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Old 06-30-2014, 07:17 PM   #1
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Steering: Which component is the problem?

I have a 1984 Trawler with hydraulic teleflex system. 3 pipes to both helms and a teleflex 50 Uniflow valve.

Here's my problem: Making slow corrections on the wheel makes NO corrections on the rudders. Making quick jerky movements on either helm produces desired rudder movement.

Also, when the autopilot is engaged, when it makes a correction to port, one or both of the wheel move slightly to Stbd and vice-versa.

This leads me to suspect that the Uniflow valve may be the likely culprit and is allowing fluid to leak past the appropriate one-way valves when moved slowly but when the pressure is higher during a fast wheel correction it overcomes the leak-by (my invented term) and actually does something.

Any wise old birds with experience to either confirm or refute my theory would be appreciated. From what I understand these systems are decades obsolete and cannot be replaced other than changing both helms ($$$$$$$$$$)
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Old 06-30-2014, 07:59 PM   #2
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The first problem sounds like there is air in the system and you need to bleed it out. The issue with the autopilot I sure about.
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Old 06-30-2014, 08:07 PM   #3
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Is the reservoir filled to the correct level?
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Old 06-30-2014, 08:08 PM   #4
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Dirt in the check valves inside the helm pumps is #1 cause, #2 is the top helm needs a little oil. Both an easy fix just a little time and oil........
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Old 06-30-2014, 08:16 PM   #5
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Wow, that was fast!

OK so...

1) Capt Bill, how do you bleed the system?

2) Meridian: If you mean remote reservoir tank, I don't have one (although my mechanic swears there should be one somewhere). If you mean the helm itself, I haven't opened up anything yet to check levels.

3) Roche: How would you go about "cleaning" the system?
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Old 06-30-2014, 08:32 PM   #6
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With the Capilano system there is no reservoir other than the helms themselves. The Uniflow valve is a set of shuttle valves so the cylinder has a return path to the helms whether going to port or to starboard. The helms do not have check valves as the uniflow eliminates the need.
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File Type: pdf Capilano steering mdl 250 and 275 fault tracing.pdf (99.5 KB, 246 views)
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Old 06-30-2014, 08:38 PM   #7
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here is some more data
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Old 06-30-2014, 08:40 PM   #8
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When I talked to the great guys at Teleflex across the "pond" they told me to remove the hydraulic lines on the sides, then remove the fitting the lines attach to(in my case the 90 degree ones). Once the fittings are removed you will see a light spring that has a steel ball behind with a case and o-ring it on each side. Clean the ball, spring and the seat the ball sits in. On our boat the autopilot cause the upper helm to turn as it pump fluid.

They sell new springs, balls and cases but he said it is rarely needed unless the parts are damaged.

See the attached PDF they sent me. Worked like a charm with no parts....
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Old 06-30-2014, 08:41 PM   #9
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And more......... See Summary of the invention.
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Old 06-30-2014, 08:46 PM   #10
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Rochepoint

Your PDF is for a newer helm. The older helms with the univalve do not have ball checks.
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Old 06-30-2014, 08:50 PM   #11
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I have 1985 helms with the univalve and it has exactly what the PDF shows......
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Old 06-30-2014, 08:52 PM   #12
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Rduval

Take care of your univalve 50; they are no longer made. There are repair kits however. If the univalve ever goes bad and you want to eliminate it you must put in new helms like Rochepoint has that have the check valves.
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Old 06-30-2014, 08:59 PM   #13
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I do not doubt what you say is what you have. Read the univalve attachment that I posted earlier and note on the summary of the invention that the purpose of the univalve is to eliminate check valves at the helms and to put it in one place in the univalve. I have the old helms and they do not have the check valves. You can explain better than me why you have both a univalve and newer helms.
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Old 06-30-2014, 09:05 PM   #14
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Just the way the boat came and when I talked to Teleflex there knew what I have.

Plus one more item that I did not ask them about, here a photo of it:
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Old 06-30-2014, 09:22 PM   #15
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Looks like a manifold for two steering cylinders. I do not have one because I have only one steering cylinder.
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Old 06-30-2014, 09:24 PM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by obthomas View Post
Looks like a manifold for two steering cylinders. I do not have one because I have only one steering cylinder.
I should have said that it mounted between the upper helm and the autopilot pump.............
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Old 06-30-2014, 09:45 PM   #17
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Oh. O.K. it probably the check valves for you autopilot pump. Looks to me like your set up has all the necessary stuff to eliminate the uniflow.
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Old 07-01-2014, 07:10 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rochepoint View Post
obthomas
I have 1985 helms with the univalve and it has exactly what the PDF shows......
Yep, exactly the Valve and helms I have (as you would expect since we have the same boat but yours is one year newer)
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Old 07-01-2014, 07:14 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by rochepoint View Post
Just the way the boat came and when I talked to Teleflex there knew what I have.

Plus one more item that I did not ask them about, here a photo of it:
Whoa! I don't have one of those on mine (at least not that I know of).

My Univalve and Autopilot pump are located right above and beside (respectively) the actuating ram. Where is this mystery valve located? In the same area?
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Old 07-01-2014, 10:21 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rduval View Post
Whoa! I don't have one of those on mine (at least not that I know of).

My Univalve and Autopilot pump are located right above and beside (respectively) the actuating ram. Where is this mystery valve located? In the same area?
Our Univalve is located above our actuating ram, the other component is located next to the upper helm on the command bridge as is the autopilot pump....
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