Steering: Which component is the problem?

[Rduval]

Rduval, You didn't happen to note the model number stamped into the side of your helms did you? I'm still baffled why your helms supposedly have check valves yet you have a uniflow. When you took the fittings off the upper helm could you actually see the check balls in there?

They are model 250V's and unfortunately, because of the location I couldn't get a eyeball into the checkball passage to actually see what was actually in there (which I really would have liked to do). I would have had to remove the wheel and take the whole unit from the flybridge to do it so I opted to just try to get it working with the flushing and refilling which did the trick.

BTW, I know from the pic it appears I could look straight in but I took the pic with my smartphone flat against the bulkhead. My head "ain't that small" lol

 

[Capt Kangeroo]

I was thinking that maybe the PO had new 1250 helms with check valves installed but didn't bother removing the no longer needed uniflow. So much for that thought, but you did find springs in there eh?

Incidentally, just curious. Did you serve on the Bonaventure? I last saw her in 69 after the government spent millions on paint & cosmetics, it never moved afterward and a year later it went to the scrap heap. Reminds me of our submarines, we really must stop buying used crap from the British.

 

[Rduval]

Yep, there were springs...

Sorry, no, never served. My Family is from Bonaventure Island off the Gulf of St. Lawrence in Quebec, 5 generations born there. My family owned a significant portion until the government expropriated it in the 60's. It's a huge part of the family history, hence the name.

 

[Pau Hana]

THis is on my short list of things to do.....

 

[hmason]

I have a Capilano system as well and I have a problem for which I need some advice. After not using the boat for a day or two, the helm "freezes." Rocking the wheel back and forth one time frees everything up and it will operate flawlessly until it sits again unused for a day or two. Oil level is fine and there does not appear to be any air in the system. Any thoughts? Thanks and Merry Christmas. Howard

 

[twistedtree]

I don't have this problem, but the first thing I'd want to figure out is whether it's the hydraulics that are sticking, or the rudder itself. Perhaps disconnect the steering ram(s) adn let it sit for a few days, then see which of the two is sticking?

 

[Forkliftt]

I don't have this problem, but the first thing I'd want to figure out is whether it's the hydraulics that are sticking, or the rudder itself. Perhaps disconnect the steering ram(s) adn let it sit for a few days, then see which of the two is sticking?

Good approach


1983 Present 42 Sundeck
Twin Lehman 135's

 

[Nomad Willy]

Probably just the seals. I've got to kinda break mine loose but it takes very little effort. Never thought of it as a problem such as hmason describes. My system is way too big for the boat so seal drag is a small problem.

 

[hmason]

Manyboats, that is the perfect description; breaking it loose. You're right, it doesn't take much effort and then works perfectly all day. I'm going to call the mfgr and I'll post what they advise. Thanks!

 

[C lectric]

"""""I drained and refilled the system as suggested by Teleflex. I opened the flathead screws on the sides of the Univalve - NO MORE THAN 2 FULL TURNS! - (Not sure why but the manual was VERY specific about that). """""""

Any farther will damage the 'O'ring seals which are on the screw. Then you will have to remove the screw and replace the O rings. Not hard but messy and then you must rebleed the system and topup whatever oil was lost. Any farther is simply not required as no further improvement in bleeding will occur.




"""""""Rochepoint: I see you also have shut off valves in the picture. Are they just there to isolated the autopilot for bleeding the system? """"""""

I have installed valves also. They are there so the autopilot can be removed for repair without introducing air into the system. Cuts out one bleed process.

When reinstalling they will help reduce, not eliminate air entry , with a lot of care to fill the pump and lines from the pump. Then of course comes a bleeding.

I will mention though that those valves are not the best for the purpose. The A.P. pump can likely produce upwards of 1,000psi [relief valve setpoint] Check your manual. The valves are rated for 600psi WOG [water,oil,gas]. The rating is stamped on the valve body. If you were using the AP hard in a rough sea where the rudder must be turned fast it is possible those valves MAY not stand the pressure.

I have the same valves but no AP at this point. When I rebuild the AP and reinstall it I will change the valves to a proper hydraulic valve of ~2,000psi working pressure.

Note, only the two pressure lines need those hydraulic valves; the return line is fine as is. You are likely fine as is but if ever the AP has to come out consider replacing the two pressure valves.
I think yours could be done, with care and a bit of thought, without getting air in.

 

[sbman]

I know this is an old post, but still applicable to anyone with the older, discontinued Capilano 250V pumps and Teleflex Model 50 uniflow valve.

The old 250V pumps have ball valves in the outlets that can be removed, cleaned and serviced. They do not have a shuttle valve which is in the uniflow valve, the modern units have shuttle valves built in.

 

[Albin]

Uniflow Valve

I have a 1984 Trawler with hydraulic teleflex system. 3 pipes to both helms and a teleflex 50 Uniflow valve.

Here's my problem: Making slow corrections on the wheel makes NO corrections on the rudders. Making quick jerky movements on either helm produces desired rudder movement.

Also, when the autopilot is engaged, when it makes a correction to port, one or both of the wheel move slightly to Stbd and vice-versa.

This leads me to suspect that the Uniflow valve may be the likely culprit and is allowing fluid to leak past the appropriate one-way valves when moved slowly but when the pressure is higher during a fast wheel correction it overcomes the leak-by (my invented term) and actually does something.

Any wise old birds with experience to either confirm or refute my theory would be appreciated. From what I understand these systems are decades obsolete and cannot be replaced other than changing both helms ($$$$$$$$$$)

Hi Rduval,

I live in Nova Scotia and I own a 1982 Albin 40 trawler. MY boat also has a 3 line Capilano steering system with a model 50 uniflow valve. Over a period of 10 yrs I bought every uniflow valve that appeared on Ebay (only 2) knowing how rare these things are. If you determine it is your uniflow valve that is the culprit, I may be able to part with one if you're really stuck. I'd hate to see another boater have to replace the whole steering system because of this one part.

Cheers, Jeff

 

[psneeld]

I was advised by a marine engineer that a good hydraulics shop could set you up with something to replace a uniflow valve as they are not unique to steering systems.