Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 01-11-2017, 07:26 PM   #1
Veteran Member
 
lelievre12's Avatar
 
City: N/A
Country: N/A
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 45
Marine Air Condenser wont start.

I have a Marine Aire 12000BTU R22 condenser which pulls about 30 amps trying to start and then trips out. I have changed the starter and capacitor with a known good unit but still no joy. Refrigerant pressure is about 80PSI. I can see on the ships ammeter that this unit is pulling a lot of power trying to get going but it cant.

Are the compressors in these condensers known to lock up?

I'll change the whole condenser if I have to but wanted to check the forum first. They are $$$!
__________________
Advertisement

lelievre12 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2017, 07:38 PM   #2
Guru
 
Donna's Avatar
 
City: Palm Coast
Country: United States
Vessel Name: Southerly
Vessel Model: 1986 Marine Trader 36' Sundeck
Join Date: Aug 2016
Posts: 606
Will it kick on connected to shore power? I have a Marine Aire 16,000BTU aft that has a delay on it of about 2 minutes before it will start up.
__________________

Donna is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2017, 07:39 PM   #3
Guru
 
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 1,275
Out of curiosity, what size breaker are you using?
I have seen breakers fail in this way. I have also run into shore power that is marginal leading to this condition. Can the unit run on generator power?
Curious...
Bruce
Bruce B is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2017, 09:25 PM   #4
Guru
 
Capt.Bill11's Avatar
 
City: Sarasota/Ft. Lauderdale
Country: USA
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 5,422
Quote:
Originally Posted by lelievre12 View Post
I have a Marine Aire 12000BTU R22 condenser which pulls about 30 amps trying to start and then trips out. I have changed the starter and capacitor with a known good unit but still no joy. Refrigerant pressure is about 80PSI. I can see on the ships ammeter that this unit is pulling a lot of power trying to get going but it cant.

Are the compressors in these condensers known to lock up?

I'll change the whole condenser if I have to but wanted to check the forum first. They are $$$!
Yes they can lock up.
Capt.Bill11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2017, 09:46 PM   #5
Veteran Member
 
lelievre12's Avatar
 
City: N/A
Country: N/A
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by Bruce B View Post
Out of curiosity, what size breaker are you using?
I have seen breakers fail in this way. I have also run into shore power that is marginal leading to this condition. Can the unit run on generator power?
Curious...
Bruce
I havent yet checked it on Generator power however we have 5 Marine Air condensers on the boat which are all working fine. Only 1 is refusing to start. We do only have 208V on the dock (not 220V) but for many years that has not been an issue with the condenser.
lelievre12 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-11-2017, 11:06 PM   #6
Guru
 
Ski in NC's Avatar
 
City: Wilmington, NC
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Louisa
Vessel Model: Custom Built 38
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 3,884
If you have 208v on dock power, try it on your gennie. If no joy, the compressor could be pooped. Are you sure about the capacitor? Got the right Mfd rating, known good capacitor?
Ski in NC is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2017, 06:43 AM   #7
Guru
 
djmarchand's Avatar
 
City: East Greenwich, RI
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Bella
Vessel Model: Mainship Pilot 34
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 2,878
If you still have the old capacitor, parallel it with the new one on the unit. If that won't start it, then the compressor is likely bad. If it will start, then remove the spare and try again. It may have just gotten stuck. Also whack the case with a rubber mallet to try to shake it loose as it tries to start.

David
djmarchand is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2017, 08:24 AM   #8
Guru
 
ranger42c's Avatar
 
City: Maryland
Country: USA
Vessel Model: 42' Sportfish
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 3,158
Last season, we had a problem with the Marine Air compressor not starting. Turned out, just fiddling with the wiring to the compressor fixed it.

There were 5 connections on the top of the compressor. IIRC, I just disconnected, cleaned, reconnected, all good.

The local Marine Air/Cruisair guys talked me through to that stage. Their next level of diagnostics would have been about the control board... but we didn't have to go there.

-Chris
__________________
South River, Chesapeake Bay
ranger42c is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2017, 09:11 AM   #9
Guru
 
djmarchand's Avatar
 
City: East Greenwich, RI
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Bella
Vessel Model: Mainship Pilot 34
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 2,878
Chris has a good point- loose connections may be causing a voltage drop which is preventing starting. Easy to check: Put a voltmeter on the compressor terminals (probably accessible on a terminal strip where the wires from the compressor connect). Try starting and watch the voltage. It may drop to near 100V normally with the high starting current, but any lower and the connections are probably bad.

David
djmarchand is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2017, 09:17 AM   #10
Member
 
City: Lake of the Ozarks
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Cool Change
Vessel Model: Wellcraft/Portofino
Join Date: May 2014
Posts: 14
If the compressor is locked up you can try a "soft start kit"

https://www.amazon.com/SPP6-Capacito.../dp/B0002YTLFE

It connects across the existing capacitor and gives it a momentary boost of power at start up.
ClChnge is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2017, 11:23 AM   #11
Guru
 
ranger42c's Avatar
 
City: Maryland
Country: USA
Vessel Model: 42' Sportfish
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 3,158
Quote:
Originally Posted by lelievre12 View Post
I have a Marine Aire 12000BTU R22 condenser which pulls about 30 amps trying to start and then trips out.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ranger42c View Post
Last season, we had a problem with the Marine Air compressor not starting. Turned out, just fiddling with the wiring to the compressor fixed it.

I should have specifically mentioned, our symptoms were much like what you're describing.

-Chris
__________________
South River, Chesapeake Bay
ranger42c is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2017, 01:34 PM   #12
Senior Member
 
Martin J's Avatar
 
City: Mt Crested Butte
Country: USA
Vessel Name: St Christopher
Vessel Model: Cheoy Lee 50ft tri-cabin
Join Date: Feb 2013
Posts: 243
Marinaire delays while the cooling pump starts, are you pumping water? Clamp a ammeter on the pump and see what that's pulling. I had a similar problem and it was the March pump dying.
Are we talking Marinaire or marineair two different companies. I have Marinaire and they are exceptionally helpful. They will run you right thru the diagnostics.
Martin J is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2017, 02:00 PM   #13
Guru
 
ranger42c's Avatar
 
City: Maryland
Country: USA
Vessel Model: 42' Sportfish
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 3,158
Quote:
Originally Posted by Martin J View Post
Are we talking Marinaire or marineair two different companies.

Ours that I mentioned is Marine Air (Airrrrrrrrr), Vector Compact model. I think now a Dometic company. I suspect current models are marketed as both Marine Air and Cruisair... possibly identical products except for labeling.

-Chris
__________________
South River, Chesapeake Bay
ranger42c is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2017, 04:03 PM   #14
Guru
 
City: gulf coast
Country: pinellas
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 2,199
does the breaker feel solid or soft. Depending on how long that 30A is pulling the breaker may be the problem especially at 208V. As above does it work on the genny????.
bayview is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2017, 08:45 PM   #15
Guru
 
High Wire's Avatar
 
City: Cape May, NJ and Englewood, FL
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Irish Lady
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,600
Sounds like a bad cap but since you changed it, was it the same uF rating?
The reason it hums is it don't know the words, brrrrr-ump-bum-bump.
__________________
Archie
1984 Monk 36 Hull #46
Englewood, FL and Cape May, NJ
High Wire is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-12-2017, 11:49 PM   #16
Guru
 
Alaskan Sea-Duction's Avatar
 
City: Inside Passage Summer/Columbia River Winter
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Alaskan Sea-Duction
Vessel Model: 1988 M/Y Camargue YachtFisher
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 3,147
Could just be a bad compressor........
__________________
1988 M/Y Camargue Yacht Fisher
Alaskan Sea-Duction
MMSI: 338131469
Blog: http://alaskanseaduction.blogspot.com/
Alaskan Sea-Duction is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2017, 03:57 PM   #17
Veteran Member
 
lelievre12's Avatar
 
City: N/A
Country: N/A
Join Date: Mar 2013
Posts: 45
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alaskan Sea-Duction View Post
Could just be a bad compressor........

Yep its a bad compressor. I looked up the Dometic diagnostic and its drawing 33 'locked rotor amps'. Thats what I am seeing on the ships ammeter before the unit trips out with its internal safety.

The good news is that replacement Tecumseh R22 compressors are cheap.

I got NEW Tecumseh Hermetic Reciprocating AC Compressor Replacement AK111JT-004 | eBay for $110.

I guess nobody wants R22 anymore..........

I'll report back once I have soldered it in.
lelievre12 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2017, 06:04 PM   #18
Guru
 
Alaskan Sea-Duction's Avatar
 
City: Inside Passage Summer/Columbia River Winter
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Alaskan Sea-Duction
Vessel Model: 1988 M/Y Camargue YachtFisher
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 3,147
Quote:
Originally Posted by lelievre12 View Post
Yep its a bad compressor. I looked up the Dometic diagnostic and its drawing 33 'locked rotor amps'. Thats what I am seeing on the ships ammeter before the unit trips out with its internal safety.

The good news is that replacement Tecumseh R22 compressors are cheap.

I got NEW Tecumseh Hermetic Reciprocating AC Compressor Replacement AK111JT-004 | eBay for $110.

I guess nobody wants R22 anymore..........

I'll report back once I have soldered it in.
You may already know this, but you will need to put a vacuum on the system prior to adding refrigerant.
__________________
1988 M/Y Camargue Yacht Fisher
Alaskan Sea-Duction
MMSI: 338131469
Blog: http://alaskanseaduction.blogspot.com/
Alaskan Sea-Duction is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-13-2017, 09:43 PM   #19
Senior Member
 
City: Wherever the boat is
Country: United States
Vessel Name: Silver Quarter
Vessel Model: Bayliner 3870
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 456
Quote:
Originally Posted by ClChnge View Post
If the compressor is locked up you can try a "soft start kit"

https://www.amazon.com/SPP6-Capacito.../dp/B0002YTLFE

It connects across the existing capacitor and gives it a momentary boost of power at start up.
+1 on this, fixed three a/c units with same exact OP symptom with these... Caps go bad a lot more often than breakers or compressors.

EDIT: Also would mention looking at locked rotor specs vs. an instantaneous reading... not sure. The compressors in this size range I've troubleshot pull more like 50A instantaneous, but it should not blow the breaker.
kev_rm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2017, 05:08 PM   #20
Guru
 
High Wire's Avatar
 
City: Cape May, NJ and Englewood, FL
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Irish Lady
Join Date: Dec 2007
Posts: 1,600
I'm adding this video for easy future reference on how to test the capacitor. Very simple test.
__________________

__________________
Archie
1984 Monk 36 Hull #46
Englewood, FL and Cape May, NJ
High Wire is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
air conditioning, condenser locked, marine air

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:34 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012