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Old 10-17-2016, 08:02 AM   #21
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only nitrile seals !
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Old 10-17-2016, 08:17 AM   #22
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only nitrile seals !
Or Viton.

If in doubt, soak the seal in a little diesel fuel overnight.
If the seal swells do not use.
If it keeps it's original size it is ok to use.
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Old 10-17-2016, 09:02 AM   #23
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I was not referring to seals (are you referring to valve components?). I assume these fittings are threaded and should be installed with Permatex #2 or similar on the threads of all components. Also, if multiple components are going into the new assembly, it also helps to tighten all couplings fully before doing the final insertion into the tank threaded port. Lastly, any drain valve like this must be closed with a threaded plug when not in use, and even wired closed.
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Old 10-17-2016, 04:37 PM   #24
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Thanks to everyone who has thrown their 20 cents worth in - really helpful - esp re thread sealer - will the white plumbers tape do the job with diesel or should I use something like Stag.

I will now back the plug out enough to check the thread, use a gate valve (because of the space) with an elbow on the discharge side with a hose tail. when I have finished draining I shall remove the elbow/hosetail and insert a threaded plug. Valve in Stainless or brass
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Old 10-17-2016, 04:49 PM   #25
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It is generally recommended to not use plumber's tape (teflon) or even the diesel yellow stuff for fuel related plumbing. Preferably only use a thread sealant such as Permatex that is specifically rated for diesel.
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Old 10-17-2016, 06:15 PM   #26
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I'll plug for the ball valves. There are some that have mini handles that are very good valves. I've often used those for tight areas. Consider handle removal for installation and then re install the handle after the valve is in place, done that too. Even shorten the handle might help.

I still have two gates aboard my boat and I hate them. I would either have to cut them off or jack up the water tanks to remove them or they would be gone.

If you are installing a brass valve into an aluminum tank then use a steel or SS fitting. I have no quarrel with brass directly into aluminum except if they are in contact with water which is your application as a drain. Use an isolator fitting.

Permatex 2 or Rectorseal 5 both will work with diesel.
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Old 10-17-2016, 06:25 PM   #27
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My ball valve seacocks have lock collars. Check page 67 of the Whitworths "Cattledog". You might have to remove the handle to screw the valve in, and refit it
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Old 10-17-2016, 06:29 PM   #28
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My ball valve seacocks have lock collars. Check page 67 of the Whitworths "Cattledog". You might have to remove the handle to screw the valve in, and refit it

I tried but got a warning " this site may be hacked" so backed out.
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Old 10-17-2016, 06:54 PM   #29
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I tried but got a warning " this site may be hacked" so backed out.
Worrying. I just tried it, no warnings, info says it was a secure site. I run an internet security package.
Whitworths is a 16 store Australia wide chandlery,I guess it might have credit card numbers from purchases somewhere. To check, I phoned my friend, the Manager of Drummoyne branch in Sydney, he is unaware of any threat, says it`s a secure site. I suggested he call head office anyway.
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Old 10-17-2016, 07:47 PM   #30
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If a ball valve won't fit, maybe a 90deg "street elbow" will get you aimed the right way and get you clearance. A ball valve is better as the straight shot through means it is less likely to get clogged. Brass is fine for fuel. And cap or plug outlet so it cannot inadvertently be opened and drain the tank.
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Old 10-18-2016, 07:18 AM   #31
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You must ensure the valve (and whatever else you install) has protection against being stepped on, dropped on or otherwise smacked. Because a cracked nipple, elbo or fitting can allow an unintended fuel spill. It's bad enough with the spill. But even worse if you were out in heavy weather and something fell on it and you lost the fuel underway.
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Old 10-18-2016, 08:05 AM   #32
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After all the discussion an advice, I guess my question is "why bother??" Have you had such bad experiences with your fuel quality? My experience was that after several thousand gallons, I drained my tanks to do some plumbing and no water or crud came out. Perhaps you could do as I did; I simply let both my tanks empty to below half volume, then pumped from one tank to the other to drained that tank, then reversed the process to drain the other tank.
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Old 10-18-2016, 08:44 AM   #33
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Or, you might want to consider going one step further, and convert those two nice low drains into being your fuel supply lines, link them so they always self level, and then as long as you keep an eye on the filters, no crud or water can ever build up in the tanks, because it's the bottom they drain from, so sort of fuel polishing continuously. Mine are set up like that, and it works well. Not for nothing Nordhavn use this approach.

That would obviate any slight leak risk and make a gate valve probably ok. I have never liked the system of fuel pick up tubes, which always end well above the bottom, so crud can build up, just to be nicely stirred up by a seaway in time to block your filters at a time you least want them to be. Just a thought..?
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Old 10-18-2016, 10:46 AM   #34
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Peter that does turn your fuel system into a fuel polishing system.

I use a small pump (oil changing), some fuel hoses and a 1/8" copper tube to pump up fuel occasionally off the bottom of the tanks. Copper tube so I can bend it so it can be snaked down to the lowest parts of the tank. I remove the water and bits of crud that way and thus inspect the tank and fuel. I try to do this every several months. I get more "crud" than water.

I've had to do this because the fuel tanks wer'nt built to my specifications. However I like the peace of mind the pumping gives me.
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Old 10-18-2016, 06:29 PM   #35
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Or, you might want to consider going one step further, and convert those two nice low drains into being your fuel supply lines, link them so they always self level, and then as long as you keep an eye on the filters, no crud or water can ever build up in the tanks, because it's the bottom they drain from, so sort of fuel polishing continuously...
A couple of observations:
1. I`ve read on TF that Lehmans don`t draw and return as much excess fuel as some others, thus reducing the polishing effect.
2.Not picking up from the very bottom of the tank creates a kind of "quasi sump"(in place of the real one Nigel Calder recommends), ensuring crud and water are not picked up. The ability to drain combines crud drainage with pick up above the tank bottom where any remaining crud lives.
3.Cappy 208 raised the danger of stepping on the valve. The IG tank drain location makes that very unlikely. Interestingly, the fuel tanks on my IG are located aft of, NOT beside, the engines, the standard side water tanks occupy that position.
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Old 10-18-2016, 07:36 PM   #36
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Given that dirty fuel is the most likely show stopper for a diesel I wanted to ensure I always had clean fuel. I had to replace tanks, so went for a day tank set-up.

I have 4 tanks with deck fills, total capacity 4000 litres. The day tanks total 700 litres and can only be filled via the fuel polisher. I run the engines only from the day tanks, and keep them full when at the dock. Each engine supply is via a twin RACOR, so easy to switch over in the event of a blocked filter as well.

The 4 main tanks have engine supply pickups that are 1/2" or so off the bottom, but I don't use these anyway. The polisher pickup tubes however go down almost touching the tank bottom. The intent was the polisher will get any water/crud that is in the tanks.

I'm now at a bit over 17,000 litres consumed with this setup, and have never changed the filter on the fuel polisher, and its gauge is telling me it has very little crud in it. I have only used fuel purchased in USA, Canada or Australia. All obviously clean. The system was designed in case of the need to fuel from drums or suspect suppliers in remote locations/developing countries etc.

Should the polisher fail then engine supply/return can use any of the main tanks via the fuel manifold configuration. And there are also tank inter-connectors at the bottom, with ball valves, that could be used to drain a tank if needed, eg should some idiot put a water hose into the wrong deckfill. The system is working quite well.

First pic shows the interconnector or the aft tanks, which I normally leave open to self level. Then pic of the polisher and its supply/return manifold. Then engine supply and return pics.
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Old 10-18-2016, 11:37 PM   #37
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Brian, that set-up looks soooo beautiful compared to mine it almost makes me want to weep - but I won't...because my set-up is so cheep...
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Old 10-19-2016, 12:47 AM   #38
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Erm ! I think I mentioned PTFE (plumbers tape) in an earlier post.
Most of the fittings have a tapered thread, the more you tighten the more they seal.


Insequent, Beautifully set up, a real credit to you.


I'm afraid I'm in the same camp as Peter B, fuel sump drain, engine pre filter, simple and cheap as chips.
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Old 10-19-2016, 02:16 AM   #39
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Brian,what a stunning example of onboard technology. It would not look out of place in a laboratory.
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Old 10-19-2016, 02:25 AM   #40
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Thanks Peter, IR & Bruce. Credit is due to the Port Townsend Shipwright's Co-Operative team, lead by Todd Lee and Chris Brignoli in my case. I just paid the bills, although that was not an insignificant task in itself. The guys all did a fabulous job of a very comprehensive systems refit.

One day I might upgrade some of the cosmetic aspects of the boat, head decor comes to mind in particular. They are still pretty much "1980's chic". But livable after I removed 2 layers of wallpaper to reveal white lamipanel.
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