Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 07-16-2012, 07:03 AM   #1
Guru
 
psneeld's Avatar
 
City: Ft Pierce
Vessel Name: Sold
Vessel Model: Was an Albin/PSN 40
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 28,143
Air Conditioner Problem

Scenario - Approximately 20 year old split unit, reverse cycle 16500 btu MarineAirrrrr unit in main salon. Water pump died a month back and was replaced in kind. Water pump and new cycling issue may/may not be related. Unit now runs fine for 5-10 minutes, 65 degree air blowing, 50 degree coils, with 90 degrees in cabin.... then compressor cycles off but trips nothing with fan still blowing. It has come back online after a period of time but most of the time I've just turned it off after the compressor has shut down.

The refrigerant low side is between 70-80 psi when the compressor is running.

The control unit is the old style 3 knob off/on, fan speed, thermostat.

Any ideas? Didn't see anything in the troubleshooting manual.

Thanks!
psneeld is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 07:14 AM   #2
Guru
 
Keith's Avatar
 
Vessel Name: Anastasia III
Vessel Model: Krogen 42
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 2,716
Is the cooling water flow good outside the boat and is the water warm? You might have gotten some gunk in the heat exchanger when you changed the old pump out. Might just try hooking up a water hose to the circuit and blowing it out.
Keith is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 07:31 AM   #3
Scraping Paint
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Vessel Model: CHB 48 Zodiac YL 4.2
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,804
Is it a true "split" with the evaporator in the air handler?

What is the refrigerant?

What is the discharge pressure?
RickB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 08:05 AM   #4
Guru
 
psneeld's Avatar
 
City: Ft Pierce
Vessel Name: Sold
Vessel Model: Was an Albin/PSN 40
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 28,143
Quote:
Originally Posted by RickB View Post
Is it a true "split" with the evaporator in the air handler?

What is the refrigerant?

What is the discharge pressure?
Kieth...water flow is good

RickB...yes true split
R22 still (at least PO didn't re-label)
Don't have a full guage system...
psneeld is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 01:20 PM   #5
Scraping Paint
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Vessel Model: CHB 48 Zodiac YL 4.2
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,804
Quote:
Originally Posted by psneeld View Post
Kieth...water flow is good

RickB...yes true split
R22 still (at least PO didn't re-label)
Don't have a full guage system...
The suction pressure sounds within limits, it would be interesting to know the discharge pressure just to confirm. Is there a large temperature drop across the condenser with regard to gas in and liquid out?

I would check the compressor current draw and see if there is an internal problem with the motor. Check the air handler as well to see if the fan motor might be drawing too much current. It doesn't sound like a refrigeration issue per se.
RickB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 04:10 PM   #6
Guru
 
psneeld's Avatar
 
City: Ft Pierce
Vessel Name: Sold
Vessel Model: Was an Albin/PSN 40
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 28,143
Quote:
Originally Posted by RickB View Post
The suction pressure sounds within limits, it would be interesting to know the discharge pressure just to confirm. Is there a large temperature drop across the condenser with regard to gas in and liquid out?

I would check the compressor current draw and see if there is an internal problem with the motor. Check the air handler as well to see if the fan motor might be drawing too much current. It doesn't sound like a refrigeration issue per se.
I'm thinking controls or processer board somehow too...nothing is tripping a breaker...the compressor just stops compressing....everything else normal.
psneeld is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 04:28 PM   #7
Scraping Paint
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Vessel Model: CHB 48 Zodiac YL 4.2
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,804
Try leaving the power on after it quits next time and see if it restarts on its own then quits again. I don't know if the logic board will permit that kind of start though, do you have to go to the thermostat to start the unit each time after a power loss like when changing from shore to onboard power? If not and if it restarts after taking a break, I would consider the compressor overload safety switch as likely suspect.
RickB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 04:33 PM   #8
Guru
 
psneeld's Avatar
 
City: Ft Pierce
Vessel Name: Sold
Vessel Model: Was an Albin/PSN 40
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 28,143
Quote:
Originally Posted by RickB View Post
Try leaving the power on after it quits next time and see if it restarts on its own then quits again. I don't know if the logic board will permit that kind of start though, do you have to go to the thermostat to start the unit each time after a power loss like when changing from shore to onboard power? If not and if it restarts after taking a break, I would consider the compressor overload safety switch as likely suspect.
thanks...I'll be taking a look there as there is no logic board that I know of...it's the old neanderthal system...on/off, fan, thermostat. Even the pump runs all the time the unit is "on" but not compressing.

may look into control updates just to break into the 21st century...might be all that I need..
psneeld is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 04:39 PM   #9
Scraping Paint
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Vessel Model: CHB 48 Zodiac YL 4.2
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,804
What is the model number and vintage?
RickB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 04:53 PM   #10
Guru
 
psneeld's Avatar
 
City: Ft Pierce
Vessel Name: Sold
Vessel Model: Was an Albin/PSN 40
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 28,143
please don't scold me...she has seen her service life...

model says C16H marine air...looks original as the ser number starts with year the boat was delivered "87"....

that's off the unit plate...don't have any other documentation.
psneeld is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 04:57 PM   #11
Scraping Paint
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Vessel Model: CHB 48 Zodiac YL 4.2
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,804
Quote:
Originally Posted by psneeld View Post
... please don't scold me...she has seen her service life...
I like old stuff ... I have a lot in common with most of it.
RickB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 05:05 PM   #12
Guru
 
psneeld's Avatar
 
City: Ft Pierce
Vessel Name: Sold
Vessel Model: Was an Albin/PSN 40
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 28,143
Quote:
Originally Posted by RickB View Post
I like old stuff ... I have a lot in common with most of it.
true...and it looks like she has life in her...just a weird pattern of operation for the limited number of reasons why it would kick off.
psneeld is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 05:15 PM   #13
Scraping Paint
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Vessel Model: CHB 48 Zodiac YL 4.2
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 3,804
I tried to find a schematic but your unit must have been built before the printing press was invented.

Look on the compressor casing for a "Klixon" type switch, probably held on by a wire clip. If there isn't anything then it might be inside the can.

If you are ambitious, when it quits next time, ring out the compressor power leads and see if you get an open. Ring it out before it quits next time so you will know what to expect.

If that doesn't get you anywhere, hot wire the compressor and fan and see what it does. At least you can eliminate those items.
RickB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 05:20 PM   #14
Guru
 
psneeld's Avatar
 
City: Ft Pierce
Vessel Name: Sold
Vessel Model: Was an Albin/PSN 40
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 28,143
Quote:
Originally Posted by RickB View Post
I tried to find a schematic but your unit must have been built before the printing press was invented.

Look on the compressor casing for a "Klixon" type switch, probably held on by a wire clip. If there isn't anything then it might be inside the can.

If you are ambitious, when it quits next time, ring out the compressor power leads and see if you get an open. Ring it out before it quits next time so you will know what to expect.

If that doesn't get you anywhere, hot wire the compressor and fan and see what it does. At least you can eliminate those items.
Thanks...right down the road I was headed...just posted to see if some other poor slob did all my homework for me first... and found something easy and simple...you know the stuff that never happens for me...on a BOAT nevertheless!
psneeld is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 05:23 PM   #15
Guru
 
Forkliftt's Avatar
 
City: Diberville Mississippi
Vessel Name: KnotDoneYet
Vessel Model: 1983 42' Present Sundeck
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 2,450
Quote:
Originally Posted by psneeld View Post
thanks...I'll be taking a look there as there is no logic board that I know of...it's the old neanderthal system...on/off, fan, thermostat. Even the pump runs all the time the unit is "on" but not compressing.

may look into control updates just to break into the 21st century...might be all that I need..
PS, there is an adjustment for the thermostat on the old dial units. If it has reverse cycle heat like mine you should feel a "click" from cool to off and then another "click" as it goes from off into heat. Off should roughly be in the center of the dial. If this is not the case, with the breaker off of course, remove the knob (two flat head screws) and you will see a small hole on the face as I recall. Use a flat long small screwdriver to reach in there and turn the screw slightly till you hear it click. It could be in or out- so consider this a disclaimer. Another possibility is the high pressure switch is failing. Mine also did this. Check your electrical schematic. It is mounted beside the compressor in the high pressure line.
Forkliftt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 05:27 PM   #16
Senior Member
 
bluebyu's Avatar
 
City: Northern Chesapeake
Vessel Model: Carver 440, 6CTA8.3's
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 424
When the compressor "turns off", is it still running, but unloaded?

I have a vintage 1984 Marine Aire, the thermostat is bad, it always keeps the compressor unloaded.

From memory, there are 2 solenoids, one for reverse cycle, one to load and unload compressor.

Hope this helps.
bluebyu is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 05:49 PM   #17
Guru
 
psneeld's Avatar
 
City: Ft Pierce
Vessel Name: Sold
Vessel Model: Was an Albin/PSN 40
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 28,143
Quote:
Originally Posted by Forkliftt View Post
PS, there is an adjustment for the thermostat on the old dial units. If it has reverse cycle heat like mine you should feel a "click" from cool to off and then another "click" as it goes from off into heat. Off should roughly be in the center of the dial. If this is not the case, with the breaker off of course, remove the knob (two flat head screws) and you will see a small hole on the face as I recall. Use a flat long small screwdriver to reach in there and turn the screw slightly till you hear it click. It could be in or out- so consider this a disclaimer. Another possibility is the high pressure switch is failing. Mine also did this. Check your electrical schematic. It is mounted beside the compressor in the high pressure line.
thanks..a real possibility...just not hot enough to get too anti- Buffet and tear into her just yet!
psneeld is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 05:50 PM   #18
Guru
 
psneeld's Avatar
 
City: Ft Pierce
Vessel Name: Sold
Vessel Model: Was an Albin/PSN 40
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 28,143
Quote:
Originally Posted by bluebyu View Post
When the compressor "turns off", is it still running, but unloaded?

I have a vintage 1984 Marine Aire, the thermostat is bad, it always keeps the compressor unloaded.

From memory, there are 2 solenoids, one for reverse cycle, one to load and unload compressor.

Hope this helps.
no... the compessor stops running...
psneeld is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-16-2012, 09:16 PM   #19
Guru
 
Forkliftt's Avatar
 
City: Diberville Mississippi
Vessel Name: KnotDoneYet
Vessel Model: 1983 42' Present Sundeck
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 2,450
Quote:
Originally Posted by psneeld View Post
thanks..a real possibility...just not hot enough to get too anti- Buffet and tear into her just yet!
No need to tear very far. Believe it or not, I pulled my thermostat loose this weekend and grabbed a couple of pictures with my iPhone so now I can share. A marine AC tech shared this with me once when mine acted up. As I recall, all you need is to remove the knob as one picture shows. Then notice the springs and brass colored adjustment screw in the other pic. As you adjust it, it changes the spring tension on the small round part the capillary tubing enters.

Forkliftt is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-17-2012, 09:08 AM   #20
Guru
 
psneeld's Avatar
 
City: Ft Pierce
Vessel Name: Sold
Vessel Model: Was an Albin/PSN 40
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 28,143
Thanks Forkliftt!
psneeld is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


» Trawler Port Captains
Port Captains are TF volunteers who can serve as local guides or assist with local arrangements and information. Search below to locate Port Captains near your destination. To learn more about this program read here: TF Port Captain Program





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 04:15 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012