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Old 06-02-2015, 03:43 PM   #81
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Last reason for not using the house fresh water system is that fresh water is precious. I have to make it using a water maker (which is the most troublesome item on the boat) and I have an abundant supply of rain water which is currently going overboard.
I take it the boat is not on Lake Michigan....
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Old 06-02-2015, 05:35 PM   #82
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Saying a fresh water head designed for the task is safe (and that it's the only option for plugging into a fresh water supply...see last paragraph of post #17) does nothing but plug new heads. Stating why they're safe would be clarification in the context of these discussions.
She said this in post #17, and I thought that seemed quite clear:


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There's a bit more to toilets designed to use pressurized fresh water than just a check valve...you'd need a back flow preventer (check valve) siphon check valve...if the toilet is electric, a solenoid valve...

And she also included Jabsco alternatives as possible solutions, in that same post.


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Look back at her posts over a period of time. Raritan endorsements all over the place. Just sayin'. Nothing wrong with that, she's a commercial poster...just be aware, that's all. Oh, and I believe Hopcar does sell Rariitan heads. Again, no problem...just be aware.

Well, of course she's a commercial poster. Who would not be aware of that? And in most cases, who better to answer questions like OP's, than someone who has an actual clue, no speculation required?

And if a commercial poster might offer specific examples of solutions, wouldn't you expect those usually to be models he or she is most familiar with?

-Chris
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Old 06-02-2015, 05:43 PM   #83
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This is about one of the easiest things to understand on a boat.

Read through the thread and one can figure out a least 2 ways of rigging a salt water toilet to fresh water safely.

If not, pm me and I will be glad to point it out.
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Old 06-02-2015, 06:05 PM   #84
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Originally Posted by skidgear View Post
Saying a fresh water head designed for the task is safe (and that it's the only option for plugging into a fresh water supply...see last paragraph of post #17) does nothing but plug new heads. Stating why they're safe would be clarification in the context of these discussions. But then it would be apparent that there's nothing magic about new fresh water heads... a couple of valves (or one combi) and Bob's your mother's brother.


[Rick happens to have Raritan toilets. Why wouldn't she answer in that context?]

Look back at her posts over a period of time. Raritan endorsements all over the place. Just sayin'. Nothing wrong with that, she's a commercial poster...just be aware, that's all. Oh, and I believe Hopcar does sell Rariitan heads. Again, no problem...just be aware.

Oh good God! Did your aluminum foil helmet fall off or something?

To imply that Peggie and Hopcar are even remotely plugging Rairitan heads (pun noted) for their own gain in this convoluted thread is boardering on stupidity and perhaps paranoia.
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Old 06-02-2015, 06:07 PM   #85
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I take it the boat is not on Lake Michigan....

Eastern Caribbean. Water prices are not high if one doesn't mind going into a marina. St. Lucia's Rodney Bay marina charges approximately 15 cents US a gallon. Not bad. However, it is the only place in St. Lucia to buy water. Same problem other islands. Not a lot of marinas. We try and visit a marina every six weeks to use shore power to equalize the batteries.

I am however drinking a glass of Lake Michigan water as I type this.
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Old 06-02-2015, 06:15 PM   #86
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Just so we're clear, HopCar does sell Raritan toilets, also Jabsco and Groco.
My boat is equipped with a Groco K.

Hopkins-Carter Marine has no connection to Peggie Hall except to sell her book.

Peggie is a commercial poster not because she sells toilets but because she sells a book about marine toilets. Nobody pays her to recommend Raritan products.

My answer to the original question is, yes you can connect your toilet to a dedicated fresh water tank. I think that's a good idea.

This thread has really gone off the tracks.
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Old 06-02-2015, 08:34 PM   #87
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I recommend Raritan equipment because Raritan happens to be one of the the last two US mfrs left standing who build equipment that isn't "disposable." Groco is the other one, they have only two toilets, both manual--HF and Model K...neither of which are designed to use pressurized flush water Jabsco was the first to go... Thetford bought W-C for the sole purpose of discontinuing the entire W-C line because W-C toilets last for decades and there's no profit in repair parts... I've been at this for 25 years...and in that length of time I've seen literally thousands of posts and heard from hundreds of people who've had experience with every toilet ever made...rarely are there any complaints from owners of Raritan equipment...rarely will you ever see a post from anyone asking for help to trouble shoot a problem with Raritan equipment. Raritan equipment is always top rated by Practical Sailor--and also Powerboat Reports before publication was discontinued. So yes, I do recommend Raritan equipment. Wouldn't you recommend equipment, not just toilets, but ANY equipment that you know from experience--from decades of BOAT OWNERS' EXPERIENCE --is the most durable and trouble free?

You suggest that others "search the archives"...I suggest that YOU search the archives for posts looking for help to trouble-shoot all the toilet makes/models and see for yourself which ones show up the least.

I sold my own company's product line to Raritan...I could have gone to work for them. I didn't because I've always "called 'em as I see 'em." As an employee, my advice would have become as tainted as you want to believe that it is...and they would not have been at all pleased to have me recommend a competitor's product--which I have done and will continue to do when I think it's better suited to a particular application. So we agreed it was in both our best interests that I continue to remain free to "call 'em as I see 'em."

And I'm gonna leave it there while I can still resist the urge to apply that to you!
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Old 06-02-2015, 08:41 PM   #88
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In keeping with the subject matter, this is a crock of s**t. I've spent at least an hour on the phone with Peggie getting excellent advice on redesigning our heads and holding tank. She suggested different options and mentioned different brands. I never felt pressured to buy Raritan--or anything for that matter. Insulting her qualifications and motives is a disservice to her and everybody on this forum who benefits from her generosity.
Yep!!! Thank you sir.
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Old 06-02-2015, 08:45 PM   #89
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This is about one of the easiest things to understand on a boat.

Read through the thread and one can figure out a least 2 ways of rigging a salt water toilet to fresh water safely.

If not, pm me and I will be glad to point it out.

No thanks, Peggy has a clue, I'll trust her expertise thank you very much. No cobbling water systems to the crap systems for me.

May I recommend, perhaps bottled water for you.
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Old 06-02-2015, 08:47 PM   #90
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Beeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeep!

And now back to our original programming.
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Old 06-02-2015, 10:10 PM   #91
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Just so we're clear, HopCar does sell Raritan toilets, also Jabsco and Groco.
My boat is equipped with a Groco K.


This thread has really gone off the tracks.

I think is has gone in the toilet

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Old 06-02-2015, 10:27 PM   #92
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Old 06-02-2015, 11:19 PM   #93
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One more time: It is safe to connect any toilet to the potable water system that is designed by the mfr to use pressurized fresh water.

Therefore, if your Raritan toilets are designed to use pressurized fresh water, your system is safe whether the water pump is on and the system is pressurized or not.

Y'all need to spend a lot MORE time on the water and a LOT less at your computers!
Thanks - that answered my question as well - being concerned about when the pressure was off. I have a Raritan PHEII that the PO disconnected the motor to. We use it in the "empty" mode only - using a small bucket of water from the sink. One of these days it will be traded out for a Raritan Marine Elegance. I want to tap into the pressure water under the sink. But several of the local experts insist I need to run a separate line, preferably from a separate FW tank. (I have 3). I would prefer the easy, KISS method if it is safe.
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Old 06-02-2015, 11:31 PM   #94
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The Marine Elegance comes in three flush types, raw water flush, pressurized fresh water flush, and one that allows you to select raw or fresh. The fresh water only is the least expensive as it doesn't need an intake pump. No dedicated tank needed either.
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Old 06-02-2015, 11:55 PM   #95
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Having finally got through all the posts, it rather looks like Peggy needs no defence from us moderators, as that appears to have been taken care of by happy recipients of her advice. So, thanks for that guys, and I guess the moral to this story is read carefully, and only carry a very light stick - until you are absolutely sure of your position, at least…
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Old 06-03-2015, 05:06 AM   #96
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Thank you Peggy.
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Old 06-03-2015, 09:18 AM   #97
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Having finally got through all the posts, it rather looks like Peggy needs no defence from us moderators, as that appears to have been taken care of by happy recipients of her advice. So, thanks for that guys, and I guess the moral to this story is read carefully, and only carry a very light stick - until you are absolutely sure of your position, at least…
I'm absolutely sure of my position...which is that she plugs new equipment to the exclusion of adapting older hardware...new Raritan products in particular. She just said so herself. It's easy to parrot what the OEMs say...not so easy to show a little inventiveness and actual engineering savvy. As for technical advice, there are old threads where she's been flat wrong about design and regulations. She's been caught out by Rick B and others. Read the files. By the way, Hopcar, I believe there are guidelines regarding Commercial posters advertising their product line on the site.
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Old 06-03-2015, 09:38 AM   #98
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she plugs new equipment to the exclusion of adapting older hardware...Raritan in particular.

I don't understand why you seem to think that's a bad thing.

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Old 06-03-2015, 09:50 AM   #99
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No thanks, Peggy has a clue, I'll trust her expertise thank you very much. No cobbling water systems to the crap systems for me.

May I recommend, perhaps bottled water for you.
Care to explain why use of the exact same components used by an OEM to connect an older head to a fresh water system is "cobbled"? "Peggy says so" isn't a technical response.
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Old 06-03-2015, 09:57 AM   #100
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I don't understand why you seem to think that's a bad thing.

-Chris
I didn't say it's a bad thing. I'm saying it's not the only thing. There are safe and relatively inexpensive alternatives to using OEM hardware for the hookup. Peggy says alternatives are a bad thing. Why? Raritan used to have a "how to" procedure on their web site to do exactly what I and others are talking about. They removed it when they started marketing fresh water heads and their own kits to swap old heads to fresh water flush. What an amazing coincidence.
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