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Old 04-17-2016, 07:01 AM   #21
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If required to operate with a thermostat , not constant run, most of these units work far better with kerosene than diesel.

As real cold weather will be 3+ gallons per day a winter liveaboard should be figuring just where a 30+ gallon gravity can fit.

Sail boats can simply lay a bladder tank on deck for the winter or in the aft lazerette .

Sure its nice to use a huge fuel tank of diesel .all winter.

It might be the first time its emptied in years , and 5 gal jugs get heavy on a snow filled dock, but having it operate all winter trumps the hassle
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Old 04-17-2016, 07:58 AM   #22
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I ended up using the small plastic "day tank" that came with the Planar. For testing, I filled it with kerosene. I'm working now on a fuel transfer system that will include the ability to draw and return from/to any of my four diesel tanks, with a 3-way valve that will also allow me to return to my heater day tank.

Still, I think I'll keep kerosene in the tank except when I'm using the system regularly, because I've heard so much about these units running cleaner that way, and replacement parts have to come from Russia.
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Old 11-12-2016, 08:58 PM   #23
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I just finished installing a planar diesel heater.. plug everything.. and nothing happened.. code 17, fuel pump faillure.. thinking replace for a similar fuel pump than Astral Blue.. very frustating after a couple days of work.. damm russian things!!
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Old 11-12-2016, 10:45 PM   #24
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Garr,
Nice boat ya got there.
Not good at head seas?

I'm frustrated w my Wabasto also. Not the Wabasto's fault though. Put a fuel tank on the outside on the cabin and filled the tank on a rainy night w/o putting the filler cap back on. Water in the fuel system. After a lot of effort I got all the water out but I'm in "lockout" mode now re what the Wabasto tech says. Won't start. Took the whole thing out and will take it to Seattle Monday. It's super gouod when it works though. As I said it was my stupidity.
Good luck w yours.
By the way ... a Wabasto or other "dosing" pump may work on your unit. Something to consider if you get desperate.
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Old 11-12-2016, 10:49 PM   #25
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Timely re-birth of a thread. I am installing a Webasto 4200 and my plan WAS to "T" into the fuel line for the engine after the primary filter. I knew the manufacturers called for a dedicated line but assumed that was so the heater couldn't draw down the fuel supply to the engine and run the tank dry. I do not have access to the top of my fuel tank to install a separate pickup tube (supplied with the heater) in the DIY kit.

My max fuel flow is under 1 gph, so I never considered that suction from the fuel pump could affect the heater fuel supply. I will now consider a separate fuel supply in a separate fuel tank, possibly in the stern.

Willy, I can't imagine your engine draws more fuel than mine does, so it was helpful to know you had this issue...
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Old 11-12-2016, 11:07 PM   #26
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[QUOTE=psneeld;283045]My Wallas heater required to suck fuel from a separate feed as engine suction would defeat the pump as does the restriction of other filters such as Racors.


Strange, we have a Wallas D-30 and it is connected directly to the engine fuel feed line with a 'T' fitting.The run to the heater from the 'T' is about 8-10 feet horizontal. Pump is powerful enough apparently as there was and is no issues. Started on the first go after allowing pump to purge through the unit.

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Old 11-12-2016, 11:28 PM   #27
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Quote:
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Garr,
Nice boat ya got there.
Not good at head seas?

I'm frustrated w my Wabasto also. Not the Wabasto's fault though. Put a fuel tank on the outside on the cabin and filled the tank on a rainy night w/o putting the filler cap back on. Water in the fuel system. After a lot of effort I got all the water out but I'm in "lockout" mode now re what the Wabasto tech says. Won't start. Took the whole thing out and will take it to Seattle Monday.
Don't know what model you have but maybe this will help.........
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Old 11-12-2016, 11:54 PM   #28
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Doug, Al and Mike,
I ran mine for years T'd into the engine manifold. But now and then I'd have startup issues. And when I took it in for maint (showing 800hrs) and I couldn't get it to start nohow. They said it was badly crudded up and recomended I swich to kerosene. So I got a rather flat aluminum tank of 2.5 gallons and bolted it to the back of the cabin outside. Plumbed 1/2 copper pipe and 1/2 fuel hose. Worked perfect until I left the filler cap off on a rainy night.
Mike it's an "Airtop 2000". There's stripped slots on the power wires .. can't get the screws out. I'm gonna give SureMarine a shot at it.
Doug your engine is a little more fuel efficient so I'd guess they are about the same. I run at 6.15 knots.
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Old 11-13-2016, 01:01 AM   #29
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Eric, I failed to identify that I use #2 Diesel.

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Old 11-13-2016, 07:01 AM   #30
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[QUOTE=Al;495574]
Quote:
Originally Posted by psneeld View Post
My Wallas heater required to suck fuel from a separate feed as engine suction would defeat the pump as does the restriction of other filters such as Racors.


Strange, we have a Wallas D-30 and it is connected directly to the engine fuel feed line with a 'T' fitting.The run to the heater from the 'T' is about 8-10 feet horizontal. Pump is powerful enough apparently as there was and is no issues. Started on the first go after allowing pump to purge through the unit.

Al-Ketchikan
Just passing on what both the manual and owners of the store said.

A lot of reading of installs and reviews...these tiny fuel pumps can be very finicky.

When my Wallas was having issues....the company replaced a pump under warranty even though it turned out not to be the problem.

That is how low their confidence in them is so I reigned my fuel supply and filters to spec just to be sure.
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Old 11-13-2016, 08:19 AM   #31
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About the T thing... I assumed if you install the T on the return diesel line, it's not gonna affect the engine, I was tempted to do that but lack of time and lazzyness...
Gonna tried to prime the line first to see if pump have enough pression. The whole circuit is less than 3' long. Could work. Or install a walbro pump. Keep you posted
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Old 11-13-2016, 08:41 AM   #32
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One reason I use a 2.5 gallon second tank for the heater.

Many suggest to use a separate tank of fuel when diagnosing engine related problem...so the was my philosophy when I experienced heater issues and just kept it that way.
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Old 11-13-2016, 11:20 AM   #33
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Quote:
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About the T thing... I assumed if you install the T on the return diesel line,
Our T comes off the 'Too engine fuel line'. I don't recall a return line to the fuel tank on our Perkins. At least I have never found one!!

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Old 11-13-2016, 11:31 AM   #34
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AB

Sounds like the original setup was pretty good. Plus it worked! Why not use the day tank and OEM pump as intended and simplify the refill system?
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Old 11-14-2016, 01:42 PM   #35
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Fuel pumps, even cheap ones, have valves that stop reverse flow. So a tee in the main supply line shouldn't allow the main to draw air. Most return lines return fuel to the tank top. Installing a tee in that line would probably cause the heater to draw air.
Today's diesel doesn't burn as well. It causes more soot. If #1 diesel is available, it burns cleaner and hotter. Also there are catalysts that cost a few cents per treated gallon that allow a cleaner burn in appliances and help engine economy.
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Old 11-14-2016, 01:58 PM   #36
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With Wallas heaters, burning them hot for a few minutes before shutting them down was the trick for me...especially had it run on low for a long time.

Really didn't have to go to additives.

Pretty sure the no "tee" has less to do with air as it does with the miniscule pumps not having the guts to fight any vacuum or restriction.
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Old 11-14-2016, 06:12 PM   #37
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"Burning them hot for a few minutes before shutting them down" smacks of running an engine hard after hours of underloading. Good practice IMO if better methods are not employed. My Wabasto always runs plenty hot as it's an on and off heater. I remember shopping for the heater and the Wallas having a "throttle" to enable it to run on low flame I considered an advantage. But maybe the Wabasto is not hot enough as my supplier advised me to use kerosene after 800hrs running dirty diesel. But the Wallace and Wabasto are very different. At night my wife would probably prefer the Wallace as it's quieter.
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Old 11-14-2016, 06:46 PM   #38
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"Burning them hot for a few minutes before shutting them down" smacks of running an engine hard after hours of underloading. Good practice IMO if better methods are not employed. My Wabasto always runs plenty hot as it's an on and off heater. I remember shopping for the heater and the Wallas having a "throttle" to enable it to run on low flame I considered an advantage. But maybe the Wabasto is not hot enough as my supplier advised me to use kerosene after 800hrs running dirty diesel. But the Wallace and Wabasto are very different. At night my wife would probably prefer the Wallace as it's quieter.
When I installed the Webasto Air-top 2000 on my sailboat one of the options was to have the burner burn at various intensities based on demand. This would be nice since on the sailboat the temperature range was a bit wide for comfort. However, I was advised by everyone to not do this with the Webasto as they are known to have some problems if the burner is run at full.

I never had issues on the sailboat using my diesel fuel tank as the fuel source and even after I was stupid and left it on for a long time and had it empty my fuel tank, it still fired right back up after filling the fuel tank and performing a reset of the pump and burner.
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Old 11-14-2016, 07:01 PM   #39
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Wallas manufacturer tech reps said running it hot before shutdown was a good idea to burn any soot accumulation off.

Really not engine like and again, what makes sense works for me...it's a non presurized fuel furnace....soot accumulation on very low settings for long periods can bean issue, but not an indication of a "problem".
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Old 11-14-2016, 08:57 PM   #40
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psneeld,
"Problem"?
Depends on one's point of view I suppose.
Does the manual mention running it hot before shutdown as a preventative maintanance proceedure? One could think of a manual trans car as having a problem because it won't shift automatically. I enjoy shifting mine and consider it a plus. Not a very good analogy .. sorry.


Dave,
My Wabasto is an Airtop 2000 also and I had no idea the burning rate was adjustable. Taking it to Sure Marine tomorrow and I'll ask about that. IMO the burn rate as it is, is close enough to perfect to call it that. However since it got crudded up running diesel it's entirely possible it's adjusted too low. But for such a small heater it does heat the boat. Not toasty well below freezing but the Willard has no insulation and I have vents that could be closed. So I'm basically very satisfied w the heater.
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