaska
Vessel Name: Charlie Harper
Vessel Model: Wheeler Shipyard 83'
Join Date: Jun 2016
Posts: 3,023
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If you go to bare wood, 2 -3 coats of West Systems epoxy gets you to that deep varnished look faster. It still has to have a couple coats of varnish to protect the epoxy from UV. But it ends up looking like a dozen coats of varnish. I been doing it a long time and this is the fastest, long lasting way I found. But, I painted the varnish on most of the exterior on my boat.
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09-11-2017, 07:46 PM
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#17
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Guru
City: Concrete Washington State
Vessel Name: Willy
Vessel Model: Willard Nomad 30'
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 18,743
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Lepke,
How do you remove the epoxie when you want to wood down?
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Eric
North Western Washington State USA
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09-11-2017, 07:56 PM
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#18
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Guru
City: Anacortes
Join Date: Mar 2016
Posts: 588
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San Juan Yachts was all into that epoxy first then varnish, until they had to strip off a bunch of epoxy that had yellowed because the owner didn't keep on top of the varnish. Then they quit using epoxy.
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09-11-2017, 07:57 PM
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#19
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Grand Vizier
Join Date: Jan 2010
Posts: 3,816
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nomad Willy
Lepke,
How do you remove the epoxie when you want to wood down?
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It doesn't soak very deeply into the wood, and epoxy sands just like wood does. 80 grit on an orbital and its gone. I would put sanding Jatoba more difficult than sanding epoxy and I have done hours and hours of both. If you want to get maximum longevity out of varnish, create a base of epoxy over wood and varnish away as if the epoxy wasn't there.
__________________
"Dad always thought laughter was the best medicine, which I guess is why several of us died of tuberculosis." - Jack Handey
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09-11-2017, 08:24 PM
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#20
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TF Site Team
City: Paris,TN
Vessel Name: Slo-Poke
Vessel Model: Jorgensen custom 44
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 3,749
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Delfin
It doesn't soak very deeply into the wood, and epoxy sands just like wood does. 80 grit on an orbital and its gone. I would put sanding Jatoba more difficult than sanding epoxy and I have done hours and hours of both. If you want to get maximum longevity out of varnish, create a base of epoxy over wood and varnish away as if the epoxy wasn't there.
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I wanted to try this from the beginning but just didn't know enough about it. It was new teak lumber that we had several man hours in making new rails,new doors,hatch and bulkhead.
I learned varnish and painting from my Dad. He always told me to keep same brand name products together. He was old school. I remember him saying varnishing raw lumber is like dating, you don't want to lay it on thick in the beginning, thin the first few coats to allow varnish to get to know the raw lumber then you can lay it on heavy. I miss him, he was a damn good painter. I still have some of his brushes. I do ok at varnish but nothing like him .
This is after 8 coats. Dad always said that magic doesn't happen until coat 13.
Most all of our rails are laminated up to get the curve and width. They would have looked better had I used a one piece rail. I had to laminate because it was the only way to make the yield work out on the lumber otherwise I would've had several short pieces and several scarf joints and a bunch of cutoff pieces that wouldn't have been good for anything. Now we have kind of a butcher block look.
__________________
Marty
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