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Old 09-21-2013, 01:15 AM   #21
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I understand the theories but practice is something else!! No way to simply get air down to our tank. Had enough trouble with air pumps and air stones in our big fish tanks! Tried the charcoal in a similar (bigger) home made filter housing (4inch PVC). Helped a bit but still got stink on flushing. Just switched to RV holding tank blue chemical additive. Problem solved. I am not trying to encourage good bacteria. I am trying to kill all the little suckers - good and bad alike!! If it works for RV's on land, why not floating RV's?
Bingo!

Years ago I had Raritan expert install black water tank. His recommendation - blue additive after every pump out and more added at 1/2 full. See upper left in pict.

Between and during pump outs: Dead Bacteria... No Odor... No Problem!!
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Old 09-21-2013, 02:01 AM   #22
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I understand the theories but practice is something else!! No way to simply get air down to our tank. Had enough trouble with air pumps and air stones in our big fish tanks! ... Just switched to RV holding tank blue chemical additive. Problem solved. I am not trying to encourage good bacteria. I am trying to kill all the little suckers - good and bad alike!! If it works for RV's on land, why not floating RV's?
Same here, Chris. I want 'em dead! All of em! I've got a 1970's vintage system that's not going to get any newer anytime soon. (Sure, I changed the hoses and head and macerator, but the rest is what it is.) But I'm not overhauling the vent system with forced air, forced vents or some protein eating bacteria. I use this stuff called Thetford AquaKem.



I buy it for about $8 for a box of 6 bottles at Wally World. If a tank sits for a week or so without being emptied, I add another bottle to it. It's cheap enough to use like we learned to vote in Chicago...use early and use often.
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Old 09-21-2013, 04:10 PM   #23
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Steve,
The bubbler looks like the answer to holding tank oders. As our holding tank is under our aft bunk I'm wondering how noisy the pump is. Would it be suitable in such an application or would it have to be mounted remotely?
Thanks
The pump is not noisy but could easily be remote mounted as it is connected to the tank by an air tube which could be long with no problem
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Old 09-21-2013, 05:11 PM   #24
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The chemical poisons dumped into waste tanks should ONLY be dumped into a large city municipal system.

The stuff is powerful enough to kill the good stuff in a std septic system whick leads to the septic field requiring replacement .

Those with campers know that most of the State roadside dumps were closed because the poison kept killing the system.

An air pump is a far better solution .
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Old 09-21-2013, 06:30 PM   #25
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What do you guys think of this?

http://www.thetford.com/Portals/0/pdf/Formaldehyde.pdf
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Old 09-21-2013, 06:33 PM   #26
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... I use this stuff called Thetford AquaKem.

Al, in moving from a freshwater to saltwater environment, does this stuff still work for you?

On second thought, the question is irrelevant to me since my toilet uses the boat's freshwater.
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Old 09-22-2013, 06:29 AM   #27
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>On second thought, the question is irrelevant to me since my toilet uses the boat's freshwater.<

Freshwater only stops life in the sea water from dieing in the toilet bowl and inlet lines.

This keeps the bowl from stinking because of the dead wild life.

Poison added to the waste tank will not change its dumpability regardless of feed water.
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Old 09-22-2013, 08:13 AM   #28
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Poison added to the waste tank will not change its dumpability regardless of feed water.
Thank you for pointing that out Fred. We can't keep poisoning our coastal waters and that is part of what I meant by the recreational boating industry remaining stuck in the past with regard to marine sanitation.

The recognized "experts" in this area of recreational boating are doing all of us, and the environment, a great disservice by continuing to promote outdated and damaging techniques and technology.

Poison lasts forever, let nature deal with natural waste the way it should, naturally. Say no to chemical poisons.
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Old 09-22-2013, 11:07 AM   #29
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Old 09-22-2013, 11:18 AM   #30
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Groco built a "Thermapure system" at one time, it used heat to treat maccerated waste. I believe temps of +- 170* will do the job on the bacteria. They were using AC power, I always wondered about using engine heat while cruising? AC shore or gen while moored.
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Old 09-22-2013, 02:04 PM   #31
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Back when... in 1970's, I owned a then like new 31' "Holiday Rambler Presidential" travel trailer. She had all the options; a self contained beaut! Built like a BSH - pun intended toward this thread's ongoing discussion. LOL

Anyway... one feature was its tow vehicle “black tank” reduction system, via exhaust: In that, during 100 miles highway travel the entire black tank (when full) could evidently be emptied and burned by the tow vehicle’s exhaust heat. I don’t recall exactly what turned me away from using that system after careful review of its instructions, however, I never used that feature. Simply seemed more sanitary to utilize dump stations where sewage can be sent to treatment locations or placed into huge septic tank systems with liquefied distribution into expansive leach fields.

That being said... On land, septic tank fed leach field systems properly sized/constructed and often fed with correct bacteria are one of the one of the most efficient and “green” (i.e. naturally clean) manners of treating human waste... bar none!
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Old 09-22-2013, 03:06 PM   #32
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One large Goose or Swan puts out 5X the waste of a human per day.

Lets shoot the swans and poop in the bay, IF you want clean water!
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Old 09-22-2013, 04:38 PM   #33
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Groco built a "Thermapure system" at one time, it used heat to treat maccerated waste. I believe temps of +- 170* will do the job on the bacteria. They were using AC power, I always wondered about using engine heat while cruising? AC shore or gen while moored.
Hey Steve, that should make a really nice "stew".
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Old 09-22-2013, 05:20 PM   #34
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Hey Steve, that should make a really nice "stew".
You just gave me a brilliant idea
I'll put a toilet seat on an XX-large slow cooker pot use it a couple of days when it's full crank up the cooker for a while and dump contents over the side, except in NDZs of course.
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Old 09-22-2013, 05:25 PM   #35
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You just gave me a brilliant idea
I'll put a toilet seat on an XX-large slow cooker pot use it a couple of days when it's full crank up the cooker for a while and dump contents over the side, except in NDZs of course.
This thread has entered... YUCK! Please!!
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Old 09-22-2013, 06:36 PM   #36
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http://goo.gl/7hY7RH

There are numerous sites and articles that describe the problems associated with the use of formaldehyde in sewage systems. None of those sites or articles are provided by people who sell formaldehyde based sewage products to RV and boat users.
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Old 09-22-2013, 07:32 PM   #37
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Two posts and two opposite positions...state vs manufacturer. Not surprising.

1. We have the manufacturers telling us that Formaldehyde is "100% biodegradable" and safe for septic systems.

2. We have the government telling us that formaldehyde "may be" non-biodegradable and due to the 'potential impact" on pump-out systems, its use should be avoided. By its own admission the DTSC states that it has not evaluated or tested the veracity of the claims of biodegradability.

"These chemicals have not been evaluated by DTSC, but based on their potential impact to “dump stations” should be avoided in holding tank deodorizers."

It also implies incorrectly in mealy-mouthed wording that formaldehyde is a prohibited chemical for this use in the state of California. I know that formaldehyde products are available for purchase in CA for the holding tank use. I purchase them here and they are widely available.

"There are a number of products available to control these odors, but some of these products may contain chemicals that are banned and cannot be sold or used in chemical toilets in California.

Many chemicals are banned in these products, but formaldehyde, which is commonly used to reduce odor, in particular, has come to the attention of the Department of Toxic Substances Control (DTSC).

Based on chemical information, formaldehyde may be a non-biodegradable toxic chemical substance and you should avoid purchasing and using any chemical toilet product that lists formaldehyde as an ingredient in any concentration."


3. Letter from the California Association of RV Parks and Campgrounds

We have an RV Park owner's association telling us this chemical is not banned in the state but is detrimental to their systems. They ask the state to ban the sale of the chemicals.

I find the state memo intentionally misleading, however well-intentioned it might be. There is a deliberate attempt to imply illegality and unlawful use when none exists.

I also consider the manufacturer's bulletin simplistic in its acceptance of formaldehyde as fault-free in its effect on septic systems. It might be biodegradable, but if it also kills the bacteria in the septic system, that's a problem.

The RV Park Association probably has the most straight forward presentation here...the products are legal for sale and purchase within the state and their effect on the septic systems is significant.

To be honest, I have never deeply pondered these issues before, but I probably should have. Next time around, I'll try some of the non-formaldehyde products and see how well they work. Thanks for posting that link, RickB.
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Old 09-22-2013, 10:32 PM   #38
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Wow, all I wanted to do was share my cheapo way of changing out the charcoal. Always learning here on TF.
After watching a post progress for two days a fella has to ask himself." Why the hell did I even bring this up!
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Old 09-22-2013, 10:50 PM   #39
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After watching a post progress for two days a fella has to ask himself." Why the hell did I even bring this up!
So that all sphincters can be well informed - Why Else??
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Old 09-23-2013, 06:10 AM   #40
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>I'll put a toilet seat on an XX-large slow cooker pot use it a couple of days when it's full crank up the cooker for a while and dump contents over the side, except in NDZs of course. <

Probably easier to just purchase an existing product.

I N C I N O L E T

incinolet.com/‎
Incinolet uses electric heat to reduce human waste to a clean, non-polluting ash. It uses no water and drains nothing out.‎I N C I N O L E T -INCINOLET ... - ‎About Us - ‎Contact Us
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