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Old 05-02-2013, 11:23 AM   #21
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by the way...only one of those spots showed up on the survey
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Old 05-02-2013, 12:03 PM   #22
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Not to throw a wet blanket (no pun intended) on the consideration of the boat, and also not to be too presumptuous as a new member, but you might want to peruse some of the things written by the surveyor David Pascoe on core issues on his website -

Yacht Survey Online: David Pascoe, Marine Surveyor

Pascoe may be a somewhat controversial figure; sometimes when I've mentioned his name and his writings, it has elicited very strong feelings from some people (usually boat brokers or those selling a boat). But, I personally have found his work very educational - if I was looking at a boat in Florida, I would want him to do the survey.
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Old 05-02-2013, 12:13 PM   #23
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Just wanted to thank everyone for taking the time to reply and share your opinions and experiences.

We will have the full written surveys in by tomorrow and will go back to the negotiating table with our eyes wide open. At this point we are definitely prepared to walk away.

Just want to clarify that there were a number of other fairly large issues that came up in the survey but this was the only one that elicited such a passionate, differing response between the surveyor and the broker. In fact the broker told me that if he brought out ten other surveyors they would all agree with him and not even list this as an issue. Obviously being at the survey and seeing all this with my own eyes I find that really hard to believe and is what prompted me to seek some objective opinions here. I will keep you all posted on how it goes.

Thanks again.
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Old 05-02-2013, 12:23 PM   #24
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The real oddity that stood out to me was the distance from the leak you pointed out to the soft spot at the stanchion. With the hatch directly between those two spots, I wonder how moisture migrated from the leak to the stanchion area? It does not seem all that possible to me. The only way apparent to me is that moisture migrated through the core from the leak area, across the bridge, around the hatch and settled in the stanchion area. Either that or there is another as yet undiscovered leak in the stanchion area, possibly at the stanchion mounting point. What that points out to me is that there may more extensive water ingress than you have yet discovered.

As to the broker's statement, it is just his, and the seller's, bad luck that you hired what seems to be a pretty competent surveyor rather than one of his ten!
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Old 05-02-2013, 12:25 PM   #25
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Just wanted to thank everyone for taking the time to reply and share your opinions and experiences.

We will have the full written surveys in by tomorrow and will go back to the negotiating table with our eyes wide open. At this point we are definitely prepared to walk away.

Just want to clarify that there were a number of other fairly large issues that came up in the survey but this was the only one that elicited such a passionate, differing response between the surveyor and the broker. In fact the broker told me that if he brought out ten other surveyors they would all agree with him and not even list this as an issue. Obviously being at the survey and seeing all this with my own eyes I find that really hard to believe and is what prompted me to seek some objective opinions here. I will keep you all posted on how it goes.

Thanks again.
"... broker told me that if he brought out ten other surveyors they would all agree with him and not even list this as an issue."

Wonder how many boat buyers that broker has screwed?? Just for S&G... Ask him how many thousands of dollar$$$$ in repair cost does it take for him before he calls it "an issue"?

Tell him you may purchase if he fully pays for all the needed rot repairs - by an accomplished marine repair shop! I'd love to hear his answers!
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Old 05-02-2013, 12:37 PM   #26
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I would have to say that you've run into a scum bag broker. If this deal doesn't work out, run, don't walk away from this piece of excrement.
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Old 05-02-2013, 12:40 PM   #27
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The real oddity that stood out to me was the distance from the leak you pointed out to the soft spot at the stanchion. With the hatch directly between those two spots, I wonder how moisture migrated from the leak to the stanchion area? It does not seem all that possible to me. The only way apparent to me is that moisture migrated through the core from the leak area, across the bridge, around the hatch and settled in the stanchion area. Either that or there is another as yet undiscovered leak in the stanchion area, possibly at the stanchion mounting point. What that points out to me is that there may more extensive water ingress than you have yet discovered.

As to the broker's statement, it is just his, and the seller's, bad luck that you hired what seems to be a pretty competent surveyor rather than one of his ten!
THD I can't say that I disagree with you. The same thought crossed my mind, and it's why I put the blue line on the picture I uploaded. I have a theory I won't go into, but it sounds like you and I are sharing very similar thoughts.
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Old 05-02-2013, 01:46 PM   #28
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Jason, IF this deal falls apart go out and find a decent "buyers broker".

I suspect this broker is representing the seller otherwise I don't understand his objections to the issues. Also the price not being a good deal you alluded to in your original post.

Just my opinion and perhaps worth less than you payed me for it.
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Old 05-02-2013, 04:08 PM   #29
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I always heard above the waterline, the buyers problem. Below the sellers. So if that is still the same I would ask for a discount and see how far he will go.

I've seen lots of core patch jobs and they can be done as a DIY project and never even get close to 9 grand. If it were mine I'd have it done in a few weeks and I'd use a better core than they did and I'd use epoxy, not polyester. It would outlast the boat then.

Good luck and I hope it works out in your corner.
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Old 05-02-2013, 05:47 PM   #30
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I agree. in my boat I suspect there were lots of times there may have been gallons of water stored up there as it had no place to go...no vents or drains...there will be now...
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Old 05-02-2013, 06:02 PM   #31
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I think the problems stem from simply drilling screw holes into the core and never sealing the holes. On my wood boat I through bolt after I drill a hole and then seal all the wood with epoxy. 2 coats. It seems to be working good for me too. This way I'm not relying on a sealant that can wear away or dry out to do the sealing.
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Old 05-02-2013, 09:45 PM   #32
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Jason,

Two years ago we walked on a Mainship 40 with the same problem. Water started running out of the flybridge overhang after the boat was launched. Boat had been on the hard for over a year. We put on new zinks and painted the bottom after it passed the first part of the survey.

There were some problems with the batteries and turbo the owner was willing to fix but not the leak or repairing the soggy core. We walked. Best $1,000.00 I ever spent.

Rob

p.s. That was here in Mystic!
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Old 05-03-2013, 05:56 AM   #33
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Interesting that the broker would have 10 surveyors in his pocket.

ALWAYS best to avoid a surveyor suggested by any broker.
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Old 05-03-2013, 07:10 AM   #34
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Jason, just to bring things back into real world focus a bit, one of the things I had to accept if I was ever to enjoy my 1975 vintage boat, which was what I could afford without financing, is that she would never be perfect. No matter what I did.

Having accepted that, I then tried to approach it along the lines of what had to be done to function properly and for seaworthiness.
After that came improving the looks, but in a way where it did not cost a disproportionate amount to achieve something which did not add much to function or safety. Having the hull two-packed was one example, it improved the looks hugely. Another was the new extended cockpit and side deck canopy, another. See avatar. I completely redid the interior and repainted top sides myself.

Then there was stuff I had to accept I could not justify doing, because it would just cost too much, with virtually no gain in function or seaworthiness.
Two examples of this were the hull blisters, which are quite a number but only ten to twenty cent sized, and have been left alone, and have not altered over the 12 years I have owned her.
The other was a patch of slightly soft deck on the rear part of the fly bridge just where all the traffic lands when when folks go up the ladder to that area. The PO had had the old teak decks stripped off, reinforced, and rebuilt with fibreglass nonskid. However they, like me, accepted this soft spot because there was no leak into the ceiling below, and it had not enlarged over time, nor has it in the time I have owned it. To repair it, would require ripping out a lot of the ceiling inside, or similar area of fibreglass deck above, possibly both, and to achieve what..? A firmer area to step on, and the knowledge it had been done. Cost effective...I doubt it.

To a prospective buyer my response will be if you want a 34 foot boat which works well, does all you would want, and looks pretty ok, this is $X.
If you want one which does the same thing, but newer and nearer perfection, (only nearer, none are perfect), then you will find one, but it will be $4X at least. That's my take on it. If I had wanted a near perfect boat, I'd still be waiting. I have already enjoyed 12 years of boating/cruising by aiming lower, avoiding debt to service, doing a lot myself, getting a pro to do it when that really mattered, and accepting less than perfect.
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Old 05-03-2013, 07:40 AM   #35
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FYI that amount of soft core is no big deal to fix. I repaired most of the flybridge on my ex a 1978 Mainship. The rot around the hatch similar to yours was actually the easiest spot to repair. In actuality you're talking a weekend's work if you are at all handy. Maybe a third day to buff out the gelcoat.
While I would still do some negotiating, I wouldn't let this be a deal breaker.
By the way I boated out of Gwenmor in Mystic for 20 + years. Now I am "mobile" during the summer.
I have a power point with a few slides of my core repair if you are interested. e mail me at leonaj99@yahoo.com if you want to see what I did.
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Old 05-03-2013, 03:50 PM   #36
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We did end up walking away from the boat. The soft spot was only one of the issues, but combined with the other items the surveyor found we just found ourselves not willing to go through with the deal. The broker was great about it all and we have nothing but nice things to say about him.

JLeonard, we spoke with Gwenmor many times during this process, and may still end up there if we find something. Great spot and loved the people that work there!

Datenight are you over there in Spicers? We've spoken to Johny Mac many times during our quest to find a boat.

Well - hopefully my wife and I will be joining you all in the Mystic waters soon.
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Old 05-03-2013, 03:58 PM   #37
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We did end up walking away from the boat. The soft spot was only one of the issues, but combined with the other items the surveyor found we just found ourselves not willing to go through with the deal.
IMO, damn good decision and evidence that "although you loved the boat", logic prevailed in the end. This process will serve you well in your trawlering days ahead.
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Old 05-03-2013, 04:04 PM   #38
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Jason-sounds like you made a good, thoughtful decision. Sometimes not so easy to do when it comes to boats or women!

May "your boat" be at the end of the next dock you walk down!
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Old 05-03-2013, 09:40 PM   #39
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so he did not buy the boat...from this thread ( I think there was only one who did not feel rot was an issue)and his decision I would say that soft spot was indeed a deal breaker. the value of the boat is directtly affected by it. Rot grows...you have to stop it or one day your guests are going to step right through that soft spot and the damage will be far greater after all the time it has been neglected. I am going to be able to prove to any prospective buyer that the problem has been corrected and hope to at least maintain the value in the boat. Also I could not in good conscience sell it to anyone in that condition.
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Old 05-03-2013, 10:04 PM   #40
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Jason,

We winter at Seaport Marine (launched today!) and keep the boat at Shennecossett Yacht Club in Groton in the summer. I have two friends who have had slips at Gwenmore for over 25 years and love it there. One of my brothers is on the dock building/dredging crew there.

Datenight is making the trip to Shenny tomorrow afternoon or Sunday. Let me know if you would like a ride.

Rob
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