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Old 11-22-2012, 06:43 AM   #81
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Big boats can be really cheap to keep , you usually just have to give up the dock walk, and learn to row out to your mooring.

In CT a mooring is about 1/10 the cost of a slip per season.
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Old 11-22-2012, 06:54 AM   #82
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Big boats can be really cheap to keep...
Last time I heard that it was a broker talking to a prospective buyer.
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Old 11-23-2012, 07:55 AM   #83
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How expensive is it to replace or repair equipment you don't own?

I think you might have spent too much time with the 50 Meter boat boys , where the sat fax machine going down is a crisis!

Or the 5000 GPD water maker breaking down makes the boat uninhabitible?
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Old 11-23-2012, 12:02 PM   #84
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A raft can be really cheap to own, too. While it is possible to have a big boat and not spend much money, I think that particular big boat would not be one I'd want anything to do with as it will either be so minimal I wouldn't want to use it or, more likely, in really bad condition.

Expenses like moorage, insurance, power (in some harbors), and haulouts are all going to cost more as boat size goes up. Sure, you can put the boat on a buoy--- maybe--- but most boaters aren't going to want to screw with that. And regardless of where it's sitting, the insurance and haulout fees will be the same unless one has cockamamie ideas about careening the boat on the beach to repaint the bottom.

Most recreational boaters aren't going to want to camp out on a boat with a Coleman stove, a jug of fresh water, a sleeping bag, and a bucket to poop in. So while they may not have or need satcom or watermakers, they want a galley, heat or AC, a fresh water system, head(s), a shower, lights, most likely entertainment like music and/or TV, navigation and communication equipment, and so on. And all this stuff requires maintenance and occasionally repair. And the bigger the boat the longer and perhaps more complex the wire runs and plumbing runs and the more sinks and toilets and lights and so on there will be.

Which is why when we decided to get a cruising boat we followed the advice I read in the 1960s in a boating story in Boy's Life magazine which was "buy the smallest boat you can afford." Which does not mean to buy a boat that's too small for your requirements, but that the smaller a boat you buy for x-dollars, the newer or in better condition it will be.
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Old 11-23-2012, 01:14 PM   #85
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And I think you've done well Marin.

Here's a "raft". The blue one on the right. Cruising range sucks but accommodations abound and anti-fouling issues don't exist.

This is the McFarland's Flotel in Thorne Bay. The house started out in Ketchikan on land like normal houses but was moved onto the "raft" and has been there for over 30 years I think. The closer pic is of unloading stores brought from town in a container on skiffs.
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Old 11-23-2012, 01:54 PM   #86
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MASSIVE THREAD CREEP ALERT! ALL CHILDREN GET AWAY FROM THE WINDOWS AND UNDER YOUR DESKS IMMEDIATELY!

Eric--- I like your floathouse photos. Very scenic place to have them, too. While I wouldn't want to live in a floathouse I really like looking at them. This is one of my favorites. It's in Maple Bay on Vancouver Island.

The fuel range on this one is whatever the tug towing its range is. But, they still have to pay moorage and power. And insurance. So still no free lunch.
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Old 11-23-2012, 03:18 PM   #87
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THREAD RUSH

Here's an economy model and an expanded one. They usually grow by adding another little float house ... or more. The econo model is for sale last I heard.

I wonder how soon we're going to get caught Rush Creeping Marin?
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Old 11-23-2012, 05:44 PM   #88
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Guys I dont mind the recent pics at all, in some places I think that accommodation is a great idea.

But Marin, I cant reconcile your 'need for speed' with 'buy the smallest boat you can afford'. Waterline length is everything - speed, well a bit of it anyway, then comes cheap in terms of fuel use.

In theory a very lightweight planing hull would be the answer, but hard to keep it light enough and have all the comforts.
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Old 11-23-2012, 08:42 PM   #89
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But Marin, I cant reconcile your 'need for speed' with 'buy the smallest boat you can afford'. Waterline length is everything -
Smallest boat you can afford does not mean smaller boat than will meet your requirements. And waterline length is not everything. Ever seen an Eastbay 39? Nice size boat for two people and plenty fast.

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Old 11-23-2012, 08:55 PM   #90
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The Eastbay's have their place, and look fine. With 2 x 380 HP (or optional 2 x 500 HP) and just 352 gal fuel they wont go very far at their +20kn cruise speed. But might well serve requirements for folks that have to rush back to work.
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Old 11-23-2012, 09:24 PM   #91
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Fuel is readily available from here on up through SE Alaska so range is not really a consideration for us. We rarely have more than half our tankage full at any given time as it is. So speed is a lot more important to us than range. Unfortunately our current boat is set up the other way round.
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Old 11-25-2012, 07:18 PM   #92
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The Eastbay's have their place, and look fine. With 2 x 380 HP (or optional 2 x 500 HP) and just 352 gal fuel they wont go very far at their +20kn cruise speed.
Brian, how about the Alaska range sold up your way?
Similar concept,better accommodation, nice build quality. The new 46 would do it for me. So would a used 45.
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Old 11-25-2012, 08:18 PM   #93
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There was a time, back when I was working full time, when one of those Alaska's would have been shortlisted for sure. But these days I have no need to rush anywhere, and at present am quite content with my OA 50 Mk 1. I'm hoping to average 50% of my time on board. Its kinda like a mobile beach cottage and a great retirement home, all comforts available.
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Old 11-26-2012, 06:28 AM   #94
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Yes, Bruce, The Alaska 46 sedan would be my dream boat for sure.
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Old 11-27-2012, 12:46 AM   #95
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Brian and Peter,Though Alaskas have much more power than our "trawlers", reviews say they operate well at both displacement and high speed. My reservation is the underloading of the engines at low speed, but I doubt it will be a problem for me,despite the 45ft boat with around 600 hours up, for sale in Tasmania,offered at an already reduced $359K, or offer.Must be good buying around 300K+ broker`s cut. My current spend on decks, and new covers, pretty much locks me into enjoying the improvements. I like to dream but really don`t need a bigger boat for 2 people.
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Old 11-27-2012, 01:10 AM   #96
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I don't think that under-loading engines is anywhere near the problem, particularly for newer engines, that the popular myth would imply.

And for those with twins, if you were intend to spend a lot of time at such low rpm and load that you had difficulty in reaching a reasonable operating temperature, then the answer is to be able to run on one engine. For this you need a folding/feathering prop or a gearbox that is happy to freewheel.

Like you I am locked in, and I'm ok with that. I dream as well, but typically its '5 ft itis' and for something of much more recent build rather than much faster but shorter.
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Old 12-16-2012, 07:47 AM   #97
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I have a Schooner 44 in Brazil that we just use the engine, but I bought last April a Saundeck Cruizer 55 to make an upgrade. I need to cruise to Brazil, 2 engines to be safe. We also need more space because soon we'll have grandsons and the family will grow up. Once we are in Brazil, I don't need 2 engines but I couldn't throw away the second one. I would like a trawler with a sail hull but it's more expencive.
We bought a Hi Star 55 and we're remaking a lot of things and installing new eletronics to be ready to our cruise.
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Old 12-16-2012, 10:28 AM   #98
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Hull design

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Everyone is different but to me the hull design is the most important thing. Lots of other things enter into it but the hull is the main feature but only if you appreciate what a hull can do for you. All this talk about galley up or down, aft cockpit or no, twin or single ect ect amuses me. Give me a great hull whose lines are sweet music and I'll take whatever else comes with it ... more or less.
Please tell me more about what hull do what. Some like fantail trawlers may react differently in sea conditions. We are looking at a fantail trawler and would like to know more about its handling characters in different sea condition .
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Old 12-16-2012, 12:27 PM   #99
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Show us some pics and you'll surely get some opinions .. mine included. However generally speaking;

1. The boat is probably quite old as fantail sterns fell out of favor in about 1935.
2. Since she's an old boat w a FT stern she'll no doubt be narrow and probably have a rounded bottom so she'll roll a good deal.
3. She'll be very efficient up to about 15% below her hull speed.
4. She'll handle quartering seas better than most anything else.

But she could be a late model FG boat whereas the stern is a fantail mostly for style and basic cuteness so for further comments pics are basically necessary.
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Old 12-16-2012, 02:34 PM   #100
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Two full displacement hulls, same LOA, beam, draft and displacement. One with a fantail and the other with a transom.

The fantail will be shorter on the waterline. Resistance will be lower at very low speeds (no wavemaking) but much higher at high speed (once wavemaking begins). The fantail will have less stability (less waterplane area) and probably be more "pitchy" bucking or running in a sea. If the rudder and keel are of adequate area the fantail may be more directionally stable. The transom may be pushed around by following seas, a larger rudder and deeper keel alleviate most of this. The fantail will trim by the stern more as speed increases, the transom will run flatter and have a higher speed capability. The fantail won't bang as much when backing into a wave.
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