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Old 02-09-2018, 12:17 AM   #1
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Rebuilding Sewage System

Well, its been 4 years and the "Premium" 5 year guaranteed poop hose has permeated and so has the holding tank so out it all goes. My question is the pump-out pump. The existing pump is a Jabsco 59090-0012 diaphragm pump which has worked fine but it has been superceded by a "newer" model pump. I want everything new but I can't duplicate this pump any more. Does anyone have any recommendations for a new poop pump? The toilet itself is electric and has its own macerator so another macerator-type is not necessary. Any ideas? Pumps you have installed and forgotten about and you and the pump are still happy?

I'm not sure about the new Jabsco model as they change them to make them cheaper not mo' better. Has anyone had experience with this new-model pump?

Out with the old -
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Old 02-09-2018, 01:26 AM   #2
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Vacuflush makes a trash pump that is pretty indestructible.
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Old 02-09-2018, 05:14 AM   #3
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Can you use PVC in place of the hoses? At least in the straight runs. Will outlast the boat. No odor. Cheap and easy to work with.
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Old 02-09-2018, 05:31 AM   #4
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I used a liberty grinder pump, it will chew a leather glove up and spit it out
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Old 02-09-2018, 05:56 AM   #5
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Sealand (the same folks that probably made the non-permeable hose that permeated) also make a good diaphragm waste pump.

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Old 02-09-2018, 06:04 AM   #6
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Obendorfer , almost as "forever" as can be done on a boat , but the price is high.

When the poop boat or dock cart comes to visit , see what is used commercially , as they do not want to fix a system any more than you do.
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Old 02-09-2018, 06:50 AM   #7
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Bummer (pun intended). What kind of hose failed that quickly? I canít read the label.
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Old 02-09-2018, 07:01 AM   #8
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Well, its been 4 years and the "Premium" 5 year guaranteed poop hose has permeated and so has the holding tank so out it all goes.

What hose permeated? Was it Trident 101/102 or Saniflex?

What holding tank permeated? Was it Ronco?

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Old 02-09-2018, 07:49 AM   #9
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Greetings,
Mr. X. More to the point...WHAT have you been eating?

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Old 02-09-2018, 08:13 AM   #10
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get the whale gulper 320 waste pump! I installed two gulper pumps, one for my bilge and one for the shower sump and they pump everything through - it's crazy. I can't wait for my macerator to break so I have an excuse to replace it with one of these.
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Old 02-09-2018, 08:40 AM   #11
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Old 02-09-2018, 08:49 AM   #12
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Sealand (the same folks that probably made the non-permeable hose that permeated) also make a good diaphragm waste pump.

David
Dometic/Sealand T-Series Waste Discharge Pump. We installed ours over 10 years ago. We've never even had to change the duck bills. Once I let it run dry for 4 plus hours. Still works like a new.

https://www.fisheriessupply.com/seal...er-quiet-motor
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Old 02-09-2018, 09:01 AM   #13
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Have you actually tested the hoses and tank walls for permeation? Or are you just assuming they're the source of your odor? It's very rare for any but the thinnest plastic tank to permeate... The hose is Trident 102, which is a double walled rubber hose that has a biocide in the rubber formula. In the nearly 20 years it's been on the market there has never been a single verified odor permeation failure. All the connections should be double clamped...the single clamps on all the connections could be allowing connections to leak. The shutoff valve on the tank appears to be steel...urine is so corrosive that it may be leaking. And there are a bunch of other possibilities that may or may not have anything to do with the sanitation plumbing.

In short, I don't think the hoses or tank are the source(s) of your odor.
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Old 02-09-2018, 11:20 AM   #14
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Hi Peggy, I hoped you'd be lurking! When I did the "rub your hand on the hose and smell it" test, it does. Where there are only single clamps there is potential for leaking and I honestly can't recall why there are only singles as I religiously nod my head and agree when you state "double clamps...". I can go and double the clamps and finish painting in the cabinet and replace the steel valve on the tank to see if there is any more smell but I would have to reinstall the tank to test it.

When I acquired the boat, the first task on the new boat was to rip out all the plumbing for the sewage system and wrestle with that very recalcitrant hose to make the system in the photo. It worked for a while but there was still a noticeable faint smell, now worse.

The tank was encapsulated with cupboards and bunks (clever) and this winter I ripped all that out to replace all the bunks with a double. That revealed the tank. The opportunity to completely redo the sewage system is here because of the unprecedented access and while the new bunk design will allow easier access to the system, I have done two systems on two boats and this will be my last. Either me or the boat will expire with the new sewage system!

The old system on my GB included Ys and valves that despite being soaked in bleach, were permeated. I am also going to assume that the Y and the Y valve and the obsolete pump are also permeated and just replace them. That brings me to the new plumbing, PVC wherever I can fit it, new (unnamed pump), new Y and new Y valve and a custom-made tank, slightly bigger (about 5 extra gallons) with a 3/8" thick wall and two, 1 1/2" vents. Two 1 1/2" inlets and outlets. The pumpout will draw from a tee in the tank drain. I am also going to mount the pump well above the tank so it can drain back when not being used. The pumps all publish a self-priming, approximately 10' head so I think I can get away with this modification.

Expensive, as repairs as you suggest may be possible in the short term, but I want "permanent" (boat permanent, that is).

A bit wordy, sorry, but I'm trying to sort through the logic.
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Old 02-09-2018, 11:34 AM   #15
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RT, I already showed you my old waste tank with some of it's "personal" sludge inside so you will just have to imagine the processing of my food and its composition as I have revealed enough!

By the way, Noflex Digester is a miracle product, it ate most of the sludge from the tank and a bunch of fresh water and some Noflex a couple of days before made the dismantling of the system more (cough) pleasant. My system has one long, measly vent and I am adding 2 - 1 1/2" vents to make sure that the tank is properly aerated in the future. Cutting holes in the hull? Easy!
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Old 02-09-2018, 11:41 AM   #16
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Replacing everything without finding and eliminating it is the short term fix..Finding and eliminating the real source(s) of odors is the only permanent fix. It's highly likely that the reason you can rub odor off the hoses is because odor from the real source has attached itself to the outside of the hoses and everything else in the system. Unless that source is found and eliminated, it'll happen again--which is the LAST thing you want to happen.

I'll be glad to explore all the possibilities with you one-on-one if you'd like to send me a PM.
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Old 02-09-2018, 11:53 AM   #17
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Oberdorfer doesn't appear to make diaphragm pumps any more, Sealand is now Dometic with a price increase, Jabsco I don't trust any more, has anyone tried the Johnson 32 pump? That looks to be a reasonable design and not too stupid a price, made in Sweden (and them Swedes sure know their poop!).

Stupidly, there is no way to test whether my old pump is permeated or worn out without dismantling it and rebuilding it and trying it in the system.
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Old 02-09-2018, 02:11 PM   #18
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XSB, wash your hands before and after the test....
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Old 02-09-2018, 04:45 PM   #19
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Xsbank,
I used the Sealand 'T', now Dometic, diaphram pump when I installed my system about 2,000.
I had to replace the duckbills once about 7-8 yrs ago. Otherwise the pump has been dead reliable.

I realize you are looking at others but they are good pumps so even though a bit more costly they may be a better bet than an unknown even from an otherwise good mfgr. with a shorter track record here.

My pump sits atop the tank using a diptube into a small sump in the tank bottom. The idea was to really empty the tank.

If you can get all the new plumbing at the tank top there will be less/no sewage sitting in the hoses for long periods. THat should reduce permeation so even allowing for it still happening the interval should be much longer and a whole lot easier to change the hoses when the time comes.

I wish you success
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Old 02-09-2018, 05:08 PM   #20
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I've had Sealand T series pumps on two boats now with success. Just be sure to carry replacement duck bill valves.

Re your hose and general plumbing, be sure there isn't any standing water in the hose. Even the best hose will start to stink if left in the hose, and all the manufacturers warn about it. They have to drain out. I found this the hard way in conjunction with a friend who has an identical boat. We both had a stink that we couldn't track down, and finally realized there was a hose segment with standing sewage in it. Flushing with fresh water after pumping out displaced the poop with clean water and 100% solved the problem. If you have segments that can't be drained, use PVC as mentioned by others. Its looks, for example, like your pickup hoses come from the bottom of the tank, and as the tank fills, you will have standing sewage in them. Thats exactly the problem that led to our stink.
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