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Old 05-20-2019, 07:37 PM   #1
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What style should I buy?

Quick intro, I'm still young (55) but semi-retired. I have had my current 30 Rampage for 10 or 11 years. I fish it once in a while both offshore (Tuna) and inshore (Striped Bass, Fluke/Flounder, Bluefish...), but my wife and I enjoy cruising both long weekends at the usual Long Island area spots (Block Island, Newport, RI, Martha's Vineyard, Nantucket, east end of LI/Hamptons...), as well as 1 or 2 week long cruises around the same. More and more, I am doing more cruising and less fishing. So I've been searching for a new boat, more geared toward cruising, but it would be great if it could still be fished from time to time.

I've been eyeballing and looking for the last few years, and have yet to find what I really want or "should" get. I even have a hard time agreeing with myself on the style of boat to look for! Some of the stuff I've been looking at are 38' to 42' Downeast style cruisers such as Legacy, East Bay (GB), Mariner, Sabre, Backcove… all around the 200k price range. One stateroom is fine as it's just my wife and I, but a 2nd is not a showstopper. I prefer twins (safety and maneuverability) and a minimum of about 15 knots is probably in order as I don't have the patience for sailboats.

All the while, I have also had a "love" for trawlers and that has always been on the back of my mind. I've looked around at a few trawlers at the boat shows to get ideas, but I know little about the ins/outs of them.

So the recent thread about Pilot House/No Pilot house got me thinking, maybe instead of the down-easter style I really should be looking at a 40ish size trawler instead??? So with that little background, what are your recommendations? Trawler, Down-easter, Pilothouse, no pilothouse...??

What should I be looking at? What styles, what brands? ALL comments welcome, good bad and ugly!
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Old 05-20-2019, 08:36 PM   #2
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Welcome aboard TF
You have a big advantage over many coming here in that you have experienced both styles of boating.
I guess I'd start by listing your musts, wants & don't want for your ideal fishing boat.
Do the same for your ideal cruiser.
Now have your wife do the same... for both if she is Interested in both?
Then the hard part only you and her can do... prioritize based on your priorities re boating style/ use and how much of each you anticipate doing going forward.
The hard part... combine the lists and compromise to balance styles.
It seems like a fairly good chance you can find something that allows you to do both. It's a matter of which to try to optimize / improve vs willing to give a little to get a reasonable balance.
Dont forget to engage and isten to your other half... happy wife happ life especially true in boating.
I dont think even the experts here can make the above for you... but with the musts, wants & don't want they can provide some boats worth considering.
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Old 05-20-2019, 08:55 PM   #3
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Quick intro, I'm still young (55) but semi-retired. I have had my current 30 Rampage for 10 or 11 years. I fish it once in a while both offshore (Tuna) and inshore (Striped Bass, Fluke/Flounder, Bluefish...), but my wife and I enjoy cruising both long weekends at the usual Long Island area spots (Block Island, Newport, RI, Martha's Vineyard, Nantucket, east end of LI/Hamptons...), as well as 1 or 2 week long cruises around the same. More and more, I am doing more cruising and less fishing. So I've been searching for a new boat, more geared toward cruising, but it would be great if it could still be fished from time to time.

I've been eyeballing and looking for the last few years, and have yet to find what I really want or "should" get. I even have a hard time agreeing with myself on the style of boat to look for! Some of the stuff I've been looking at are 38' to 42' Downeast style cruisers such as Legacy, East Bay (GB), Mariner, Sabre, Backcove… all around the 200k price range. One stateroom is fine as it's just my wife and I, but a 2nd is not a showstopper. I prefer twins (safety and maneuverability) and a minimum of about 15 knots is probably in order as I don't have the patience for sailboats.

All the while, I have also had a "love" for trawlers and that has always been on the back of my mind. I've looked around at a few trawlers at the boat shows to get ideas, but I know little about the ins/outs of them.

So the recent thread about Pilot House/No Pilot house got me thinking, maybe instead of the down-easter style I really should be looking at a 40ish size trawler instead??? So with that little background, what are your recommendations? Trawler, Down-easter, Pilothouse, no pilothouse...??

What should I be looking at? What styles, what brands? ALL comments welcome, good bad and ugly!
Sounds like a sportfishing boat makes sense to me.
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Old 05-20-2019, 09:46 PM   #4
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We are on our 23rd boat at this point. We have had many different styles of boats but what works for us may not work for anyone else. Our requirements for the current boat were no tall ladders for us due to aging and our dog. We wanted 2 cabins and 2 heads in order to have the occasional guests aboard. We wanted a flybridge and an enclosed aft deck for some protected outdoor area for sitting. We ended up with a 41’ sundeck. It has 3 to 4 steps between levels which works for us. It has the 2 cabins and heads. It has an enclosed flybridge and sundeck. The sundeck will accommodate 4 chairs and a large cooler for sitting comfortably. We did not want a lower helm so we didn’t get one but we did add a permanent hardtop on the flybridge for inclement weather. The sundeck does make line handling a bit tougher on the stern but we added a stern thruster to help with that. It would be nice to have a cockpit but we were limited by the size and weight of boat that our local yard can haul. Ours pushes the travel lift close to it’s limit. I would recommend making a list of absolute must haves and also nice to haves and start looking at boats that fit your list. Good luck.
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Old 05-20-2019, 10:14 PM   #5
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I will offer why we went with our design, of which there are many manufacturers. I am not discrediting any other design - we like them all.

We chose a pilothouse as we are in a climate where we like protection from the elements. We also chose a design with the galley, salon, and aft deck on the main level/same deck. Most of our time during the day is in these spaces or outside, so we can see outside when cooking, eating indoors, or relaxing inside. We do go below for using the head, sleeping, and maintenance.

I recommend you get on and experience as many as possible...the field will narrow. I would also consider your exit strategy; you don’t want to be stuck with something (or take a bath) WHEN your mission or desires change. Finally, if I were coastal cruising I would want some speed capability. We like the Back Cove and similar boats.

Good Luck
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Old 05-20-2019, 10:32 PM   #6
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Must have's are really easy and short:
- 3.5 draft or less (Intercoastal LI [Great South Bay] is VERY shallow)
- Island bed
- "Dry head" (separate shower stall in head)
- Twins diesels
- Easy to access/both motors (I dig the Great Harbour N37 somebody posted in the Clostaphobic thread, except it's really slow at 7knots)
- Outdoor deck / cockpit to fit 3 or 4 chairs minimum (no enclosed cockpit or aft cabin style boat)
- Possible to fish it once in a while, but main purpose is to cruise.
- Easy bow access
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Old 05-21-2019, 07:39 AM   #7
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What Bacchus said about listing your individual must haves/want to haves/nice to haves... and then compare, negotiate, etc.

The fishing part suggests sportfish, convertible, maybe a cockpit motor yacht, maybe a trawler with decent cockpit area, or maybe a downeast boat ditto. Do you want a raised saloon with 360° visibility, or are you good with living in a cave? That might influence you choice of downeast versus all those others.

One of our must haves for the current boat was a real saloon (we got tired of the previous cave). Next was a flybridge. The third must have was "no ladder". That limited the search by quite a lot...

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Old 05-21-2019, 08:08 AM   #8
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Sounds like a semi-planning cockpit motor yacht style (with a sundeck as a bonus) checks all the boxes if you want a compromise between slow speed efficiency and the option of a faster cruise speed. This one has a cockpit for fishing among other things, two cabins/heads, relatively small twin diesels, spacious salon with huge windows all around. efficient Monk hull, upper and lower helm (which doesn't eat up space for a pilothouse), large sundeck with three steps to flybridge for maximum outside living. Draft is about 4 feet. No better design for maximizing space utilization. You're young, so a few short staircases and ladders wouldn't be an issue. We're in our 70s and manage just fine, even with an older dog and a bionic knee. I'd be careful about flat(ish) bottom boats.

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Old 05-21-2019, 09:10 AM   #9
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Sounds like a semi-planning cockpit motor yacht style (with a sundeck as a bonus) checks all the boxes if you want a compromise between slow speed efficiency and the option of a faster cruise speed. This one has a cockpit for fishing among other things, two cabins/heads, relatively small twin diesels, spacious salon with huge windows all around. efficient Monk hull, upper and lower helm (which doesn't eat up space for a pilothouse), large sundeck with three steps to flybridge for maximum outside living. Draft is about 4 feet. No better design for maximizing space utilization. You're young, so a few short staircases and ladders wouldn't be an issue. We're in our 70s and manage just fine, even with an older dog and a bionic knee. I'd be careful about flat(ish) bottom boats.

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You will be surprised how you can adapt (boat=compromise) if you thought there was one particular type that you wanted, but another type actually does all of that and more. Tri-cabin layouts usually provide two complete heads, while sedans only one. Steps instead of ladders. nice sundeck, functioning flybridge with easy access. All of your boxes checked!
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Old 05-21-2019, 11:28 AM   #10
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I struggled with the same questions when I was searching for a vessel at age 50, 5 years before retirement. I considered sportfishers, smaller fishing boats and sedan trawlers. I was swayed by the trawler's economy and tank sizes. I settled on efficient and slow 85hp twin Perkins but would have been just as satisfied with larger 200HP engines to provide a turn of speed now and then. In the end, I'm very pleased with small hp naturals and adequate tankage to provide for a week's anchoring for two or 2 weeks on the hook for one.

I catch sturgeon during the fall-spring months then switch to cruising the Delta during spring-fall months. My big 'needs' were full, safe walkarounds to allow me to fight a fish 360* around the boat's perimeter and enough room to fish and cruise comfortably. Last time out I landed my personal best in a 20 minute full-on tug-of-war with a fish that well exceeded 100", 325+# and over 50 years old while single handed....no net boy! (Since it was much larger than any NBA players, I named the fish "Shaquille".) The fight took me all the way around the boat's rails and demonstrated to me the value of safe walkarounds. I could never have landed that fish on a sportfisher or other vessel with narrow 6 inch ledges to reach the bow.
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Old 05-21-2019, 04:57 PM   #11
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You will be surprised how you can adapt (boat=compromise) if you thought there was one particular type that you wanted, but another type actually does all of that and more. Tri-cabin layouts usually provide two complete heads, while sedans only one. Steps instead of ladders. nice sundeck, functioning flybridge with easy access. All of your boxes checked!
Very true. I never thought I'd end up in the boat that I bought. BUT I did. And I love it. There is no perfect boat...
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Old 05-21-2019, 06:18 PM   #12
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Very true. I never thought I'd end up in the boat that I bought. BUT I did. And I love it. There is no perfect boat...
Maybe not but a Fleming 58 comes pretty close.
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Old 05-21-2019, 06:46 PM   #13
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Perhaps consider engaging a broker who can help you narrow the search criteria. We found this was a great wa to quickly determine what was going to be the best fit, after which it was just a matter of hunting down the right one. Good luck
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Old 05-23-2019, 09:54 PM   #14
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Thanks for the comments folks...… still searching! ;-)
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Old 05-23-2019, 11:13 PM   #15
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Some of the stuff I've been looking at are 38' to 42' Downeast style cruisers such as Legacy, East Bay (GB), Mariner, Sabre, Backcove… all around the 200k price range. !

In your boat budget don't forget to allow for upgrades like A/C & post-purchase outfitting. Circa 1990 I spent close to 70k outfitting my 35' cruising sailboat with electronics, inverter, generator, canvas, dinghies, anchors, chain, liferaft & other safety gear, spares, etc. (That figure included the cost of the new toilet plunger & bucket that would serve as my washing machine for the next few years.)


Most co$ts of proper outfitting are not recoverable when selling. Custom canvas (it's ALL custom) alone can easily run into tens of thousands of dollars. For that reason, consider a late model, already kitted out, of one the boats you like. You'll still need to add gear that suits your boating style, but likely not as much as when buying a new "naked" boat.
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Old 05-23-2019, 11:17 PM   #16
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In your boat budget don't forget to allow for upgrades like A/C & post-purchase outfitting. Circa 1990 I spent close to 70k outfitting my 35' cruising sailboat with electronics, inverter, generator, canvas, dinghies, anchors, chain, liferaft & other safety gear, spares, etc. (That figure included the cost of the new toilet plunger & bucket that would serve as my washing machine for the next few years.)


Most co$ts of proper outfitting are not recoverable when selling. Custom canvas (it's ALL custom) alone can easily run into tens of thousands of dollars. For that reason, consider a late model, already kitted out, of one the boats you like. You'll still need to add gear that suits your boating style, but likely not as much as when buying a new "naked" boat.
Thanks, I'm all over it, I've been around this block a few times. I always tell people: "Owning a boat is a LOT more expensive than buying one!"
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Old 05-24-2019, 08:32 AM   #17
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Birdman: Over the winter I was shopping for used boats and had a similar target budget ($200k). One thing became clear very quick. $200k doesn't get you what it used to!

I love downeasts as well but couldn't find any that fit my needs. They were either too fishy (huge cockpit) and less interior space or too expensive. However I was always looking for 2 staterooms, a single stateroom would've been a deal breaker for me. I'm also a full time liveaboard. If you're only looking for a single berth DE boat then you may find a nice one if you keep looking.

About your speed requirements: You mentioned a 15 knot minimum. That will almost
entirely knock you out of the traditional trawler world. Many of the guys on this forum are cruising at 7-10 knots and are quite happy with that. So keep that in mind. A "real" trawler will be a slow vessel. But this is a topic for debate and HAS been debated on here many times; IMO there is no hard and fast rule to what a trawler is. There are lots of folks on this forum with sportfishers, cabin cruisers and the like. Nothing wrong with that (unless you ask Nomad Willy!).

Your engine preference will also steer you away from most traditional trawlers. Most of the folks on here have a single diesel. However there are some twin configurations. Many older Grand Banks and that ilk had smaller Lehman twins (some even had larger twins). But a single diesel seems to be the norm for a "trawler".

I can give you some real world reviews from my boat shopping over the winter. I toured and really liked the 2005 Mainship 400 Trawler. Beautiful boat! Very beamy and stable. Big, single diesel. Decent generator power. Thrusters, 2 AC's etc. Around $180k before negotiations. I liked it very much but I didn't like the large cockpit. I felt it was like wasted space because I don't fish and would rather have more interior space. I also didn't like the small double bunk guest room (but you may not mind it). Very nice boat but didn't check all my boxes.


I then toured a 1998 Bayliner 4788 CPMY. LOVED IT!! I WAS VERY CLOSE TO BUYING THIS! Don't be fooled by the Bayliner name. This is a well built yacht and has cult like status. It's an amazing layout. You have so many different living areas; you really get that big boat feel but still under 50 feet. The salon and galley were one of my favorite areas. Huge living area in the salon. Very cool boat! I didn't pull the trigger because I honestly thought I wasn't ready for a 50 footer yet. I do a lot of solo cruising and line handling may have been tricky on the 4788.


Have you looked at the Silverton's in the 40ish range? You can find some beautiful boats with your budget. Good luck. The shopping part can be fun but also stressful....Sometimes brutal actually. Lol
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Old 05-24-2019, 05:03 PM   #18
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Birdman: Over the winter I was shopping for used boats and had a similar target budget ($200k). One thing became clear very quick. $200k doesn't get you what it used to!

I love downeasts as well but couldn't find any that fit my needs. They were either too fishy (huge cockpit) and less interior space or too expensive. However I was always looking for 2 staterooms, a single stateroom would've been a deal breaker for me. I'm also a full time liveaboard. If you're only looking for a single berth DE boat then you may find a nice one if you keep looking.

About your speed requirements: You mentioned a 15 knot minimum. That will almost
entirely knock you out of the traditional trawler world. Many of the guys on this forum are cruising at 7-10 knots and are quite happy with that. So keep that in mind. A "real" trawler will be a slow vessel. But this is a topic for debate and HAS been debated on here many times; IMO there is no hard and fast rule to what a trawler is. There are lots of folks on this forum with sportfishers, cabin cruisers and the like. Nothing wrong with that (unless you ask Nomad Willy!).

Your engine preference will also steer you away from most traditional trawlers. Most of the folks on here have a single diesel. However there are some twin configurations. Many older Grand Banks and that ilk had smaller Lehman twins (some even had larger twins). But a single diesel seems to be the norm for a "trawler".

I can give you some real world reviews from my boat shopping over the winter. I toured and really liked the 2005 Mainship 400 Trawler. Beautiful boat! Very beamy and stable. Big, single diesel. Decent generator power. Thrusters, 2 AC's etc. Around $180k before negotiations. I liked it very much but I didn't like the large cockpit. I felt it was like wasted space because I don't fish and would rather have more interior space. I also didn't like the small double bunk guest room (but you may not mind it). Very nice boat but didn't check all my boxes.


I then toured a 1998 Bayliner 4788 CPMY. LOVED IT!! I WAS VERY CLOSE TO BUYING THIS! Don't be fooled by the Bayliner name. This is a well built yacht and has cult like status. It's an amazing layout. You have so many different living areas; you really get that big boat feel but still under 50 feet. The salon and galley were one of my favorite areas. Huge living area in the salon. Very cool boat! I didn't pull the trigger because I honestly thought I wasn't ready for a 50 footer yet. I do a lot of solo cruising and line handling may have been tricky on the 4788.


Have you looked at the Silverton's in the 40ish range? You can find some beautiful boats with your budget. Good luck. The shopping part can be fun but also stressful....Sometimes brutal actually. Lol
Thanks for the comments/info. Forget the Silverton's, I'm not a fan of them at all. I've never been on one I liked, and they have a bad name around LI for the most part.

You mention the 40 Mainship had a "big cockpit" area, too big for you. I've eyeballed (only around the docks) a few 40 mainships because I like the "look" of them and always wondered if it would fit the bill for me. BUT, I always notice there is really no cockpit, barely enough room for a chair or two. So I wonder if there is another version of the 40 mainship available than the ones I've seen?

I do like a larger cockpit, I don't need it huge like a fishing platform area, but I like being outdoors, that's why I boat in the first place. I hate with a passion the motoryachts that have no cockpit, like the stern statetroom type boats... I just don't understand them unless your just living on the boat, that's another story I guess. But I want to back into the slip, and hang out in the cockpit in the sunshine, or anchor up and do the same. Indoors is for cooking and sleeping.
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Old 05-24-2019, 09:44 PM   #19
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Thanks for the comments/info. Forget the Silverton's, I'm not a fan of them at all. I've never been on one I liked, and they have a bad name around LI for the most part.

You mention the 40 Mainship had a "big cockpit" area, too big for you. I've eyeballed (only around the docks) a few 40 mainships because I like the "look" of them and always wondered if it would fit the bill for me. BUT, I always notice there is really no cockpit, barely enough room for a chair or two. So I wonder if there is another version of the 40 mainship available than the ones I've seen?

I do like a larger cockpit, I don't need it huge like a fishing platform area, but I like being outdoors, that's why I boat in the first place. I hate with a passion the motoryachts that have no cockpit, like the stern statetroom type boats... I just don't understand them unless your just living on the boat, that's another story I guess. But I want to back into the slip, and hang out in the cockpit in the sunshine, or anchor up and do the same. Indoors is for cooking and sleeping.
Silvertons have a bad name in L.I? Really? That's odd since they're New Jersey boats.

The Mainship 400 Trawler is the boat I was referring to. Here's a Yacht World link.

https://www.yachtworld.com/boats/200...awler-3539051/

Btw, I love my aft cabin layout. Good thing there are so many different boat choices out there for all of us.
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Old 05-24-2019, 10:02 PM   #20
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An alternate suggestion: Since compromise could lead to an unfishable boat that doesn't cruise well, would it be possible to fully commit to a trawler with no fishing amenities, and then trailer something like a 20-25 foot dedicated fish boat ???
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