Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 01-14-2016, 02:47 PM   #21
Guru
 
Giggitoni's Avatar
 
City: Vallejo, California
Country: United States
Vessel Name: Mahalo Moi
Vessel Model: 1986 Grand Banks 42 Classic
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 1,532
My friends and I made a couple of trips between Long Beach, California and Catalina Island in a canoe with a compass. The direction of the ocean waves helped. I don't believe my parents knew about our adventures...!
__________________
Advertisement

__________________
Ray
"Mahalo Moi"
1986 GB-42 Classic
ΜΟΛΩΝ ΛΑβΕ
Giggitoni is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2016, 03:13 PM   #22
Veteran Member
 
City: Louisville, KY
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Jessie
Vessel Model: 43' Marine Trader 49' Albin Tricabin
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 98
My experience is that Mayhem does not visit you quite as often when you still have doubts about your technology and you still have a slight apprehension of your capabilities.

Your greatest concern should be at that moment when you have all the technology required and when you feel yourself most confident. That is when we hear the whispers from Human Nature that: "You can do this!"

And, it is in that precise moment of comfort when Mother Nature takes notice. It is at that precise moment also when Uncle Murphy wakes up and decides he wants to mess with you. So, just when you begin to think that you have all the bases covered, you have new demons who turn your task into a nightmare and who don't give much of a crap about any of what you thought you could do. You are screwed!

Never allow yourself to get to that confident moment.
__________________

Cuttyhunk47 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2016, 06:06 PM   #23
Guru
 
BandB's Avatar
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 13,171
Anytime I'm dealing with technology, not limited to boating, I have a backup plan. I believe in redundancy. We have multiple navigation options and charts available on non-networked equipment as well as networked, plus the ability to print charts.
BandB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2016, 06:12 PM   #24
Master and Commander
 
markpierce's Avatar
 
City: Vallejo CA
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Carquinez Coot
Vessel Model: 2011 Seahorse Marine Coot hull #6
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 10,265
Quote:
Originally Posted by Giggitoni View Post
My friends and I made a couple of trips between Long Beach, California and Catalina Island in a canoe with a compass. The direction of the ocean waves helped. I don't believe my parents knew about our adventures...!
You crazy guy!! Parents back then, at least mine, weren't so concerned about an individual child's safety as they had several children to replace those possibly lost. Or perhaps my father was optimistic/fatalistic after surviving being shot out of the sky.
__________________
Kar-KEEN-ez Koot
markpierce is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2016, 06:19 PM   #25
Guru
 
koliver's Avatar
 
City: Saltspring Island
Country: BC, canada
Vessel Name: Retreat
Vessel Model: C&L 44
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts: 2,173
In the late 50s, early 60s, lots of lake and ocean boating in the family 17' on a 50hp outboard. My Dad encouraged me to run the boat, so from the age of 10, I did so. Then commercial fishing at age 18, single deckhand on a salmon troller, took me from Vancouver, up the inside, the Charlottes (as they were then) SE Ak and outside to Fairweather ground. Then, nav was Loran, check with sextant, RDF. So when GPS came along things got real easy.

Presently have a large no of paper charts, several GPS, PC real time navigation, chart plotter, depth, radar. So much redundancy!
koliver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2016, 06:38 PM   #26
Veteran Member
 
dkasprzak's Avatar
 
City: Currently - Aransas Pass
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Hattini
Vessel Model: 1985 43' Hatteras Motor Yacht
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 61
Started "boating" in '58 same year I was born...don't remember my Dad not having a boat at any time in my life, his were all runabouts. Bought my first in '83 a 16'center console, it had a depth flasher, compass, paper charts, ruler and watch. In '92 moved to an old 31' Chris Craft Commander, it had a digital depth gauge, compass, same paper charts, ruler and watch. In 94 bought a 23' Compaq sailboat, it had a digital depth finder, compass, same paper charts, ruler and watch PLUS Loran-C. Sold each one of those to buy the next boat. In 99' bought and still own a 97 19' Shallow Sport, has compass, paper charts, ruler and watch. In 2015 bought a 43' Hatteras MY, has GPS Plotter, Radar, multiple digital depth finders, compass, (new) paper charts of my boating area, ruler and watch.

Learning to plot a course and run it by compass and watch for me is one of the most enjoyable aspects of boating. One of the posters mentioned "Running Ahead of the Boat" and that is exactly what you do when you have pre-plotted your course. You are aware of what visual you are looking for next, approximately how long will it take you to get to it and you get a feel for when something may be wrong with your course when it does not appear as expected.

Along with the electronics mentioned above on the Hatteras, I carry an iPad with iSailor app and two iPhones with the same app. But I still sit and plot the course before leaving, contemplating the trip trying to anticipate how it will go etc. I don't always file a proper float plan with someone but I do ALWAYS let someone I know I can depend on know the high level plan.

I still have a couple of old charts of my home waters that have been retired with much plotting on them. Its fun to look them over and remember those trips and the good, bad and frightening things that happened during them.
dkasprzak is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2016, 07:39 PM   #27
Scraping Paint
 
City: -
Country: -
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 13,748
Quote:
Originally Posted by dkasprzak View Post
But I still sit and plot the course before leaving, contemplating the trip trying to anticipate how it will go etc.
I think this is a very smart practice. We do it, too, and when we go to destinations we have been to before or go to a lot, we always follow the course we previously plotted and entered for these destinations. We do this even if the visibility and conditions are perfect.

Our reasoning is that should conditions change and the visibility suddenly go down we are already running "on instruments" so the transition to this mode of operating the boat is seamless with no confusion or anxiety.

This practice has served us well on numerous occasions when cruising in good visibility and coming around an island to be confronted with dense fog right down to the surface in a channel.

The photo is a good example of this. The band of dense fog is down a strait that lies between us and our home port. The strait happens to be a primary shipping route through this area so being able to transition to near-zero visibility operations with the added task of a constant radar watch is pretty important.

We don't want to be mentally scrambling around to get used to accurately maintaining a multiple-leg course despite the best efforts of the currents to push us off it, monitoring the radar for traffic and keeping track of our relationships to any traffic there may be.
Attached Thumbnails
Click image for larger version

Name:	Fog.jpg
Views:	35
Size:	106.2 KB
ID:	48135  
Marin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2016, 08:02 PM   #28
Guru
 
BandB's Avatar
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 13,171
Quote:
Originally Posted by markpierce View Post
You crazy guy!! Parents back then, at least mine, weren't so concerned about an individual child's safety as they had several children to replace those possibly lost. Or perhaps my father was optimistic/fatalistic after surviving being shot out of the sky.
Yes, unfortunately, hearing him say that reminds us of the kids who ran off of Florida one afternoon not long ago never to be heard from again.
BandB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2016, 08:04 PM   #29
Guru
 
O C Diver's Avatar
 
City: Fort Myers, FL... Summers in Crisfield, MD
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Slow Hand
Vessel Model: Cherubini Independence 45
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 4,818
Started going off shore in '78 on dive charter boats as crew, later as second captain. Navigation consisted of a 2 line Northstar Loran the size of a small suitcase, Noaa charts, parallel rules and a pair of dividers. Got my first charter boat in '85. Center console with Loran, charts, parallel rules and divider. 30 years and 2,500 plus days at sea later, no more lorans, dividers, and paper charts. 2 or 3 independent electronic devices is enough for me. Might be different if I was cruising the outer reaches of Alaska, but I'm not.

Ted
__________________
Blog: mvslowhand.com
I'm tired of fast moves, I've got a slow groove, on my mind.....
I want to spend some time, Not come and go in a heated rush.....
"Slow Hand" by The Pointer Sisters
O C Diver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-14-2016, 08:35 PM   #30
Guru
 
BandB's Avatar
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 13,171
Quote:
Originally Posted by dkasprzak View Post
Learning to plot a course and run it by compass and watch for me is one of the most enjoyable aspects of boating. One of the posters mentioned "Running Ahead of the Boat" and that is exactly what you do when you have pre-plotted your course. You are aware of what visual you are looking for next, approximately how long will it take you to get to it and you get a feel for when something may be wrong with your course when it does not appear as expected.

Along with the electronics mentioned above on the Hatteras, I carry an iPad with iSailor app and two iPhones with the same app. But I still sit and plot the course before leaving, contemplating the trip trying to anticipate how it will go etc. I don't always file a proper float plan with someone but I do ALWAYS let someone I know I can depend on know the high level plan.

I still have a couple of old charts of my home waters that have been retired with much plotting on them. Its fun to look them over and remember those trips and the good, bad and frightening things that happened during them.
We do maintain float plans.

We love to plan ahead, always thinking of options, thinking of what-if's. Right now we're talking St. Maarten and just looked at our path there from the BVI. We're no where close yet but just doing the thinking excites us. Planning is such a joy. We've planned in our minds years ahead. Just this week we were thinking of how we'd spend 3 months in Europe if we had that. Well 3 in Schengen and 1 outside or so.

One difference between us and most of you is we never saw a chart before 2012 and we learned on plotters and with electronics and while doing so, sort of back learned paper charts, sailing by compass and the other techniques. We come from a background of depending on electronics but always having a backup plan. We print our own paper when we desire it so it's always fresh. We still keep data on prior trips.

It's interesting as we learned from experienced captains and they were shocked at how fast we picked up all the electronics. Well, that's the world we've lived in. As a former teacher, my wife was use to pencil and paper so felt natural to her to use paper charts. I hadn't used a pencil in years, only used a pen to sign my name. I never hand wrote notes in business. Honestly, my writing is horrible, but my printing is good. It was a new and different experience for me.

As to pre-plotting our course, we always do that, just electronically is our primary means.
BandB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-15-2016, 09:36 AM   #31
Guru
 
City: North Charleston, SC
Country: USA
Join Date: Sep 2010
Posts: 4,390
When did you first go out to sea?

Quote:
Originally Posted by gaston View Post
and how much navigation experience dose one need with today's electronics ?
That would have been about 1955, I would have been about twelve years old and it would have been my uncle's sailboat out of LA.

There were no "today's electronics", I imagine he had nothing more than a compass.

Operating my own boat? The closest I've come to "out to sea" is St. Andrews Sound on the AICW in Georgia. That would have been a few years ago.

As for navigation experience, it's best to start small and gain experience. There's no set amount of experience needed. And of course the only way to gain experience is by doing. I'm not suggesting just buying a boat and going out to gain experience, education is a great aid to make sure your experiences are mostly good ones.
rwidman is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-15-2016, 10:02 AM   #32
Art
Guru
 
Art's Avatar
 
City: SF Bay Area
Country: USA
Vessel Model: Tollycraft 34' Tri Cabin
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 7,981
Quote:
Originally Posted by WesK View Post
When did you first go out to sea?



That would have been about 1955, I would have been about twelve years old and it would have been my uncle's sailboat out of LA.

There were no "today's electronics", I imagine he had nothing more than a compass.

Operating my own boat? The closest I've come to "out to sea" is St. Andrews Sound on the AICW in Georgia. That would have been a few years ago.

As for navigation experience, it's best to start small and gain experience. There's no set amount of experience needed. And of course the only way to gain experience is by doing. I'm not suggesting just buying a boat and going out to gain experience, education is a great aid to make sure your experiences are mostly good ones.
Wes

Your sentence: "There's no set amount of experience needed." is so very true.

Each person navigating aboard boat has their own set of how-to's and what-if's they have gleaned by marine doings of one sort or another. With 2016's broad expanse of electronic navigational equipment available, if a person can read and have clear vision and a bit o' smarts then accurate navigation experiences should be quite attainable. That said; I still believe that every boater should become well in knowledge of compass headings, tidal/current conditions, wind conditions, boat speeds, time elapse, and how to chart-out a plan of action on paper charts. Redundancy is a good word. Back-up plans are great to have.
Art is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2016, 07:07 AM   #33
FF
Guru
 
FF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 16,531
"Back-up plans are great to have"

Especially when a fuse blows and it gets real dark.
FF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2016, 09:05 AM   #34
Guru
 
HiDHo's Avatar
 
City: Scottsboro, Al.
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Hi-D-Ho
Vessel Model: 1987 Krogen Manatee
Join Date: Feb 2012
Posts: 735
That would be June 1954 reported aboard my first ship USS Buckley DDR 808 stationed at New Port, RI, also just in time to expirience the full force of hurricane Hazel in October. Spent the next six months in the Boston Naval Shipyard having the damage to the destroyer repaired. Seventeen years old and my first taste of salt water and I new the Navy was for me. Even when we later took station in the North Atlantic on the Dew Line extension for a month at five knots in a 50 mile circle covered with ice this mid-west born kid had found I was just as comfortable at sea as I was on the prairies of Illinois.
HiDHo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2016, 09:46 AM   #35
Art
Guru
 
Art's Avatar
 
City: SF Bay Area
Country: USA
Vessel Model: Tollycraft 34' Tri Cabin
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 7,981
Quote:
Originally Posted by HiDHo View Post
That would be June 1954 reported aboard my first ship USS Buckley DDR 808 stationed at New Port, RI, also just in time to expirience the full force of hurricane Hazel in October. Spent the next six months in the Boston Naval Shipyard having the damage to the destroyer repaired. Seventeen years old and my first taste of salt water and I new the Navy was for me. Even when we later took station in the North Atlantic on the Dew Line extension for a month at five knots in a 50 mile circle covered with ice this mid-west born kid had found I was just as comfortable at sea as I was on the prairies of Illinois.
D - I love your story!

Some of people are simply attached to water and some are not. Ain't it great to be one that is!

Art
Art is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-16-2016, 11:24 AM   #36
Senior Member
 
Puffin_NT32's Avatar
 
City: Watch Hill RI
Vessel Name: Puffin
Vessel Model: Nordic Tug 32/34
Join Date: Jan 2008
Posts: 104
First time at sea... Winter 1950, as a 7-year old Army brat, taking the USS Bremerhaven from NY to Germany. Still can recall the vastness of the open ocean and the chaos of the North Sea.

As far as navigation skills, started sailing in a 17' Venture with many trips from Watch Hill to Block Island using compass, paper charts, and dead reckoning. With today's electronics (chart plotter, depth sounder, radar), it's makes for brain-dead navigation (a good thing and a bad thing). Use the electronics if you have them, but plan on them failing, usually at the worst time.
Puffin_NT32 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2016, 03:51 PM   #37
Senior Member
 
nemier's Avatar


 
City: North Vancouver
Country: Canada
Vessel Name: INFINITY ∞
Vessel Model: Nordhavn 62
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 190
First set out to Sea, big sea, in 1983. I was 18 years old.
Fast forward 33 years, I'm 51 now, and not much has changed.
I have all the 'old-school' stuff in my back pocket, but primarily use Nobletec & an iPad (with iSailor / Transas charts) as aback-up. I feel the need to move with the times
__________________
Andy & Julie Nemier
N62 INFINITY ∞
www.n62infinity.com
nemier is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2016, 04:10 PM   #38
Guru
 
BandB's Avatar
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 13,171
Wifey B: Ok, my first time to sea as in ocean was 2012. As a kid, no boats in my life. Only time was once I went with some church group to a lake and we were on a pontoon boat. It wasn't the boat though, but the place, the water, the escape. I didn't have a lot of good days as a kid and that was one I never forgot. It was worth all the trouble I got into over it when I got home as I didn't exactly have permission.

Fast forward to 2001, I've met the love of my life and go to visit and we get out on the water. Heck yeah, I was hooked and it was only starting. Three months later, on my 22nd birthday we got married and I was a boater forever. On the water was just where we both loved being. Maybe I just felt his love for it. I don't know. I just know it was so right and has always been a huge part of our life.
BandB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2016, 04:21 PM   #39
Guru
 
psneeld's Avatar
 
City: Avalon, NJ
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Freedom
Vessel Model: Albin 40
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 15,914
In the last 10,000 miles between Fl and NJ...I have never taken the ball cap off my compass that protects it from the sun.....

Kinda ridiculous I am protecting it from the sun....

2 years ago I even stopped plotting electronic courses.

Just not that big of a deal down the Atlantic seaboard/AICW, Chesapeake & Delaware Bays.

But everyone has their pleasures and comfort levels.
psneeld is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-17-2016, 05:00 PM   #40
Guru
 
BandB's Avatar
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 13,171
Quote:
Originally Posted by psneeld View Post
In the last 10,000 miles between Fl and NJ...I have never taken the ball cap off my compass that protects it from the sun.....
Wifey B: Shouldn't a ball cap be on your......

I mean it's not a compass cap.
__________________

BandB is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:13 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012