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Old 06-02-2014, 11:18 PM   #21
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What? Me worry? Particularly about screw slots? ... I don't worry about a rock hitting me from outer space.

Sample of thru-hulls:

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Old 06-03-2014, 06:32 AM   #22
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The Home Cheapo clamps with round heads are frequently >SS< but not marine grade.

A half a decade in a bilge and there mostly gone , the usual savoir is most hoses weld to the fitting in time.

The installed direction doesnt matter , but the QUALITY of the material and construction IS a BIG DEAL.

Sorta like a fantastic anchor hooked up with an Asian no rating shakle.
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Old 06-03-2014, 08:32 AM   #23
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FF in my comments (if that is what you are commenting on) it is that the torque tee handled nut drivers are available there, not the clamps.
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Old 06-03-2014, 09:52 AM   #24
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I have been systematically shifting to T-bolt clamps.
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Old 06-03-2014, 01:28 PM   #25
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To bad your builder didn't see fit to use better clamps. Personally I would change them out if I was going to be owning the boat for any length of time.
And on fuel lines no less, not good. Should ideally have fittings like on the other four connections on that manifold. Wonder why they did it that way. The inner calmps on two of those hoses have already eaten halfway into the hose, either someone over tightend badly, or whatever is being used as a barb is too small for the hose. That's what it looks like from here.
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Old 06-04-2014, 05:26 PM   #26
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T-bolt clamps are great for the way they work. But a nut driver doesn't work on them. And the size range is tighter, so more spares are needed. A deepwell socket (or sockets depending on the clamp sizes) is more than I want to deal with when the time frame is determined by circumstances beyond my control. My goal is to have as little variety to deal with as practical on the boat. The time available and conditions I might need to work in carry more weight on the boat. In an industrial use I would likely choose the t-bolts.

Oetiker clamps are likely the "best clamps" for hoses, but too size specific and not reusable, so not boat wise.

Good compromises make great boats.
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Old 06-04-2014, 06:15 PM   #27
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How many systems, including cars, tractors, jet skis, snowmobiles, etc...etc...have you seen recently with just wire ties substituting hose clamps?

I've seen plenty and tend to agree...ABYC and a boatload of other people need to get a grip as to what works and doesn't.

2 different boats can have completely different leads and stresses on hoses serving the same function.

it's not the function that determines what is safe...it's the system and stresses involved that does.

This is one area I strongly disagree with "experts" because their "one size fits all" mentality suggests their "laziness" to seek realistic safety /risk management protocols.
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Old 06-04-2014, 06:29 PM   #28
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Interesting read. True? Can't tell as ABYC wants your money to look at the standards.

Hose Clamps, Surveyors, and the ABYC | boats.com Blog
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Old 06-04-2014, 06:54 PM   #29
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How many systems, including cars, tractors, jet skis, snowmobiles, etc...etc...have you seen recently with just wire ties substituting hose clamps?

I've seen plenty and tend to agree...ABYC and a boatload of other people need to get a grip as to what works and doesn't.

2 different boats can have completely different leads and stresses on hoses serving the same function.

it's not the function that determines what is safe...it's the system and stresses involved that does.

This is one area I strongly disagree with "experts" because their "one size fits all" mentality suggests their "laziness" to seek realistic safety /risk management protocols.
Sure, you may see wire ties on the fuel lines of outboard motors located under the cowling, on a hose and barb type designed for just that type of situation. But I'll stick to being lazy and going for over kill with quality solid band SS hose clamps that don't cut into the fuel lines on my engines, exhaust hoses and the raw water lines that feed them and other critical systems.

Call me lazy or a foolish expert but relying on wire ties to hold fuel lines together when I'm 100+ miles offshore just doesn't give me the warm and fuzzies.
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Old 06-04-2014, 07:01 PM   #30
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How many systems, including cars, tractors, jet skis, snowmobiles, etc...etc...have you seen recently with just wire ties substituting hose clamps?
Last time I checked, none of those things were in a position to sink in the ocean.
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Old 06-04-2014, 07:24 PM   #31
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T-bolt clamps are great for the way they work. But a nut driver doesn't work on them. And the size range is tighter, so more spares are needed. A deepwell socket (or sockets depending on the clamp sizes) is more than I want to deal with when the time frame is determined by circumstances beyond my control. My goal is to have as little variety to deal with as practical on the boat. The time available and conditions I might need to work in carry more weight on the boat. In an industrial use I would likely choose the t-bolts.

Oetiker clamps are likely the "best clamps" for hoses, but too size specific and not reusable, so not boat wise.

Good compromises make great boats.
A box end ratchet solves the T-bolt issue. I have both metric and SAE on the boat.
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Old 06-04-2014, 07:41 PM   #32
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Last time I checked, none of those things were in a position to sink in the ocean.
I'm not advocating using anything but top quality stuff where it counts...

I'm just saying anyone that advocates and presses that one size/requirement fits all is just doing what is easy...not necessarily "necessary" to be safe.

You can see where USCG requirements are very lax on some systems for inspected vessels and very strict on others...years of sifting through issues allows them to do that.
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Old 06-05-2014, 08:11 AM   #33
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Be careful on T Bolt clamps, they are very easy to over torque. Most engine manufacturers will specify torque levels for hoses on the engine, and some clamp manufacturers do too. The constant torque type clamp is best for really critical engine hoses such as those for intercoolers, blowers and some turbos.

For most plumbing applications, it is hard to beat the AWABs. I liked to use the stubby Gear Wrenches (by far the most used wrenches on my boat) on many clamps, harder to over torque with the short lever. A T type nut driver is also a great tool for hard to reach ones.

Note we had a post here last night from a guy who paid the steep price for a) using cheap clamps and b) not inspecting them on a regular basis.
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Old 06-05-2014, 10:24 AM   #34
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OVERKILL is a great sport , usually it comes with a high price.

Toss the cheapo Jabsco maceriator and the better quality Galley Made or Obendorfer may cost a boat buck extra.

Measure all the hoses , install a couple of dozen genuine marine hose clamps , sleep better at night , 1/10 of a boat buck.

Like everything they are cheaper by the box full , and always find a use , even a decade later!
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Old 06-05-2014, 10:33 AM   #35
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My limited resources require thinking how I spend my money...so I risk manage what systems are threats to my boat and those that aren't. Spending my limited money where it's needed.

As far as someone's boat nearly sinking from a hose clamp...it was only the start of a series of events...not good but...the actual "cause" of the near sinking has not been determined.
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Old 06-05-2014, 01:26 PM   #36
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Toss the cheapo Jabsco maceriator and the better quality Galley Made or Obendorfer may cost a boat buck extra.
Toss all three and get the Sealand diaphragm pump and live happily ever after. :-)
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Old 06-05-2014, 02:20 PM   #37
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The Sealand T uses similar duck bill valves to the rest of the yachty gear.

Mount it where its intake is above the waste , and IF it dries out with paper in the duck bill, and it needs cleaning like all the rest. BIG UGH!!!

The secret is to keep any of these waste pumps WET at all times , so paper etc does not dry out and loose the suction.

They move water well, but unless perfect will not move air , so may have difficulty priming on second use..

Pumps prefer to push , not lift.
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Old 06-05-2014, 02:35 PM   #38
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The Sealand T uses similar duck bill valves to the rest of the yachty gear.

Mount it where the intake is above the waste , and dries out with paper in the duck bill, and it needs cleaning like all the rest. BIG
Well as they say, YMMV but I've never had that issue with a diaphragm pump.

And there should be little on no large pieces of TP paper in a holding tank. Now if some one flushes something they shouldn't and it makes it to the pump, I'd rather that pump be a diaphragm one where there is a chance of it getting through. That plus the fact that it's almost impossible to burn out a diaphragm pump by running it dry makes it the no brainer choice for me.

Keeping the others wet may help but it's not fun when it comes time to work on the pump or impeller when there is black water standing in the lines. :-)
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Old 06-05-2014, 05:19 PM   #39
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Well as they say, YMMV but I've never had that issue with a diaphragm pump.

And there should be little on no large pieces of TP paper in a holding tank. Now if some one flushes something they shouldn't and it makes it to the pump, I'd rather that pump be a diaphragm one where there is a chance of it getting through. That plus the fact that it's almost impossible to burn out a diaphragm pump by running it dry makes it the no brainer choice for me.

Keeping the others wet may help but it's not fun when it comes time to work on the pump or impeller when there is black water standing in the lines. :-)
You're right Bill, the Sealands do not have that issue. Self priming and always ready to serve. That's why most pump outs use a variation of the same design.

The GalleyMaids are good, but the Sealand is easily the best. In years of full time live aboard use, I never even had an issue with clogging one of their VacuFlush pumps either, though others have managed on other boats through improper operation.
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Old 06-05-2014, 05:51 PM   #40
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OVERKILL is a great sport , usually it comes with a high price.

Couldn't agree more. What's needed for a passage maker is just plain silly for the "average" boater.

I'm in psneeld's camp here. Spend money where it counts and don't freak out about stuff that won't turn your boat into a submarine. For crying out loud most of this stuff can be found in a routine maintenance check.

Having a nut driver in your hand when checking hose clamps is a good idea. Putting it on all the hose clamps you are checking is a better idea.
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