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Old 08-11-2016, 05:50 PM   #1
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New head!

Fun times, putting in new Jabsco heads, one down one to go. Old vintage 'Gor' blimey Boy' or whatever they were called heads have lived well beyond their usefulness. Aft cabin first of course. Got another coming for fwd. Always more work than you plan for.
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Old 08-11-2016, 06:22 PM   #2
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Nice looking install.
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Old 08-11-2016, 06:53 PM   #3
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Thanks! In a perfect world I could have used the same studs to fasten to, but no such luck. I just broke off the old ones as they were glassed on the underside of the board, and then drilled for new SS bolts. Had to get a new supply hose, then it leaked the barb fitting, so getting the clamp in just the right place was critical, then the second clamp failed upon tightening!! Had one handy, used it. All said and done it worked and I have the second one on order, will be here Monday and I can do it all again. The hole in the back there is just over the inlet valve and a little garbage can fits right in there. What with one thing and another I still have not had the boat out but for one little afternoon cruise last week. Maybe before summer is over...
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Old 08-11-2016, 10:32 PM   #4
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Old vintage 'Gor' blimey Boy' or whatever they were called heads have lived well beyond their usefulness.

Just curious...what make/model/approx age WERE they?
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Old 08-11-2016, 11:07 PM   #5
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Tee hee! Old Par 59128, I guess they were called Brydon Boy toilets. Have no idea why, had to go look it up again. I figured Gor Blimey worked pretty well, which for those who don't know a little bit of cockney British is "God blind me". Probably oem on this '78 CHB of mine. The son of the previous owner who died some time ago, told me that apparently the old man didn't like folks using the heads so insisted everyone go before they left the dock and hold it till they got back,,, or use a bucket! No wonder the systems all need upgrade, they just sat around unused. They kinda sorta still worked but not well enough to call working heads.
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Old 08-12-2016, 12:17 AM   #6
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Looks good! I'll be by in the morning, after my coffee, and give it a go.
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Old 08-12-2016, 12:26 AM   #7
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Old Par 59128, I guess they were called Brydon Boy toilets. Have no idea why...

The Brydon Boy was a Canadian version of the Jabsco, built under a licensing agreement until Brydon went out of business in the early '80s. Jabsco supported it with a service kit until the early '90s. So they had to be original to your boat.

No wonder the systems all need upgrade, they just sat around unused. They kinda sorta still worked ...

After 40+ years, that means the pump piston still moved up and down, but that's all. No way could anything be left of the rubber seals, o-rings etc. on it that makes it pump anything.

They were a pretty well-made toilet. It wasn't at all unusual to come across an occasional 20+ yr old one that had been well maintained (kept lubricated and rebuilt every few years) still working, but I've never found one still in use that's as old as yours.

Unfortunately, though, they ain't building 'em like they used to, so don't expect your new toilets to last anywhere near as long the old Brydons did.

Btw...you said the old mounting bolts (you called them "studs") were glassed on the underside of the board...you DO know that the mounting bolts for all marine toilets are lag bolts...no nuts, just back 'em out?
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Old 08-12-2016, 12:50 AM   #8
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Hi Peggie, That is pretty much what I have read as well as to service life etc. However when I said bolts that is what is there, bolts. Not lags. There were nuts on the top and the heads were glassed onto the bottom of the board so what was sticking up was just the studs. So just grabbed hold of them with a Crescent wrench and broke them off. Usually in order to use lag bolts there must be something substantial to fasten to, other than a barely 3/4 thick board. Bolts would be appropriate here. Thanks!
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Old 08-12-2016, 12:51 AM   #9
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Looks good! I'll be by in the morning, after my coffee, and give it a go.
Thanks man, you're all heart! LOL!
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Old 08-12-2016, 06:13 AM   #10
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Btw...you said the old mounting bolts (you called them "studs") were glassed on the underside of the board...you DO know that the mounting bolts for all marine toilets are lag bolts...no nuts, just back 'em out?
No, I did not know that. Why would this be so?
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Old 08-12-2016, 09:19 AM   #11
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However when I said bolts that is what is there, bolts. Not lags. There were nuts on the top and the heads were glassed onto the bottom of the board so what was sticking up was just the studs.

That's because they were installed incorrectly...the heads should have been on the top.

Usually in order to use lag bolts there must be something substantial to fasten to, other than a barely 3/4 thick board.

All marine toilet mfrs have been using lag bolts for at least 50 years without a problem.

Mike, the reason is because on most boats--especially fiberglass production boats--there's no access the area under the head sole to make it possible to put nuts on the bolts. That's most likely the reason the bolt heads were glassed in...the installer had never bothered to read the installation instructions and couldn't figure out any other way to do it.
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Old 08-12-2016, 10:29 AM   #12
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With all due respect to your knowledge..its not possible to say that ALL anything is ALL the time in boats or anywhere else. You mention toilet manufacturers using lags for 50 years, but toilet makers don't install toilets, boat builders do. As one who did shipwright work for nearly 30 years I have found that basically almost anything is normal, in other words whatever it takes to make it work, but using lags in place of bolts is usually only done where there is as you suggest no access to the underside of something or where there is enough wood for lags to hang on to.
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Old 08-12-2016, 12:04 PM   #13
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With all due respect to your knowledge..its not possible to say that ALL anything is ALL the time in boats or anywhere else. You mention toilet manufacturers using lags for 50 years, but toilet makers don't install toilets, boat builders do. As one who did shipwright work for nearly 30 years I have found that basically almost anything is normal, in other words whatever it takes to make it work, but using lags in place of bolts is usually only done where there is as you suggest no access to the underside of something or where there is enough wood for lags to hang on to.
Very true. However most production boats, which the majority of us own, are built by manufacturers who actually read how the marine toilets were to be installed, and then designed the boats to accommodate them. Which in this case would be to make sure there is enough marine plywood under the toilet for lag bolts to be used.

Of course, custom builds or one-offs are a different story and after many years of owner modifications, all bets are off as to what we may actually find in the older boats we buy.
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Old 08-12-2016, 12:06 PM   #14
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If you insist on splitting semantic hairs, manufacturers have been supplying only lag bolts with all marine toilets for more than 50 years, along with installation instructions. They can't force builders or anyone else to follow the instructions or even bother to read 'em before deciding that they know a better way to do it.

Have a nice day!
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Old 08-12-2016, 12:34 PM   #15
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Very true. However most production boats, which the majority of us own, are built by manufacturers who actually read how the marine toilets were to be installed, and then designed the boats to accommodate them. Which in this case would be to make sure there is enough marine plywood under the toilet for lag bolts to be used.

Of course, custom builds or one-offs are a different story and after many years of owner modifications, all bets are off as to what we may actually find in the older boats we buy.
You cannot get much more "production" than a 78 CHB though right?
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Old 08-12-2016, 12:35 PM   #16
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If you insist on splitting semantic hairs, manufacturers have been supplying only lag bolts with all marine toilets for more than 50 years, along with installation instructions. They can't force builders or anyone else to follow the instructions or even bother to read 'em before deciding that they know a better way to do it.

Have a nice day!
I would be interested to know what percentage of production boats actually used those supplied lags in installations. I would bet its not that high. Have a better day!
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Old 08-12-2016, 01:56 PM   #17
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I would be interested to know what percentage of production boats actually used those supplied lags in installations. I would bet its not that high. Have a better day!
Good question. I have only had 4 boats with marine toilets and holding tanks, 1 Cal, 2 Catalinas, and now a North Pacific, so my own sample size is ridiculously small. 4 out of 4 used lag bolts to mount the marine toilets. Again, 4 boats and three manufacturers is too small a number to make any meaningful generalizations.
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Old 08-12-2016, 02:03 PM   #18
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I would be interested to know what percentage of production boats actually used those supplied lags in installations. I would bet its not that high.

Based on the number of forum posts I've seen over the last 25 years from owners who are replacing toilets for the first time and want to know how to access the nuts on the bolts to remove the old one, and are able to just back 'em out when they learn that's all they need to do--not only from me but from other posters--I'd estimate that few if any builders DON'T use 'em.
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Old 08-12-2016, 02:16 PM   #19
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Good question. I have only had 4 boats with marine toilets and holding tanks, 1 Cal, 2 Catalinas, and now a North Pacific, so my own sample size is ridiculously small. 4 out of 4 used lag bolts to mount the marine toilets. Again, 4 boats and three manufacturers is too small a number to make any meaningful generalizations.
Dave, do you remember what the lags went into, just a mounting board or into other wood underneath? Usually lags are not used to just mount something on a thinish board.
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Old 08-12-2016, 02:22 PM   #20
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I would be interested to know what percentage of production boats actually used those supplied lags in installations. I would bet its not that high.

Based on the number of forum posts I've seen over the last 25 years from owners who are replacing toilets for the first time and want to know how to access the nuts on the bolts to remove the old one, and are able to just back 'em out when they learn that's all they need to do--not only from me but from other posters--I'd estimate that few if any builders DON'T use 'em.
Well you would certainly have more knowledge of that than I. I just base this on this boat using bolts and my own experience working on boats for many years and in this particular application on (this) boat, bolts would certainly be the fastening of choice.
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