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Old 05-23-2016, 12:01 PM   #1
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Bilge Pump Selection

While having the opportunity to explore the mostly normally hidden nether of the boat while the leaking fuel tanks are pulled, I discovered my aft bilge pump (a PAR diaphragm) isn't pumping. Advised by my yard that it's probably the valves and/or diaphragm - a Jabsco service kit should take care of it.

Recognizing the advantage of the PAR to deal with a net negative suction head (needed the way the pump was located by the boat manufacturer), I'm trying to figure out the next step.

I believe the PAR pump I have is a Jabsco 37202-0000 - rated 270 gph, 7.5 a @ 12v. Replace with new ~ $330. Service kit ~ $100 if rebuildable + labor. Situation probably prevents me from DYI, so some unknown labor additional.

A Rule 3700 plus a float switch is about $220, and I could see installing that myself on a weekend afternoon.

To be clear, I understand the BS capacity rating system used by Rule (and maybe Jabsco), but even discounting Rule's numbers by 60% to account for discharge lift, hose size, voltage droop, etc. - it looks like I can get 5X the flow capacity for considerably less cost.

What am I missing?

Also - what's the deal on Rule's "Gold" series? I know it's touted for "commercial" service, apparently due to its "double insulated long-stack motor". Do I care?

Thank you, as always.
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Old 05-23-2016, 12:12 PM   #2
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Go with the Rule and use a diaphragm pump to suck the bilge as dry as possible.
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Old 05-23-2016, 01:40 PM   #3
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Appreciate it, Bill.
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Old 05-23-2016, 02:08 PM   #4
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I vote for "both" as well. Depco pump in Clearwater can typically do the rebuild for you, excellent work and fair pricing. Good place to buy your Rule from as well and they can advise which one. (727) 446-1656
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Old 05-23-2016, 09:44 PM   #5
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If you don't have a second pump that is high volume already. I would go for the larger pump. Keep in mind the rule uses 1.5" discharge hose and will likely require heavier power wire.

If you already have a large pump, I would go with the Rule 1500.

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Old 05-23-2016, 10:21 PM   #6
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I vote for both as well. The PAR doesn't move much water but it'll suck the bilge pretty dry. The big Rule will keep you afloat longer in an emergency. Bilge pumps are like chain and ammunition, you can never have to much.
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Old 05-24-2016, 12:45 AM   #7
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Just make sure the pump can lift the water high enough. A friend just relegated a 1000gph bilge pump to his dinghy because it could not pump the water up from the bottom bilge to the outside of his boat.

And you can never have too many bilge pumps. Seaweed has two 2k ghp Johnsons and an 800 gph SeaSense. That's sufficient for 23'.

All are tested monthly. *not just that the pump will come one via float switch and the one on the panel, but also with real water. I had a pump "come on" and not pump. So I flood the bilges once a month and pump make sure those big ones work.

Good luck.
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Old 05-24-2016, 07:00 AM   #8
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Ideally, you'd get a 3700 as a high water pump, backing up something like a 2000 every day pump for incidental water. The 3700 uses a lot more power, thus will drain the batteries quicker.
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Old 05-24-2016, 08:13 AM   #9
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I have never been a fan of the Jabsco style diaphragm pump, just looks like something designed in the stone age with way too many moving parts and way too many ways to fail. That said now that you have one, they will suck the bilge dryer than a submersible pump like the Rule, which has 1 (one) moving part (but is submerged.)

Both sound like good advice, but 3700 sounds like overkill, a 2000 or 1500 uses 1-1/8" hose.

All pump manufacturers use 0 zero head numbers, so at least when you compare GPH its apples to apples.

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Old 05-24-2016, 12:02 PM   #10
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Hi Keys, they were designed in the Stone Age. The PAR in their name stands for Peters and Russell. I think the pumps were designed in the forties. Jabsco bought PAR in the sixties, I think.

The tooling to make them is wearing out and Jabsco is not planning to replace it.
Jabsco has already discontinued several models.
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Old 05-24-2016, 03:43 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Capt.Bill11 View Post
Go with the Rule and use a diaphragm pump to suck the bilge as dry as possible.
Another vote for having both types of bilge pump.

IMHO bilge-pump failure often occurs because submersible bilge pumps (Rule etc) really don't like being submerged for extended periods. Either a seal fails letting water into the motor, or the wiring insulation gets brittle and fails due to oil in the bilge water.

The little Jabsco can suck up the last drops. It should be mounted high and dry on a shelf. A strainer in the suction line is advisable as the Jabsco's flap valves don't like grit and debris. One or more Rule-type submersible pumps should be mounted high enough in the bilge that they only gets wet if the Jabsco cannot cope with the inflow of water. Suitably located float-switches should control each. Thus, under normal circumstances, the only component that gets wet is the end of the Jabsco's suction pipe.

I am fortunate to have a bilge-sump. It lends itself to this type of arrangement and getting the last drops is easy.
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Old 05-24-2016, 05:57 PM   #12
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Nice set up!
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Old 05-24-2016, 08:16 PM   #13
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Thanks Poach. I was obviously feeling rather proud of myself when I took the pic - just finished the installation. Believe me it doesn't look as pretty as that now!
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Old 05-30-2016, 08:21 PM   #14
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Yes, nicely done!
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Old 06-07-2016, 06:42 PM   #15
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Thanks for the advice, all. Wound up using a 2K Rule as the replacement since it works with the existing through hull.. Pulled the PAR and found it's diaphragm shot.

What's curious to me is the fact that Viking placed it all the way aft. The actual bilge low point is well forward on the boat when at rest. On plane, the aft position would (maybe) be the low point. So it seems to me that the scavenging properties of the PAR would be wasted.

Think I'll rebuild the PAR and place it in the low bilge pocket and use it as intended. That will augment the Rule that's already there.
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Old 06-07-2016, 11:55 PM   #16
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This is a pretty good primer on bilge pumps:
Exploring Bilge Pump Styles - Jabsco
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