Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 10-24-2015, 12:51 PM   #1
Guru
 
djmarchand's Avatar
 
City: East Greenwich, RI
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Bella
Vessel Model: Mainship Pilot 34
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 2,880
Winterizing 2015

Having moved my boat up to Connecticut this summer where we plan to leave it on the hard this winter, I just finished thoroughly winterizing the boat in prep for haul out. We have a normal trawler with all of the systems: engine, raw water anchor flush, generator, waste system, bilges, fresh water system and air conditioner. All of these need to be winterized as well as the DC system. So here is what I did:

The engine and generator were the easiest. I just closed the seacock, used a bilge pump to empty the strainer of water (to limit the amount of antifreeze I had to add) filled it with antifreeze, started the engine and poured antifreeze into the strainer while the engine idled and sucked it up. I used a half gallon for the single cylinder NextGen generator and three gallons for the 6 cyl Yanmar.

The air conditioner and the raw water wash down system both use the same thru hull and strainer. I winterized the wash down by using the same procedure as the engine: filled the strainer, flipped the switch on the raw water pump and ran a half gallon through it.

The air conditioning system was a bit more trouble because that pump isn't self priming like the others. So I removed the suction supply hose, elevated it a foot or so and with a funnel poured antifreeze in while the compressor and raw water pump were running. It took 30 seconds to suck down a half gallon of antifreeze.

The fresh water system was the most difficult. First I pumped the tank dry and disconnected the supply and return to the hot water heater and cross connected them with a short piece of tubing. I also opened the drain valve to the hot water heater. Then I pulled off the suction hose to the fresh water pump and temporarily connected a 3/4" piece of tubing to the suction fitting on the pump. I put the other end in a gallon jug of antifreeze, started the pump and one by one opened the fresh and hot water taps on the sink, bath lavatory and shower until I got a good stream of pink stuff out.

I also dumped a pint of antifreeze into the drain trap on the sink and lavatory and dumped a half gallon into the shower drain until I heard the shower sump pump go on and off.

The toilet is a raw water electric flush system. So I shut the thru hull supply and ran the flush pump to dump the bowl as dry as possible. Then I put a half gallon in the bowl and flushed it through. The holding tank was previously dumped and although a half gallon of antifreeze probably won't keep the couple of gallons that are probably left from freezing, it won't harm the tank if it does.

The last thing to do was the bilges. The boat has a forward bilge and pump which is always dry. But there is a bilge underneath the engine that overflows into an aft bilge with a pump. So I pumped the engine bilge over to the aft bilge with a hand pump. Any water left won't hurt anything if it freezes and there can't be more than a couple of quarts anyway. Then I dumped a gallon of antifreeze in the aft bilge to protect its pump.

The final thing to be concerned about in our climate where the overnight temps can get down to -10 F is the batteries. If they are discharged they will freeze and ruin them. Some remove the batteries and put them in the garage on a trickle charger. I have a 100 watt solar panel that has worked fine to keep them charged while on a mooring all summer so I am going to rely on that to keep them topped off for the winter. Every boat yard I know of will not allow you to permanently plug in an electric cord, even for battery charging only. I wouldn't rely on it to keep my boat or batteries from freezing in any case- too easy to get disconnected.

This whole process was somewhat tedious. It took about 3-4 hours and 8 gallons of antifreeze or about $30-40 worth. But the marina where I moor charges a flat rate of $750 to do all of this stuff and I know that they will not bypass the water heater which is a pain to flush out in the spring if it is filled with antifreeze. So the time was well spent to do the job right.


David
__________________
Advertisement

djmarchand is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2015, 04:08 PM   #2
Guru
 
HeadMistress's Avatar


 
City: AR
Country: USA
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 1,188
Mostly right...

The toilet is a raw water electric flush system. So I shut the thru hull supply and ran the flush pump to dump the bowl as dry as possible. Then I put a half gallon in the bowl and flushed it through.

All you did was add antifreeze to the tank, the toilet has no protection....'cuz nothing poured into the bowl recirculates--at least it's not supposed to!--through the inlet hose and pump, which means the inlet hose, pump and bowl have NO protection from freeze damage. I can't begin to count the number of bowls we used to replace every spring for people who thought that's all they needed to do to winterize their toilets...in GEORGIA! And your boat will be on the hard in CT, where the winters are a lot longer and harder!

So go back to the boat with another gallon of the "pink stuff" and this time, disconnect the inlet hose from the thru-hull (to anyone reading this who's still in the water: close the seacock first!), and stick it into the jug of antifreeze. Flush the toilet to move the antifreeze through the WHOLE system. Flush the whole gallon though...the half-gallon you've already put in it won't be enough if you have an extended hard freeze.

You should also have rinsed out your holding tank to get rid of any sludge after your final pumpout (apparently you missed the whole thread on cleaning a holding tank), but it's prob'ly too late now.
__________________

__________________
2017 Peggie Hall
Specializing in marine sanitation since '87.
Author "The NEW Get Rid of Boat Odors"
HeadMistress is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2015, 04:29 PM   #3
Guru
 
twistedtree's Avatar
 
City: Gloucester, MA
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 3,196
Dave, what kind of mufflers do you have on the gen and main? I ask because mine held a lot of water, and you need to push enough pink through the engine to sufficiently dilute the residual water in the mufflers. Otherwise they are at risk of freezing.

Alternately, some mufflers (maybe all) can be drained before running pink through the system. Then they have very little residual water, and the amount you already ran through is probably enough. My Cummins QSCs on my Grand Banks took 15 gal of pink for EACH engine, and most of that was for the benefit of the mufflers.
__________________
www.MVTanglewood.com
twistedtree is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2015, 04:36 PM   #4
Guru
 
TDunn's Avatar
 
City: Maine Coast
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Tortuga
Vessel Model: Nunes Brothers Raised Deck Cruiser
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 671
Second the muffler issue. You need to run the engine and genset until you see pink coming out the exhausts.
TDunn is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2015, 04:58 PM   #5
Guru
 
Bacchus's Avatar
 
City: Seneca Lake NY
Country: US
Vessel Name: Bacchus
Vessel Model: MS 34 HT Trawler
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,409
Dave...

My $0.02 -
Your summary sounds similar to what I do on my MS34HT except I have my yard do the engine & gen.
My HWH does not have engine heating and I wonder if the 3 gal is enough to get to the HWH & back to engine... might be worth pulling the temp connection you made to make sure? I had an experience on previous boat where yard di engine fine but it wasn't enough to get to the HWH coil - froze & broke the HWH coil - my yard admitted it was their fault and repaired the HWH coil at no charge.

Make sure all sea cock valves are opened after haul out.
If not you will still have water in the ball cavity which will freeze and ruin the valves.

Also - 1/2 gal in shower sump may not be enough unless you cleaned & dried out the residual water before the AF was added.
__________________
Don
MS 34 HT Trawler
"Bacchus"
Bacchus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2015, 05:20 PM   #6
Guru
 
twistedtree's Avatar
 
City: Gloucester, MA
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 3,196
I'm a bit confused about the Hwh. The loop from the engine to the HWH is typically engine coolant, not raw water, so should already be freeze protected. Or maybe we are talking about different things?
__________________
www.MVTanglewood.com
twistedtree is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2015, 05:25 PM   #7
Guru
 
twistedtree's Avatar
 
City: Gloucester, MA
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 3,196
For what it's worth, I most recently have taken to blowing out the fresh water system with compressed air rather than running pink through it.

I think the pink approach is more fool proof, but air leaves no residue in the fresh water system so I find it preferable as long as you are sure to get all the water out.
__________________
www.MVTanglewood.com
twistedtree is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2015, 05:52 PM   #8
Guru
 
psneeld's Avatar
 
City: Avalon, NJ
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Freedom
Vessel Model: Albin 40
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 15,903
Quote:
Originally Posted by twistedtree View Post
For what it's worth, I most recently have taken to blowing out the fresh water system with compressed air rather than running pink through it.

I think the pink approach is more fool proof, but air leaves no residue in the fresh water system so I find it preferable as long as you are sure to get all the water out.
I try a combo of both...use the pink...blow it out and recover it for the next system....minimizes costs and amount of spring flushings...

Understanding your systems and low spots, plus points that need foolproof winterizing such as certain valves, etc that would collect water, even condensation over the winter is important to know . That way you can know what can be blown dry and what can be benefited by a little pink.
psneeld is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2015, 05:58 PM   #9
Ray
Veteran Member
 
City: Scottsboro,Al
Country: USA
Vessel Name: PatsyRay
Vessel Model: 2004 Mainship Trawler
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 64
I agree on blowing out the fresh water system, we hook up a pancake air compressor and set the pressure of 25 pounds and use the connector we use to winterize the RV connected to the fresh water inlet on the boat. My question is, if we drain the hot water heater, will the hot water tank fill with air and blow out the hot water lines?


Thanks Ray
Ray is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2015, 06:08 PM   #10
Guru
 
twistedtree's Avatar
 
City: Gloucester, MA
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 3,196
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ray View Post
My question is, if we drain the hot water heater, will the hot water tank fill with air and blow out the hot water lines?


Thanks Ray

Yes, that's how I have done it.
__________________
www.MVTanglewood.com
twistedtree is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2015, 06:14 PM   #11
Ray
Veteran Member
 
City: Scottsboro,Al
Country: USA
Vessel Name: PatsyRay
Vessel Model: 2004 Mainship Trawler
Join Date: Nov 2011
Posts: 64
Thanks


Ray
Ray is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2015, 06:55 PM   #12
Guru
 
Bacchus's Avatar
 
City: Seneca Lake NY
Country: US
Vessel Name: Bacchus
Vessel Model: MS 34 HT Trawler
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,409
Quote:
Originally Posted by twistedtree View Post
I'm a bit confused about the Hwh. The loop from the engine to the HWH is typically engine coolant, not raw water, so should already be freeze protected. Or maybe we are talking about different things?
twistedt...

I believe you are correct - my last boat did not have closed cooling so HWH was raw (fresh) water cooled along w/ engine - my mistake - probably apples & oranges comparison in my original post.
__________________
Don
MS 34 HT Trawler
"Bacchus"
Bacchus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2015, 07:24 PM   #13
Guru
 
Bacchus's Avatar
 
City: Seneca Lake NY
Country: US
Vessel Name: Bacchus
Vessel Model: MS 34 HT Trawler
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,409
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ray View Post
I agree on blowing out the fresh water system, we hook up a pancake air compressor and set the pressure of 25 pounds and use the connector we use to winterize the RV connected to the fresh water inlet on the boat. My question is, if we drain the hot water heater, will the hot water tank fill with air and blow out the hot water lines?

Thanks Ray
Ray...

Yes but - I say blow out first (w/ HWH full) it will displace some of the water and blow out the cold supply and HW lines... then drain the HWH.
If you drain first then blow you could possibly blow addn'l water from the supply line into the HWH and may have a freeze problem at any fittings near the bottom - e.g. the drain?
I blow - drain HWH - bypass HWH - then pink FW & HW lines using the FW pump and a 3 way valve / inlet ahead of the FW pump (pic)
That's how I've done RV's and boats and never had a problem.

I have seen previous discussions re: blowing our vs pink and whether to blow out pink immediately after filling.
My understanding from those discussions...

"unwanted stuff" will grow in a damp environment when O2 is present faster than if O2 is excluded so the recommendation is to fill the lines w/ pink and leave it there for the winter. This excludes O2 and minimizes any growth in lines.

Tanks are another story - can't or don't want to fill those so you can't avoid growth. My last boat had easily accessible clean out ports and I've confirmed they do grow a slimy film over the winter. Typically I added a gal or so of water & some bleach and "scrubbed" the tank interior w/ a long handled carboy brush (Pic) available from any wine making supply (readily available in NY Finger Lakes Wine Country)

Part of spring commissioning RV & boat is a bleach flush of the fresh water system (after clear water flush) and this usually gets rid of any "pink" taste / smell and sanitizes the FW system.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	carboy-brush_1_1_.jpg
Views:	33
Size:	35.0 KB
ID:	45777  
Attached Images
 
__________________
Don
MS 34 HT Trawler
"Bacchus"
Bacchus is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2015, 09:17 PM   #14
Guru
 
Codger2's Avatar
 
City: San Diego
Country: US
Vessel Name: "Sandpiper"
Vessel Model: 2006 42' Ocean Alexander Sedan
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 5,420
WOW! I've learned a lot today!

I read all the posts in this thread twice and this is what I've learned:

1) My hat's off to you guys who go through this every year!
2) I'm definitely living in the right place!
__________________
Codger2

My passion for improving my boat(s) exceeds my desire to constantly cruise them.
Codger2 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-24-2015, 10:53 PM   #15
TF Site Team
 
ksanders's Avatar
 
City: SEWARD ALASKA
Country: USA
Vessel Name: LISAS WAY
Vessel Model: BAYLINER 4788
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 3,955
Quote:
Originally Posted by Codger2 View Post
I read all the posts in this thread twice and this is what I've learned:

1) My hat's off to you guys who go through this every year!
2) I'm definitely living in the right place!
Walt, I'll guarantee you are in the right place!

I just winterized our boat this last week, and won't be back aboard until March
__________________
Kevin Sanders
Bayliner 4788
Seward, Alaska
www.mvlisasway.com
ksanders is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2015, 05:54 AM   #16
Guru
 
djmarchand's Avatar
 
City: East Greenwich, RI
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Bella
Vessel Model: Mainship Pilot 34
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 2,880
Peggie- You are right. My heat gun failed when I got to the toilet winterizing, so I didn't pull off the raw water supply hose to flush that side with antifreeze. Should have noted that in the write up. I will do that when I go back to the boat next week and secure everything once it is hauled. Heat guns are $21 now at Amazon. I think I paid more than $50 about ten years ago for the one that failed.

Twistedtree- My boat has a horizontal muffler that exits the side of the boat. While I was sucking up three gallons of antifreeze, the engine was blowing most of the water out of the muffler. It should be fine as long as a half gallon of antifreeze made it that far.

I will open all thru hull valves once the boat is on the hard to dump any water that is trapped inside the ball.

David
djmarchand is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2015, 08:28 AM   #17
Guru
 
ranger42c's Avatar
 
City: Maryland
Country: USA
Vessel Model: 42' Sportfish
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 3,159
I use an air compressor, too... with pre-made hoses and appropriate fittings.

I don't bother to bypass the WH; it empties "enough" and the manual says a freeze of any remainder won't hurt it. I do run a little pink AF through the filter/water pump/accumulator tank after the system is all emptied out. Some AF into the (pumped and rinsed first) holding tank.

-Chris
__________________
South River, Chesapeake Bay
ranger42c is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2015, 09:56 AM   #18
Guru
 
HeadMistress's Avatar


 
City: AR
Country: USA
Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 1,188
My heat gun failed when I got to the toilet winterizing, so I didn't pull off the raw water supply hose to flush that side with antifreeze.

Blow dryer works and is a lot less likely to "cook" the hose in a moment of inattention than a heat gun.
__________________
2017 Peggie Hall
Specializing in marine sanitation since '87.
Author "The NEW Get Rid of Boat Odors"
HeadMistress is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2015, 10:57 AM   #19
Guru
 
cardude01's Avatar
 
City: Victoria TX
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Bijou
Vessel Model: 2008 Island Packet steadysailer
Join Date: Nov 2012
Posts: 3,178
Sheesh. This winterizing concept sounds like lots of work!

I'm in south Texas and wondering how much I need to winterize? We do get some hard freezes from time to time-- by hard freeze I'm talking about temps dropping under freezing for a few hours during the night but then warming up during the day. Similar to south Florida I guess?

Would a decent space heater or two inside the boat be sufficient?
cardude01 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-25-2015, 11:38 AM   #20
Guru
 
Bacchus's Avatar
 
City: Seneca Lake NY
Country: US
Vessel Name: Bacchus
Vessel Model: MS 34 HT Trawler
Join Date: Nov 2014
Posts: 1,409
Quote:
Originally Posted by cardude01 View Post
Sheesh. This winterizing concept sounds like lots of work.

Would a decent space heater or two inside the boat be sufficient?
My MS came from Dallas and the PO had an engine rm heater installed.

Inside easy to just blow out lines w a compressor hooked up via dockside water connection...literally takes 5-10 min to do.
__________________

__________________
Don
MS 34 HT Trawler
"Bacchus"
Bacchus is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:12 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012