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Old 02-27-2013, 08:31 PM   #21
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Were we buying a boat we would not accept a seller-provided survey. Were we selling a boat we would not pay for a buyer's survey.

All the risk of buying a boat is on the buyer. None is on the seller. As a seller, if a potential buyer is fool enough not to have the boat checked out by competent hull and engine surveyors that's not my problem nor my responsibility.

If a potential buyer cannot afford the cost of a haulout and survey(s) then he probably cannot afford the boat at which point we would have no more interest in dealing with him.

To Mike's point, if a buyer feels surveyors are not worth hiring and wants to do his own survey, that's fine. But it doesn't change anything. As the seller I would feel no obligation to pay anything toward that person's inspection. All costs associated with the potential buyer's "survey" or inspection-- haulout, pressure wash, you name it--- would be borne by the potential buyer.

We paid for the hull and engine surveys and the haulout for the GB we ultimately bought. We did this because we wanted no influence or involvement whatsoever on the part of the seller on who we chose for our surveyors, how we did the inspections, or where we had the boat hauled.
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Old 02-27-2013, 08:41 PM   #22
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Were we buying a boat we would not accept a seller-provided survey. Were we selling a boat we would not pay for a buyer's survey.
I have taken the above position when selling my last 7 boats. Although it has a "hard ass" ring to it, if you want to protect yourself, as a seller, it's the only prudent position to take.
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Old 02-28-2013, 01:34 PM   #23
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Good points Marin and Walt. I have had some folks say I don't need surveys, but if I want to protect myself as a buyer, then I get the surveys done.
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Old 02-28-2013, 01:42 PM   #24
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The second time you would rather not. The haul out and survey is for your benefit and peace of mind, not the seller's. He or she could care less if you have a survey. And since you are paying for the survey (the boat must be hauled out as part of the survey), the surveyor is working for you, not the seller. It's his/her obligation to disclose any problems to you.

If you can convince the seller to pay for the haul out, fine. I suspect you will not be able to unless the seller is figuring extra expenses into his selling price.
If they want to sluff-off a perspective buyer, that's fine. But let's be realistic, what seller has EVER price their boat, house, or car at what they want to get for it? There is room in the price for getting a haul-n-wash. The next time I buy a boat, the condition of the bottom and running gear is way down the list. I'll get a diver to look at it for way less money. What I am going to look for next time are things like fuel tank status and filter capacity and paint condition.
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Old 02-28-2013, 01:48 PM   #25
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If they want to sluff-off a perspective buyer, that's fine. But let's be realistic, what seller has EVER price their boat, house, or car at what they want to get for it? There is room in the price for getting a haul-n-wash. The next time I buy a boat, the condition of the bottom and running gear is way down the list. I'll get a diver to look at it for way less money. What I am going to look for next time are things like fuel tank status and filter capacity and paint condition.
Pay for an in water survey. Then if all is fine do the out of water survey to satisfy the insurance company and bank. Saves a lot of time and most surveyors won't charge a big difference in price.

My money is on you paying for all of it. Haul out, pressure wash and Survey.
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Old 02-28-2013, 02:21 PM   #26
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So say in the Seattle area, what would be a standard price for hauling a boat, power wash, then slipping it back in?
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Old 02-28-2013, 02:23 PM   #27
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Hi Tom,

Are you getting close to buying? I'd negotiate. See you soon.

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Still looking and waiting on the farm to sell. Making sure I have all my ducks in a row. I tend to research stuff to death so I am informed.
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Old 02-28-2013, 02:23 PM   #28
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As a member of the Florida Yacht Brokers Association I use the standard Purchase and Sale Agreement of the FYBA. The agreement reads "Seller shall pay all running expenses for, and assume the risks associated with, the trial run, and the buyer shall pay all costs of the survey, including associated costs, e.g.haul-out,dry dock and subcontractors' charges"
With such a long time for a boat to be on the market now, often the props are fouled so the seller pays to have the props cleaned so that we can have an accurate top RPM run, the buyer pays for pressure wash.
However everything can be negotiated.
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Old 02-28-2013, 02:47 PM   #29
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So say in the Seattle area, what would be a standard price for hauling a boat, power wash, then slipping it back in?
We pay about $800 for a haulout, pressure wash, bottom prep, bottom paint, and re-launch. The boat is in the yard for a week and this cost does not include the extra cost of using a more expensive paint than the yard's "basic" paint. So our total cost is probably about a grand plus the cost of polishing both props.

The cost for a haulout, pressure wash, hang in the slings for an hour, and re-launch was less than $200 for our last insurance survey IIRC.
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Old 02-28-2013, 02:50 PM   #30
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If they want to sluff-off a perspective buyer, that's fine. But let's be realistic, what seller has EVER price their boat, house, or car at what they want to get for it? There is room in the price for getting a haul-n-wash. The next time I buy a boat, the condition of the bottom and running gear is way down the list. I'll get a diver to look at it for way less money. What I am going to look for next time are things like fuel tank status and filter capacity and paint condition.
I have had sellers price at exactly what they wanted for the boat. I even had a buyer pay a thousand more because they felt like the boat was worth more.

The buyer and only the buyer should pay all of the costs of the survey/haul. The seller never knows until the check clears if the buyers are kicking tires. The seller should not incur this risk. He the seller is already out the hassle of the survey and sea trial. Our due diligence should be at our direction and expense.

Often a quick haul is a very minor cost and well worth the effort. If a bad cutlass bearing shows up most sellers agree right away to take care of it as it is often unknown to them until she is hauled.
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Old 02-28-2013, 03:29 PM   #31
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As mentioned in a previous post, our survey next week will be covered 50% by the seller. But the important part for us as the buyers is that I arranged the survey with the surveyor, and as far as he knows, it is being done strictly for us. I will of course, provide the seller with a copy of the survey, as that is only fair.

The cost for a half lift (90 minutes in the slings) is $350, plus $160 for the pressure wash, at the Mosquito Creek Marina in North Vancouver. For a 42' vessel. I am covering that.
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Old 02-28-2013, 03:34 PM   #32
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So... What have we learned here? There is no right answer
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Old 02-28-2013, 03:40 PM   #33
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Greetings,



There's supposed to be an answer here?
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Old 02-28-2013, 06:11 PM   #34
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So... What have we learned here? There is no right answer
Each to their own I guess. But the norm would be for the buyer to foot the bill. If you can get the seller to pay part, then that is icing on the cake.
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Old 02-28-2013, 07:07 PM   #35
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We pay about $800 for a haulout, pressure wash, bottom prep, bottom paint, and re-launch. The boat is in the yard for a week and this cost does not include the extra cost of using a more expensive paint than the yard's "basic" paint. So our total cost is probably about a grand plus the cost of polishing both props.

The cost for a haulout, pressure wash, hang in the slings for an hour, and re-launch was less than $200 for our last insurance survey IIRC.
Cheap by Aussie standard pricing. Last time I checked $800 would buy haul/relaunch and 2 days out the water in between. DIY all else. 3 years back, haul-out, on slings an hour, was around $400.
Marin, would you really let a buyer dictate where the buyer gets the boat gets hauled? I`d co-operate but want final say, it`s still my boat.
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Old 02-28-2013, 07:33 PM   #36
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So say in the Seattle area, what would be a standard price for hauling a boat, power wash, then slipping it back in?
Around my area, yards publish their prices. Why not see if they have a website wirh prices on it or just call and find out?
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Old 02-28-2013, 07:35 PM   #37
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So... What have we learned here? There is no right answer
The norm is for the prospective buyer to pay for the haulout and survey. Yes, it might be negotiable, but it would be very unusual for the seller to pay.
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Old 02-28-2013, 08:13 PM   #38
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A friend and I are about to do a short haul on his DeFever 40, just a couple of hull numbers past mine, except his is twin screw.

Our quote to hang in the slings during the yards lunch hour is 3.00 USD per foot - 120 bucks. St. Augustine Central Fl USA east coast for our Oz members.

Were measuring the rudders.

Just another data point on the cost of a short haul for a survey.

In my earlier post in this thread I said I had not met a surveyor I thought was worth his fee. I did not mean to imply that there are no surveyors out there who are not worth trusting. Obviously, I dont know about all surveyors. It may just be my bad luck, and the fact that I live in FL.

The buyer pays, selects the yard, and owns the survey. The seller can refuse the yard, but will likely loose the sale.

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Old 03-01-2013, 06:21 AM   #39
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A friend and I are about to do a short haul on his DeFever 40, just a couple of hull numbers past mine, except his is twin screw.

Our quote to hang in the slings during the yards lunch hour is 3.00 USD per foot - 120 bucks. St. Augustine Central Fl USA east coast for our Oz members.

We’re measuring the rudders.

Just another data point on the cost of a short haul for a survey.

In my earlier post in this thread I said I had not met a surveyor I thought was worth his fee. I did not mean to imply that there are no surveyors out there who are not worth trusting. Obviously, I don’t know about all surveyors. It may just be my bad luck, and the fact that I live in FL.

The buyer pays, selects the yard, and owns the survey. The seller can refuse the yard, but will likely loose the sale.

Mike
In my case, I selected the surveyor but the seller selected the yard. It didn't matter to me, I had no experience with any of the local yards.

The boat was located 50 or so miles from town and the owners wanted to take one last overnight trip on it to the yard. Again, it didn't matter to me.
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Old 03-01-2013, 06:41 AM   #40
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And in my experience the survey belongs to the person who paid for it, usually the buyer. In other words if the buyer does not buy, the surveyor can't give a copy to the seller, or another prospect, without the buyers permission.
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