I think in today's dollars you're not going to hit the $500,000 for a 48'. However, something in the range of $700,000 is quite possible.
Whats wrong with Bayliners?
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I think in today's dollars you're not going to hit the $500,000 for a 48'. However, something in the range of $700,000 is quite possible.
sunchaser
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I would too, point me to that builder. The last Meridian 4788s in today's dollars were out the door for what, about $1M?
Two years ago I made a trip to the AT factory. Based upon what I saw there is no way significant dollars could be chopped from that build process. Their 45' or so build price today is pushing the upper $100K range. If any less quality the vessel would not sell.
For the 1% ers quality and aura sell - new. With but rare exception it has always been this way. Today even more so as the world economy has tightened up. Some buy a new OA 80+' yacht and a Riva with triples because they like quality and aura.
In the 60' range, the price for quality is not all that much more than a low cost build, at least if you compare a Searay to say an Eastbay or Coastal Craft.
On a new build don't forget to include dinghy, davit, instruments, genset, thrusters, stabilizers, AC, diesel heat, canvas, anchor and flag and you've added a whole lot of money - pushing $200K. Time for a very big pay raise.
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Nomad Willy
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Larry m man that boat is wonderful. Screw the side decks and the big money talk. She's great just like that. I'd want to see her w a slightly turned up bottom aft so she really is a SD and not some planing hull w the SD label. You made her perfect. Tell the naysayers to go design their own boat. Yours is perfect!
sunchaser
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What is the matter with Al, lots of great boats built this way.
OK, in the fast poke 50 range lets just add:
- Prestige
- Endurance
- Horizon PC 52
- Outer Reef Trident
- Sabre (with a fly bridge)
- Offshore
- Dyna
- Norstar
- Nordhavn CP
- Explorer
- Princess
- Marlow
- Marquis
- Riviera
- ETC
For those wanting this Bayliner style, do exactly what Kevin did, buy a nice one and repower/refit and all in you'd have your $500 to 700K vessel! Dozens of them are for sale in the PNW and making brokers like PK very happy.
Robster_in_edmonds
Senior Member
I like the way this thread has (slightly) drifted. We were fortunate to find our boat in a distress-sale situation from a wealthy seller going through a divorce. Our 4788 had had four prior owners and there was a fair amount of repair work needed. Half was fixing things that were broken (bad alternator, failed oil sender unit, that kind of thing) and the other half was correcting incorrect installations of new electronics (GPS not connected to new VHF so DSC did not work, nav light removed and not reinstalled, silly stuff). We added rear cockpit canvas, diesel heat and removed the bowsprit to reduce LOA to 50 feet. Replaced all batteries and changed all fluids.
All-in, with hired out work for what I don't know how to do, we are still under two hundred grand for a wonderful yacht. I just checked yachtworld and there are about forty 4788s for sale all around the country. About half are under two hundred grand, most in decent shape. Many with under 1500 hours on Cummins diesels.
One of my trusted mechanics is a former Bayliner shop worker/foreman and he told me Bayliner had their own custom wiring looms for each boat while other companies sourced that work out to small shops. Bays have wiring runs that can hard to work on (my biggest pet peeve is the 12-volt wiring with runs for neutral and hot to different places and thus hard to convert to LED with dimming) but they benefit from not using custom connectors made by shops that are now out of business.
I have crawled all around my boat and have assisted others with work on their boats and I think it is safe to say that all boats have issues, since all boats are compromises, and the 4788 is no better or worse than any other production boats out there. We run at nine knots about 90% of the time, so I feel like a trawler owner. ?
All-in, with hired out work for what I don't know how to do, we are still under two hundred grand for a wonderful yacht. I just checked yachtworld and there are about forty 4788s for sale all around the country. About half are under two hundred grand, most in decent shape. Many with under 1500 hours on Cummins diesels.
One of my trusted mechanics is a former Bayliner shop worker/foreman and he told me Bayliner had their own custom wiring looms for each boat while other companies sourced that work out to small shops. Bays have wiring runs that can hard to work on (my biggest pet peeve is the 12-volt wiring with runs for neutral and hot to different places and thus hard to convert to LED with dimming) but they benefit from not using custom connectors made by shops that are now out of business.
I have crawled all around my boat and have assisted others with work on their boats and I think it is safe to say that all boats have issues, since all boats are compromises, and the 4788 is no better or worse than any other production boats out there. We run at nine knots about 90% of the time, so I feel like a trawler owner. ?
ksanders
Moderator Emeritus
Sunchaser and Band B you have defined the root of the problem for new boat buyers and manufacturers alike.
New 48' boats are for the most part out of the price range of salary earning professionals.
What is different now than when Bayliner was profitable making for example its 4788 model?
Persoanlly I think it is that the price of a new build rose faster than salaries during the last fifteen years for one. I think another factor is that there is a large number of pre-owned boats that are attracting potential buyers.
New 48' boats are for the most part out of the price range of salary earning professionals.
What is different now than when Bayliner was profitable making for example its 4788 model?
Persoanlly I think it is that the price of a new build rose faster than salaries during the last fifteen years for one. I think another factor is that there is a large number of pre-owned boats that are attracting potential buyers.
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pilothouse king
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You guys discussing who should make what and at what price points are decades behind the curve as us in the boat biz hashed this to death a long time ago. Tens of thousands of boat dealerships and Yacht Brokerages went out of business seemingly non stop since I entered it in 1974.
THE number one issue has been "How do you sell boats to people if there's nowhere to keep them?" This really hit home in the 2000s with the real estate boom, when developers started buying up all the waterfront they could get their hands on ALL across the US with the idea of building condos and selling the slips. They did a pretty good job of ripping out the docks and pilings before they went bust in the 'great recession' leaving unfinished projects in their wakes. Displaced all the boats. Those
marinas left in business raised their rates in the normal supply and demand. Raised them to levels not acceptable to 99% of boat owners-who called up the brokers left in business to sell them. A good 90% of my sales came from outside the United States, and those boats are gone forever.
Every location in Miami where I had my offices are either flat gone, or are now condos with rates literally ten times what I used to pay.
I've had quotes of $1800.00 a month to dock a Bayliner 4788 down there and they wanted proof of insurance($$$), which is just one reason I recently moved north of Ft . Pierce where dockage is still available, and not yet insanely priced. Not yet. .
LONG time ago we realized that if one must own waterfront property to even have a place to dock a big boat, then said owners of both will soon realize they don't need a big yacht and a house, so they sell the big boats and buy center console outboard powered boats that go fast which allows
them to run to the Bahamas or the Keys and come home the same day. That market has skyrocketed.
If that All Aboard Florida scheme comes to fruition, then Ft. Lauderdale, Jupiter, Stuart, and all marine businesses west of the tracks and along the Cross Florida route will also effectively be killed off, as you can't dock or repair a boat if the boats are blocked from your home or business. Then the rates of the marinas oceanside of the tracks will skyrocked in the same supply and demand scenario that occured in Miami.
Many of my friends owned those now extinct dealerships, and trust me-they would had loved to stay in business. IF dealerships can't stay in business, the manufacturers of the boats they sold can't stay in business!! So now they're all gone too. Many you think are still in business -aren't. Nothing but websites.
The only reason I've survived is the advent of the Internet, International sales , keeping a low overhead , always owning my property free and clear, carrying zero debt.
Driving around the US I can point out exactly where there used to be boat builders ,marinas, dealerships and Brokerages in the exact way I can point out what Indian tribes once lived where.
You South Florida boaters (and home owners) need to crush All Aboard Florida before it crushes you! Those bridges only have a 4' clearance closed, and they plan to kep them closed in daylight hours!
THE number one issue has been "How do you sell boats to people if there's nowhere to keep them?" This really hit home in the 2000s with the real estate boom, when developers started buying up all the waterfront they could get their hands on ALL across the US with the idea of building condos and selling the slips. They did a pretty good job of ripping out the docks and pilings before they went bust in the 'great recession' leaving unfinished projects in their wakes. Displaced all the boats. Those
marinas left in business raised their rates in the normal supply and demand. Raised them to levels not acceptable to 99% of boat owners-who called up the brokers left in business to sell them. A good 90% of my sales came from outside the United States, and those boats are gone forever.
Every location in Miami where I had my offices are either flat gone, or are now condos with rates literally ten times what I used to pay.
I've had quotes of $1800.00 a month to dock a Bayliner 4788 down there and they wanted proof of insurance($$$), which is just one reason I recently moved north of Ft . Pierce where dockage is still available, and not yet insanely priced. Not yet. .
LONG time ago we realized that if one must own waterfront property to even have a place to dock a big boat, then said owners of both will soon realize they don't need a big yacht and a house, so they sell the big boats and buy center console outboard powered boats that go fast which allows
them to run to the Bahamas or the Keys and come home the same day. That market has skyrocketed.
If that All Aboard Florida scheme comes to fruition, then Ft. Lauderdale, Jupiter, Stuart, and all marine businesses west of the tracks and along the Cross Florida route will also effectively be killed off, as you can't dock or repair a boat if the boats are blocked from your home or business. Then the rates of the marinas oceanside of the tracks will skyrocked in the same supply and demand scenario that occured in Miami.
Many of my friends owned those now extinct dealerships, and trust me-they would had loved to stay in business. IF dealerships can't stay in business, the manufacturers of the boats they sold can't stay in business!! So now they're all gone too. Many you think are still in business -aren't. Nothing but websites.
The only reason I've survived is the advent of the Internet, International sales , keeping a low overhead , always owning my property free and clear, carrying zero debt.
Driving around the US I can point out exactly where there used to be boat builders ,marinas, dealerships and Brokerages in the exact way I can point out what Indian tribes once lived where.
You South Florida boaters (and home owners) need to crush All Aboard Florida before it crushes you! Those bridges only have a 4' clearance closed, and they plan to kep them closed in daylight hours!
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Codger2
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Well, what can I say? I've been gone for over a year (but lurking) and have missed answering posts such as this one, from Larry.
Larry: You should have been a yacht designer! Your redo of the big Bayliner (one of my favorites) is terrific! I really enjoy your posts.
healhustler
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SEAHORSE! Geeze, where have you been? Welcome home!
I tend to get overwhelmed with adding all the stuff I'd like on a re-do. Yep, like Sunchaser, the covered decks and like Eric, the genuine FD hull with a sumptuous buttock line, but I wanted to stay focused on what I thought Bayliner "might" do. Given that the greater number of Trawler style boats being sold were semi-displacement and they already had a darned good line of proven SD hulls, you know they're not going to build a new hull. Install a single with a full keel and skeg? Probably not. The whole re-do is what I thought Bayliner might invest in. The red outline on the version below is the standard 4788 profile. The interior space, weight distribution, etc. are still very close to the original. BTW,...it's pretty easy plopping down a Photoshopped re-do of a production boat, but none of this dreaming includes plumbing, wire chases, and zillions of subtle issues that come up for the Architect. When I consider the interior, it makes me appreciate the work they do infinitely more.
Yep, I think this dream is going to be up to guys like Keven, Dave, Robster, or maybe even PK to make happen.
I tend to get overwhelmed with adding all the stuff I'd like on a re-do. Yep, like Sunchaser, the covered decks and like Eric, the genuine FD hull with a sumptuous buttock line, but I wanted to stay focused on what I thought Bayliner "might" do. Given that the greater number of Trawler style boats being sold were semi-displacement and they already had a darned good line of proven SD hulls, you know they're not going to build a new hull. Install a single with a full keel and skeg? Probably not. The whole re-do is what I thought Bayliner might invest in. The red outline on the version below is the standard 4788 profile. The interior space, weight distribution, etc. are still very close to the original. BTW,...it's pretty easy plopping down a Photoshopped re-do of a production boat, but none of this dreaming includes plumbing, wire chases, and zillions of subtle issues that come up for the Architect. When I consider the interior, it makes me appreciate the work they do infinitely more.
Yep, I think this dream is going to be up to guys like Keven, Dave, Robster, or maybe even PK to make happen.
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sunchaser
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PK
People make choices. For those of us who choose not to live in FL and deal with those "issues" (and more) there are other reasons than dock space that boat designs come and go. Easy money is a biggie. Just the same as the housing market has taken a dive due to overbuilding and loans getting tighter, so has the boating business.
The fact you are a boat broker gives you certain insights, but there is a bigger picture at play here. And it is, how does one generate sufficient disposable income to buy toys that fit our tastes? Look at how many people today lift the hoods of their cars or even wash them in their own driveway?
Of fix a toilet or pull weeds? In a non hands on and service oriented society boats are just not only expensive but too much work for those who do not grow up as tinkerers.
Boating and enjoying a 35 to 60 footer requires some real hands on work and getting one's fingernails dirty. That group is shrinking quickly, getting old and dying off. Look no further than all these marvelous vessels for sale that don't even crack 50 hours per year.
So wish all you want for a return to the good old days, there are not enough good old retired rich boys around to buy bigger toy boats. Look no further, for the future, than Cutwater and the smaller NTs, ATs and "Aluminum Craft" with lower op costs and lots of dock space available. And strong new and used sales for the few well heeled that can afford a Nordhavn or Dashew.
Yes things are different, but it is called demographics.
People make choices. For those of us who choose not to live in FL and deal with those "issues" (and more) there are other reasons than dock space that boat designs come and go. Easy money is a biggie. Just the same as the housing market has taken a dive due to overbuilding and loans getting tighter, so has the boating business.
The fact you are a boat broker gives you certain insights, but there is a bigger picture at play here. And it is, how does one generate sufficient disposable income to buy toys that fit our tastes? Look at how many people today lift the hoods of their cars or even wash them in their own driveway?
Of fix a toilet or pull weeds? In a non hands on and service oriented society boats are just not only expensive but too much work for those who do not grow up as tinkerers.
Boating and enjoying a 35 to 60 footer requires some real hands on work and getting one's fingernails dirty. That group is shrinking quickly, getting old and dying off. Look no further than all these marvelous vessels for sale that don't even crack 50 hours per year.
So wish all you want for a return to the good old days, there are not enough good old retired rich boys around to buy bigger toy boats. Look no further, for the future, than Cutwater and the smaller NTs, ATs and "Aluminum Craft" with lower op costs and lots of dock space available. And strong new and used sales for the few well heeled that can afford a Nordhavn or Dashew.
Yes things are different, but it is called demographics.
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Nomad Willy
Guru
But Tom,
There's lots of 30' slips available in LaConner but nothing bigger.
There's lots of 30' slips available in LaConner but nothing bigger.
sunchaser
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A 30' slip is just perfect for a Cutwater, but why slip it when you can dry storage it? Look at all the vessels on the hard in Anacortes, big ones too. A few months ago we checked in Anacortes, several 50' slips available at that time.
R Cook has a great trailer boat that does AK just fine for him. Point being, the market moves to where those who love the water and cruising lifestyle can always find a way.
Nomad Willy
Guru
Yes Tom that's exactly why there's 30' slips available. Thought about that after I posted ..... should'a came back and fixed the post .. my bad
Well the market better not move up to higher prices yet .... Or I'll be out'a here!
Well the market better not move up to higher prices yet .... Or I'll be out'a here!
Skinny
Senior Member
I would like to meet one of these "professionals" who make 2 to 3 large a year and are buying these boats brand new. Something tells me that they more than likely are living in too large a home and drive brand new cars as well. I'd like to see a monthly checking statement because I highly doubt someone making this level of coin knows better than to buy something brand new that depreciates immediately on top of making mortgage and car payments.
Linda and I returned from relaxing days aboard our Tolly. This eve I read pages to catch up on this thread. We don’t go to our boat to play computer… We go to play boat!
Wow – Lots of in-depth input here since I last visited. I like this thread. And, yes it has shifted off original topic, but, said drift has basically followed the course it should at this stage of the residential marine marketing game (concerning 32’ to 65’ pleasure boats, that is).
I’m not going to add my feelings/conjectures regarding the how or why so many sectors of the pleasure boating market are in trouble or decline. Many fine posts have covered much already.
I am going to ask:
What do your think it would do for a manufacturer’s cost structure (i.e. the actual retail-dealer-price that could be offered to purchasers) if boat hull could be manufactured at up to one-half cost, with super strength and durability, a same or lighter weight than others; and, up to three times as quick start to finish?
I am an entrepreneur, designer, inventor. I have a procedure I believe can attain what I mention above.
That said: Just because the hull cost and processing speed could be significantly improved I’m not sure that factor would be enough to make New Boats affordable to the average professional person.
IMO, substantially improved levels of retail affordability to the general public is the only portion of this boat marketing game that could blow-life back into New Boat sales.
Looking forward to input from boat building professionals.
PS: This would be proprietary manufacturing process with trade secret materials. In addition to hull there are other boat portions that could be fabricated using same procedure.
Happy Pleasure-Marine-Saving Daze! - Art
Wow – Lots of in-depth input here since I last visited. I like this thread. And, yes it has shifted off original topic, but, said drift has basically followed the course it should at this stage of the residential marine marketing game (concerning 32’ to 65’ pleasure boats, that is).
I’m not going to add my feelings/conjectures regarding the how or why so many sectors of the pleasure boating market are in trouble or decline. Many fine posts have covered much already.
I am going to ask:
What do your think it would do for a manufacturer’s cost structure (i.e. the actual retail-dealer-price that could be offered to purchasers) if boat hull could be manufactured at up to one-half cost, with super strength and durability, a same or lighter weight than others; and, up to three times as quick start to finish?
I am an entrepreneur, designer, inventor. I have a procedure I believe can attain what I mention above.
That said: Just because the hull cost and processing speed could be significantly improved I’m not sure that factor would be enough to make New Boats affordable to the average professional person.
IMO, substantially improved levels of retail affordability to the general public is the only portion of this boat marketing game that could blow-life back into New Boat sales.
Looking forward to input from boat building professionals.
PS: This would be proprietary manufacturing process with trade secret materials. In addition to hull there are other boat portions that could be fabricated using same procedure.
Happy Pleasure-Marine-Saving Daze! - Art
ksanders
Moderator Emeritus
Someone is or actually was buying them. Lots of Bayliner 4788's out there.
You have to think of the demographics to rationalize a boat buyer with a $500K budget. Remember most large boats are financed.
My guess is...
Probably early to mid 50's in age.
Probably either no mortgage or a old mortgage close to being paid off and representing the price of homes 20 years ago.
Probably empty nester
Probably never had to start over due to divorce.
By the time someones in their 50's their probably at the director of VP level at their work. At the top of their game career wise. This is their time of life for disposable income.
Probably not a tinkerer any more due to career choices and moving up the ladder, so buying a new boat with no problems sounds appealing.
All this makes for the perfect, in my opinion $500,000 new boat buyer.
10-20% down, payments over 15 years on a new boat loan. Yes the cost is high, but its the time of life they can afford it.
Yep, if I were making $500K boats that's the guy I'd be targeting with my advertising.
I'd appeal to his sense of "if not now when?" and "you've earned it".
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pilothouse king
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I've had exactly two (2) deals that had financing in the past ten years and I don't sell boats under $100k. 100% of the exported boats were cash, and many were bought sight unseen (buyers didn't bother to personally come see them before they bought, and that includes Americans only a short plane ride away) in the $160k-$800k range.
In my experience there's no shortage of, wealth out there-worldwide. Money isn't the issue. Where to keep the "stuff" (art, cars, horses, planes, boats) remains the issue.
In my experience there's no shortage of, wealth out there-worldwide. Money isn't the issue. Where to keep the "stuff" (art, cars, horses, planes, boats) remains the issue.
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Skinny
Senior Member
This is what I was picturing and not a dude with a fresh family making a quarter a year paying off his sporty SUV in his culdesac home.Someone is or actually was buying them. Lots of Bayliner 4788's out there.
You have to think of the demographics to rationalize a boat buyer with a $500K budget. Remember most large boats are financed.
My guess is...
Probably early to mid 50's in age.
Probably either no mortgage or a old mortgage close to being paid off and representing the price of homes 20 years ago.
Probably empty nester
Probably never had to start over due to divorce.
By the time someones in their 50's their probably at the director of VP level at their work. At the top of their game career wise. This is their time of life for disposable income.
Probably not a tinkerer any more due to career choices and moving up the ladder, so buying a new boat with no problems sounds appealing.
All this makes for the perfect, in my opinion $500,000 new boat buyer.
10-20% down, payments over 15 years on a new boat loan. Yes the cost is high, but its the time of life they can afford it.
Yep, if I were making $500K boats that's the guy I'd be targeting with my advertising.
Nomad Willy
Guru
Art,
I don't know but I'm afraid the hull is only a small part of the build.
Would the new material be moulded like FG or made w panels put together?
I don't know but I'm afraid the hull is only a small part of the build.
Would the new material be moulded like FG or made w panels put together?
Richard W
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I would venture to guess ... hull/deck structure 30%, installations and rigging 25%, interior and finish 25%, powertrain 20%. The hull/deck structure could be more than 30% ... not only the heft and quality of materials and the methodology used can vary a lot but the hull/deck production cost goes up proportionally to the boat's LOA (volume).
All other components are "standard" marine stuff not dependent as much, if at all, on the boat's size variations within the same class.
All other components are "standard" marine stuff not dependent as much, if at all, on the boat's size variations within the same class.
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BruceK
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I`m thinking some wealthy people go and order exactly what they think they want/need, understanding but not caring about the depreciation.("Dropped 300K on that boat, so what, I can afford it, I`m rich")
At the same time, smarter well off people are cherry picking the resales and doing very nicely.
At the same time, smarter well off people are cherry picking the resales and doing very nicely.
Hi Eric, thanks for response.
I figure deck and some superstructure portions could also be manufactured in same basic procedure/material. Hull could come out in one solid piece. Many portions manufactured in same way/material could be one piece.
Thanks, Richard Be interesting to learn if those %ages are average. I have no clue of new boat building % cost in 2015.
CPseudonym
Moderator Emeritus
My brother is in Kevin's demographic. Annual income jives with an almost empty nest, we discussed boat ownership at Christmas. He figures why buy when he can charter much cheaper. They chartered a 70'er for a week the last two summers and enjoyed it, cruised the islands without the burden of running or maintaining the boat. They are discussing chartering a boat in the Med next.
The bulk of the rest of his recreation time is filled with driving his '66 Mustang to the golf course.
The bulk of the rest of his recreation time is filled with driving his '66 Mustang to the golf course.
ksanders
Moderator Emeritus
Yes, you are entirely correct!
Young people have significantly more cash outlay than older people in general.
I call it the acquisition phase of life.
Older people generally have more disposable income, partly because they are making more, and partly because they already have "stuff", where young people are still buying "stuff"
Jim Gandee
Veteran Member
Two years ago I purchased a 1989 Bayliner 3888. I have done most of the maintenance and have crawled around just about every inch of the boat. My assessment is as follows:
- The boat seems fairly well made and I am confident it will handle rougher seas than I wish to tackle.
- The fit and finish is middle of the road and indicative of a mass produced vessel. Examples are some of the interior teak mouldings don't align just perfectly or the angles don't match exactly.
- The drain in the bow anchor locker is not in the low corner so the water never completely drains.
- The routing of some hoses and drain lines are just stuffed through access areas without regard to chafing. Same with some wiring.
- The boat has economically provided my family with many hours of cruising enjoyment.
- I equate my Bayliner with Chevrolet. It's the working mans boat. It's nice and does what you need it to do. It's not a Hatteras but it doesn't have the Hat price tag.
- The interior layout and use of space is darn tough to beat!
- The boat is very comfortable and has classic lines.
It's been a very good boat. It's a coastal cruiser. It's not meant to cross expansive oceans. Used within it's designed parameters it's extremely capable.
- The boat seems fairly well made and I am confident it will handle rougher seas than I wish to tackle.
- The fit and finish is middle of the road and indicative of a mass produced vessel. Examples are some of the interior teak mouldings don't align just perfectly or the angles don't match exactly.
- The drain in the bow anchor locker is not in the low corner so the water never completely drains.
- The routing of some hoses and drain lines are just stuffed through access areas without regard to chafing. Same with some wiring.
- The boat has economically provided my family with many hours of cruising enjoyment.
- I equate my Bayliner with Chevrolet. It's the working mans boat. It's nice and does what you need it to do. It's not a Hatteras but it doesn't have the Hat price tag.
- The interior layout and use of space is darn tough to beat!
- The boat is very comfortable and has classic lines.
It's been a very good boat. It's a coastal cruiser. It's not meant to cross expansive oceans. Used within it's designed parameters it's extremely capable.
This isn't aimed at just you but your post is an example so I'll use it. There's a common thread that some of us who choose to go a different route that you or others are not as smart or have an attitude that says, "so what, I'm rich." Just because our choices aren't yours or because you disagree with our choices doesn't make them dumb choices nor does it make us people who don't care about how they spend their money.
Yes, we buy new. We buy new cars and maintain them well and keep them longer than the average car buyer. We buy new boats but we use ours very heavily and put on an exceptionally large number of hours. We also keep our boats for years.
Skinny made similar statements implying "our" home was too large and somehow it was wrong to drive new cars then wanting to see checking statements because of doubt that someone knows better than to buy new on top of mortgage and car payments.
We don't discuss what we spend on boats not do we choose to criticize the choices of any of you. We're also not the only ones here who buy new and know some here who have saved and planned and finally purchased new and then somehow it seems there's a mood they should apologize for it.
If you believe buying new to be wrong for you or generally a poor financial decision that's fine. But snide or demeaning remarks about those who do isn't necessary or appropriate.
Donsan
Guru
- Joined
- Jul 6, 2014
- Messages
- 2,300
- Location
- United States
- Vessel Name
- No Mo Trawla
- Vessel Make
- Hurricane SS188
Someone is or actually was buying them. Lots of Bayliner 4788's out there.
You have to think of the demographics to rationalize a boat buyer with a $500K budget. Remember most large boats are financed.
My guess is...
Probably early to mid 50's in age.
Probably either no mortgage or a old mortgage close to being paid off and representing the price of homes 20 years ago.
Probably empty nester
Probably never had to start over due to divorce.
By the time someones in their 50's their probably at the director of VP level at their work. At the top of their game career wise. This is their time of life for disposable income.
Probably not a tinkerer any more due to career choices and moving up the ladder, so buying a new boat with no problems sounds appealing.
All this makes for the perfect, in my opinion $500,000 new boat buyer.
10-20% down, payments over 15 years on a new boat loan. Yes the cost is high, but its the time of life they can afford it.
Yep, if I were making $500K boats that's the guy I'd be targeting with my advertising.
Wall Street banker types spending their year end bonuses.
FF
Guru
- Joined
- Oct 12, 2007
- Messages
- 22,552
>all other components are "standard" marine stuff.<
That covers a lot of ground , a maceriator could be a Galley Maid or Obendorfer ay a grand a pop, or Jabsco for $100.
Big difference in living with and servicing the different tho >standard < mechanicals.
That covers a lot of ground , a maceriator could be a Galley Maid or Obendorfer ay a grand a pop, or Jabsco for $100.
Big difference in living with and servicing the different tho >standard < mechanicals.
