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Old 11-30-2012, 06:55 AM   #1
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finishing the ceiling

Hello all, we are new to this forum and to the liveaboard life. Just moved on board TODAY!!!
We are basically gutting the staterooms/head in our trawler to insulate and refinish the inside.
My question is this, we have looked at lots of pics of ceilings in trawlers and alot of them use planks with a v-joint. Is this for a specific reason or is it just what has been used in the past, like teak and holly floors?
We would like to use a type of tongue and groove and finish the planks smooth, looking more like a wall board.
I am going to post another question regarding the head as well on a separate thread so if you have info please help us with that question as well.
Thanks so much, I'm loving the info I'm finding here.
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Old 11-30-2012, 10:52 AM   #2
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Originally Posted by Lobo View Post
Hello all, we are new to this forum and to the liveaboard life. Just moved on board TODAY!!!
We are basically gutting the staterooms/head in our trawler to insulate and refinish the inside.
My question is this, we have looked at lots of pics of ceilings in trawlers and alot of them use planks with a v-joint. Is this for a specific reason or is it just what has been used in the past, like teak and holly floors?
We would like to use a type of tongue and groove and finish the planks smooth, looking more like a wall board.
I am going to post another question regarding the head as well on a separate thread so if you have info please help us with that question as well.
Thanks so much, I'm loving the info I'm finding here.
Our ceilings are plain old ply which we texture with wood strips to accent the ceiling. We textured using the course texture mix in the off white paint down in the state rooms as they are sort of dark to begin with. The Salon ceiling we covered with a textured vinyl covering that looks like a weave, and painted a rose/cantaloupe color to match the teak beams and strips. When we bought he Eagle it had way to much teak, which made the boat look dull/dark, so we want to bright it up. Being use Exterior Bright side pain as it does come in an assortment of colors. I used plan oak wood 1/2 rounds and stain them a teak color and satin varnish. We still have plenty of teak wood.
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Old 11-30-2012, 12:37 PM   #3
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Not trying to be picky here just using boat terms.
Ceilings are boards on a bulkhead or on the wall ??? Over your head is the overhead??
A floor is properly, a structural member which ties a frame to the keelson and keel

Someone set me straight here.

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Old 11-30-2012, 12:38 PM   #4
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The original idea, ceilings made from strips or battens, was that strips could follow 3D shape of the hull and have spaces between them to vent the inside of the planking. I used 1/4 x 1-1/2" pine battens rounded over on one side, stained lightly and prefinished. They were placed touching each other so the result did look a little like a "V" groove. I was very happy with the result and it has stood the test of time.

If by ceilings, you mean overheads, as the previous responder thought; I have had bad luck with std. perforated headliner. I got mine from Sailrite Co. and it was a mildew magnet until I finally painted it with mildewproof paint.
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Old 11-30-2012, 05:26 PM   #5
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terms

I'm trying to get used to the right terms now. When I said ceiling, I meant the walls from the floor up to the overhead.
Thanks for the info so far.
So once we have the hull insulated we should be able to use the tongue and groove, sanded smooth rather than the v-joint as long as the planks can be bent to the shape of the hull? The methods would be similar to how a cedar canoe is put together. Of course the planks would be fastened down to the hull.
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Old 11-30-2012, 06:49 PM   #6
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Lobo;

Not trying to add to the confusion here re the term "ceiling", but I have always seen it restricted to the inner lining of the ribs, so an interior wall, either fore and aft or athwartships will be called a bulkhead and the underside of the deck will be the "Deckhead" or "overhead".
The usual ceiling covering is as explained by Brooksie.
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Old 12-01-2012, 12:58 PM   #7
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"The usual ceiling covering is as explained by Brooksie."
More information please, I don't understand this statement.
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Old 12-01-2012, 01:03 PM   #8
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"The usual ceiling covering is as explained by Brooksie."
More information please, I don't understand this statement.
Never mind, I went back and figured it out.
Thanks for the info Brooksie.
So is the space or a v joint necessary or will the tongue and groove work? Anyone tried it?
THe approached we were looking at was similar to how a cedar canoe is built, useing strips that are fitted together and sanded down to look solid. Any thoughts about this?
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Old 12-01-2012, 06:45 PM   #9
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Never mind, I went back and figured it out.
Thanks for the info Brooksie.
So is the space or a v joint necessary or will the tongue and groove work? Anyone tried it?
THe approached we were looking at was similar to how a cedar canoe is built, useing strips that are fitted together and sanded down to look solid. Any thoughts about this?
I don't know why the T&G would not work. Actual spaces would only be necessary if you wanted / needed the area behind the ceiling to breathe.

You didn't say what kind of T&G you were getting, what you were fastening into, what area of your boat you are doing, or if your boat is wood or FG. So with that many variables, I,m not sure you will get a clear answer here and if you did, I'm not sure it would be correct.

My experience with the aformentioned 1/4" X 1-1/2" pine battens in the fwd. cabin area of my 35' downeast boat was that I was glad they were no thicker nor wider and it took three people to bend and screw them in place working around the chart table and 4 bunks already in place.
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Old 12-01-2012, 06:56 PM   #10
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Greetings,
As Mr. Brooksie alluded to, I've heard one should finish (coat-paint/varnish) ALL sides of any piece of wood installed on a vessel. (not only the side that may be visible).
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Old 12-02-2012, 07:06 AM   #11
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The guy next door has an old Nordy 62.

They use 3/16 ply sheets covered with a plastic material.

Everything snaps up with plastic catches ,,sorta velcro like system , but both sides are plastic that catch on identical plastic.

Pulls down fairly simply , so changing wiring , (he is switching to LED) or ordinary access is a SNAP!

Recovering is also very easy when the time comes to refresh the overhead..
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Old 12-06-2012, 10:48 AM   #12
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You can weaken the planks by ripping/sawing slices/groves deep enough so the plank will bend. Then when fastening to the wall fill the groves with epoxy with additive which will harder and give the blank strength again. When rebuilding the Portuguese bridge I used ply that I ripped groves in, and then filled the groves with epoxy.
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Old 12-12-2012, 03:12 AM   #13
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You didn't say what kind of T&G you were getting, what you were fastening into, what area of your boat you are doing, or if your boat is wood or FG. So with that many variables, I,m not sure you will get a clear answer here and if you did, I'm not sure it would be correct.

My experience with the aformentioned 1/4" X 1-1/2" pine battens in the fwd. cabin area of my 35' downeast boat was that I was glad they were no thicker nor wider and it took three people to bend and screw them in place working around the chart table and 4 bunks already in place.[/QUOTE]

We are going down to the hull in a fiberglass 50'. The first area and the one most concerned with the planks is the forward stateroom and head (the head was put in the V). We won't have to work around other things too much although the head is going to be tight working in. Once we strip it down we will be f/g in a system of 'ribs' then insulating then fastening down the planks to form the inside walls. Once the forward staterooms and head are done we will then move onto the salon/galley/2nd head.

WE were considering using Fir stips, what do you think?
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Old 12-12-2012, 03:14 AM   #14
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You can weaken the planks by ripping/sawing slices/groves deep enough so the plank will bend. Then when fastening to the wall fill the groves with epoxy with additive which will harder and give the blank strength again. When rebuilding the Portuguese bridge I used ply that I ripped groves in, and then filled the groves with epoxy.

Thanks, I'll pass this on.
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Old 12-12-2012, 10:55 AM   #15
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Thanks, I'll pass this on.
You might want to frame the interior, like a house, before the planks. The Eagle staterooms have a 2" X 2" frame that 1/4" ply/veneer was fasen to. The 2"X 2" where fiber glassed to the hull. For the interior I used Liquid Nail for the bath room which has held for 15+ years. Most of the interior stuff, lights/paints/fixtures was bought at Lows as the marine stuff was/is to expensive and boaty/marine/shippy for us. I mean just because the Eagle is ugly shippy exterior does not mean the interior has to be.
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Old 12-12-2012, 11:47 AM   #16
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Read Mr. Lobo's post P/F! That's what he's intending on doing.
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Old 12-12-2012, 03:34 PM   #17
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WE were considering using Fir stips, what do you think?[/QUOTE]

Yes, fir strips even nicer than pine and will finish up beautifully. The battens (ribs) on the hull to fasten them to are the hard part. We used plastering lathes sp?, buttered with thickened epoxy, and a dab of hotmelt on each end to hold them while the epoxy set. Where the curve was bad, same but with 5 min epoxy on the ends. Where it was very bad, ripped thin and applied in 2 pcs as above. The ceiling strips were then applied with lightly countersunk oval head screws no finishing washers or plugs. They look fine and are easily removable for access to wiring and spray rail bolts.
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Old 12-13-2012, 03:44 AM   #18
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For the interior I used Liquid Nail for the bath room which has held for 15+ years.
So you used the Liquid Nail instead of fg in the bathroom to put your 'ribs' in?
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Old 12-13-2012, 03:48 AM   #19
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Question

Quote:
Originally Posted by Brooksie View Post
WE were considering using Fir stips, what do you think?
Yes, fir strips even nicer than pine and will finish up beautifully. The battens (ribs) on the hull to fasten them to are the hard part. We used plastering lathes sp?, buttered with thickened epoxy, and a dab of hotmelt on each end to hold them while the epoxy set. Where the curve was bad, same but with 5 min epoxy on the ends. Where it was very bad, ripped thin and applied in 2 pcs as above. The ceiling strips were then applied with lightly countersunk oval head screws no finishing washers or plugs. They look fine and are easily removable for access to wiring and spray rail bolts.[/QUOTE]

Thanks, we were wondering about the screws, if they would look like zippers every few feet along the walls but if countersunk... We were wondering if we glued the tongue and groove to fasten the planks if brad nails would be enough to hold it down since it will be solid.
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Old 12-13-2012, 09:26 AM   #20
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Yes, fir strips even nicer than pine and will finish up beautifully. The battens (ribs) on the hull to fasten them to are the hard part. We used plastering lathes sp?, buttered with thickened epoxy, and a dab of hotmelt on each end to hold them while the epoxy set. Where the curve was bad, same but with 5 min epoxy on the ends. Where it was very bad, ripped thin and applied in 2 pcs as above. The ceiling strips were then applied with lightly countersunk oval head screws no finishing washers or plugs. They look fine and are easily removable for access to wiring and spray rail bolts.
Thanks, we were wondering about the screws, if they would look like zippers every few feet along the walls but if countersunk... We were wondering if we glued the tongue and groove to fasten the planks if brad nails would be enough to hold it down since it will be solid.[/QUOTE]

Depending on how much bend you need you may not get it using tongue and groove. You can use a canoe bit set on a router which gives a round on one edge of the plank and concave on the other which fit very nicely together and will bend to a sharp angle and can be glued in the joint. IMHO I would not consider using brad nails as the primary fastener, they can work themselves out especially where bends are involved.
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