Fairly affordable slider pipe for pier

[Forkliftt]

Here's a project I have been pondering for a while. I went to Lowes and purchased a 1 1/4" x 4' galvanized pipe, 2- caps for this pipe, 1/2 x 10 galvanized lag screws, a 12" x 3/8" (would have preferred 5/16") drill pit to pre drill the two holes in the piling, 4- 5/8" galvanized nuts and 6- 1/2" galvanized flat washers. At the boat I drilled a 1/2" hole near each end, did my best attempt at braiding a 3 strand 5/8" line onto a ring I had purchased a while back, I drilled a 1/8" hole in the lower cap to allow drainage- followed by assembly. Works great. ~ $50-



1983 Present 42 Sundeck
Twin Lehman 135's

 

[hmason]

That's awesome.

 

[what_barnacles]

Nice but you probably need to thru bolt. The wood will soften around the threads from water. A big wind can pull one out.
I'll take a pic of what's at our dock when I get back after lunch for you.

 

[psneeld]

Agree, through bolt....

Also, anyone know the point loading failure numbers of pipe like this?

I have seen the 1 inch solid rod sliders bent pretty badly in even the tame Nor'easters we get at home. Not usually just wind, but the tugging from tidal current and wave action.

I have seen a lot of "marina fabricated or homegrown" pipe sliders for 25 foot and under outboard type boats...but never bigger. In my marina...anything over 30 feet or so is tied to pilings, sliders not allowed (mostly).

But I keep having to remind myself the marina I am at is one of the harshest for mooring on the East Coast south of Atlantic City. But many marinas I stay at during my trip south could go either way...they are so protected....yarn could tie up your boat, or they are exposed enough I would only tie to pilings unless a light outboard type boat.

 

[caltexflanc]

Nice calm weather set up; over time that ring will rub and diminish the galvanizing and rust will take over, but replacement cost is low. Likewise the lag bolts will work their way loose. When a blow comes up, some additional lines to the pilings and dock cleats will be advised.

 

[Capt.Bill11]

I'm guessing you could slide pipe into the pipe to stiffen it up?

 

[dhays]

I was wondering how the marina allowed you to screw the lag bolts into the piling. Anything screwed or nailed into the pilings will shorten their life.

 

[psneeld]

I was wondering how the marina allowed you to screw the lag bolts into the piling. Anything screwed or nailed into the pilings will shorten their life.

In many places it isn't a big deal to the marina.

Most pilings rot from the inner core out or from the "mud line".

If a marina is conscientious about taking care of their pilings sure...but most aren't and allows line hooks, sliders, eyes for lines to separate slips, etc.


In my marina..they get knocked down before they rot......told you it was a tough neighborhood....

 

[Forkliftt]

Thanks Howard


1983 Present 42 Sundeck
Twin Lehman 135's

 

[psneeld]

No one is trying to be mean...just helpful...


You are the best judge of whether it will work for you...but for some of us...we know it won't work in some places.

 

[mbevins]

I'm guessing you could slide pipe into the pipe to stiffen it up?

Just fill the pipes with sand or concrete ( although concrete is caustic) and that will stiffen them up substantially.

 

[Capt. Jon]

Forklift, I think it will work fine! P.C. Marina is pretty well protected. It would have been really nice to have had it a few weeks ago when the water was really up. Had to get up several times during the night to adjust lines.

 

[Max Simmons]

Most cleats I see are lagged into the dock

 

[dhays]

Most cleats I see are lagged into the dock

Properly tied line on a cleat will provide primarily a shearing force to the lag bolts on a clear. The concern on the slide pipe was that the force may be pulling out on the bolt and not to the side.

 

[BruceK]

Just fill the pipes with sand or concrete ( although concrete is caustic) and that will stiffen them up substantially.

Would pour in 2 part foam do the job? We used it in the body channels of rally cars.

 

[psneeld]

Most cleats I see are lagged into the dock

On larger vessels?

ISome might be, but most are? I don't believe so.

And if they were....many here would recommend through bolting anywayv....IF possible.

Also if they were, most would recommend against buying a boat like that as what other corners were cut.

Sure the lag bolts might hold long enough, be stronger than the actual pipie, are allowed where thru bolting may not be, be OK in all but a hurricane....not sure people would argue those issue.....at least in my case....just suggesting that they might not be and now is the time to think about it....not AFTER hurricane season starts.

 

[stubones99]

My 2 cents worth...

I would have through bolted it just around the curve of the piling, so it does not offer the opportunity to bash the boat while docking. As it is now, if you bump it while docking, you hit a small radius steel pipe, not a big wood piling.

I would have sprayed the drilled holes with zinc spray since any cut edge (threads too) will rust in a marine environment.

OK, back to my arm chair...

 

[FF]

Drop a piece of re bar in the pipe , it will not bend as far.

 

[stubones99]

rebar is known for being flexible. But it will add to the energy it will take to bend both.

If strength is needed, coaxial pipes (one inside the other filled and sealed with concrete would make it the stiffest pipe.

Assuming that most of the load will be lower, due to gravity, the bottom bolt / thru bolt should be sized bigger.

The worst case is pulling on the ring in the middle, since any bending would put the most force on the bolts.

One after thought idea would be put the top bolt about 4 inches down on the pipe, so you cal loop an eye over the end easily...

 

[caltexflanc]

Properly tied line on a cleat will provide primarily a shearing force to the lag bolts on a clear. The concern on the slide pipe was that the force may be pulling out on the bolt and not to the side.

That's correct, plus I have to say my experience is much different; almost all cleats I see are through bolted. And I have to say I've seen a lot of cleats in a lot of places all over the country.

Another thought about the pipe and metal ring is the noise that ring will make sliding and clanking. Perhaps that why the tide slider set ups I can recall used teflon. Will be interesting to see what the OP's actual experience is.

 

[mbevins]

Would pour in 2 part foam do the job? We used it in the body channels of rally cars.

I'm not sure foam has the same compression stretch as concrete or compressed sand.

 

[FF]

Many big box stores have galv pipe up to 3 inch.

If you want robust, its there.

 

[Nomad Willy]

Forklift,

I'd definitely keep it away from the boat ... drilling the holes at about a 45 degree angle. And I'd use big pipe and low carbon (mild) steel bolts. But a pair of bands would clamp the pipe in place and make the holes and drilling not necessary. Obviously more expensive. One can bend bolts and save money on the clamps or make smaller ones do.

However I can't belive you'd be drilling holes in the marina's pilings w/o permission. Could you have started your thread w "After asking the marina if it was OK ....... " But I see no sign of it. If it was my marina I'd be annoyed to furious. The marina is'nt yours to mutilate or damage according to your whim. My marina would probably terminate me if I did that. Sorry

 

[Capt. Jon]

Forklift,

I'd definitely keep it away from the boat ... drilling the holes at about a 45 degree angle. And I'd use big pipe and low carbon (mild) steel bolts. But a pair of bands would clamp the pipe in place and make the holes and drilling not necessary. Obviously more expensive. One can bend bolts and save money on the clamps or make smaller ones do.

However I can't belive you'd be drilling holes in the marina's pilings w/o permission. Could you have started your thread w "After asking the marina if it was OK ....... " But I see no sign of it. If it was my marina I'd be annoyed to furious. The marina is'nt yours to mutilate or damage according to your whim. My marina would probably terminate me if I did that. Sorry

Eric, nothing personal, but your presuming he did not ask first ? In my neck of the woods that's a little accusatory on your part! Downright impolite! I presume you expected him to hang a permit from his piling while taking the picture? Better yet a picture with the harbor master holding up the OK sign? His boat is right under the harbor master's office window. It would be hard to hide it from him.

 

[Forkliftt]

A couple of thoughts....
*I intentionally faced the lag bolts towards the cleat- my thoughts are that it will provide more strength from the bolts than a side load. You will notice the "green" color of the piling. As I drilled the pilot holes for the 1/2"x10" lag bolts I didn't encounter any rot.
*The benefit of adding this one slider was to keep the aft of the boat pulled to the right, allowing for easy access from the stern. This is an old marina with short finger piers- and a side access was impractical. Obviously cross lines aft would provide a real challenge.
*You will notice the second 5/8" line attached to the cleat with the shore power/ water line secured to it. Consider it a safety line.
A few years back I kept the boat at a marina in Bay St Louis that had slide set ups for the slips prior to Katrina. They allowed me to salvage several of the remaining ones for my slip which I through bolted (yup) to the pilings. These "bent at the ends" we're not nearly as thick as what I just installed. They were galvanized. Noise was tolerable. Cost was affordable.
*The Harbor Master has given me permission to make any improvements that I want- provided they are done well. I recent built this "pier" aft of the boat. No permission asked/ no problems. I yield the floor....


1983 Present 42 Sundeck
Twin Lehman 135's

 

[psneeld]

Cool man...as long as the suggestions were taken as helpful and not condescending...all is good...


I am a big believer in making something better for 75% of the time as long as there's a plan "B" in effect such as you have, a safety line, in case...great idea!


A lot of boats have been damaged by people without a clue...so obviously a lot of us wanna make sure your boat is good for you and the next door guys...and it sounds like you have thought it through....

 

[Nomad Willy]

If it was'nt for Dave in post #7 .. I would'nt have said anything but forklift made no defense whatsoever. Forklift has been around for a long time and I have high regards for him. We've even PM'd in tha past .. don't remember what about but it was on a positive note. You're right though Cap't Jon I should have kept my mouth shut.

Anyway carry on guys. Our tides are much too big out here even in WA to benefit from this but I love to see DIY stuff like this. Just the sort of thing I'd be likely to dream up.

 

[DHeckrotte]

Comments re: adding strength to a steel pipe by sliding more steel inside are marginally wrong; the metal on the outside is doing nearly all the work to resist bending; the metal in the center is doing nothing. That's why tubes are used for structure rather than bars. Worried about strength? Use a bigger pipe. It doesn't have to be any stronger than the breaking strength of any other part of the system, applied to the middle of the pipe.

Adding filler to strengthen a pipe serves only to keep the pipe from kinking; if it's stressed enough to kink, it's close to failure. You can bend tubing farther by preventing kinking but that's not what is being done here.

Comments re: noise: You could drop a piece of PVC pipe around the steel pipe and let the eye try to rattle on that.

Comments re corrosion: Bang on! Cold galvanizing paint, wearing through the galvanizing, the ungalvanized threads, the holes at the mountings, maintenance, threaded holes in the wood, 'nail sickness'.

Comments re vulnerability: Don't let those boltheads, or the pipe, threaten the boat finishes. Putting the pipe around the side of the piling puts the mounting lagscrews or bolts in bending.

 

[Nomad Willy]

If using bolts the other end of the bolt sticking out will probably need to be cut off as bolts are only availible in certian lengths. I'd cut off, file off burrs and cap w rubbery plastic like covers that come in all the popular sizes usually in bright colors. But sometimes in dark grey or green.