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Old 09-21-2015, 05:48 PM   #121
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I'm OK as long as they maintain course. (To starboard is a bridge pier.)

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Old 09-21-2015, 05:55 PM   #122
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When I get in a situation that I don't know what the other skipper is going to do, I always slow and give way. I don't care who has the right away. Most of the time the vessel entering my course is much bigger and working for a living-me? I'm retired and not in a hurry.
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Old 09-21-2015, 08:25 PM   #123
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a lot of replies for a simple question

I think Skipper Cave did exactly the correct thing. He was unsure of the response from the sail boat, so he slowed down. In this case the sail boat crossed his bow, and because Skipper Cave slowed down, or stalled as it were, the event passed uneventfully. Well done Skipper Cave.

As for blowing the correct number of horn blasts? It is extremely unlikely anyone would know what a certain blast would mean. So blowing the horn to attract attention is probably the only blast Skipper Cave could have done.
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Old 09-21-2015, 10:53 PM   #124
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As for blowing the correct number of horn blasts? It is extremely unlikely anyone would know what a certain blast would mean. So blowing the horn to attract attention is probably the only blast Skipper Cave could have done.
Based on many of the responses to this tread I think you're spot on.

Apparently there is no point in using or even knowing the correct signals. Everyone should just go out and get one of those car horns that plays pieces of songs. Like say Dixie. That should get another vessels attention just fine.
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Old 09-21-2015, 11:47 PM   #125
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... Apparently there is no point in using or even knowing the correct signals. Everyone should just go out and get one of those car horns that plays pieces of songs. Like say Dixie. That should get another vessels attention just fine.
Further support not to trust another boater's appreciation of the COLREGS unless demonstrated.
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Old 09-21-2015, 11:51 PM   #126
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Based on many of the responses to this tread I think you're spot on.

Apparently there is no point in using or even knowing the correct signals. Everyone should just go out and get one of those car horns that plays pieces of songs. Like say Dixie. That should get another vessels attention just fine.
Bill, well said, except playing Dixie, these days, may attract the black helicopters from the justice dept.

And you may as well be whistling Dixie in trying to bring some formality to horn signals.
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Old 09-22-2015, 04:45 PM   #127
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Tone of thred

Is anyone but me having the thought that the tone of this thread argues pretty strongly for universal licensing and MUCH more training than any state, to my knowledge, requires for pleasure boaters? Don't think anybody here wants that but come on folks, please stop arguing against knowing the rules. Bill
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Old 09-22-2015, 05:15 PM   #128
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Greetings,
Mr. 47. "...universal licensing and MUCH more training..." Vehicles driven on the roads require this. I rest my case.
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Old 09-22-2015, 05:38 PM   #129
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Greetings,
Mr. 47. "...universal licensing and MUCH more training..." Vehicles driven on the roads require this. I rest my case.
I'm with you on this one !
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Old 09-22-2015, 06:00 PM   #130
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Is anyone but me having the thought that the tone of this thread argues pretty strongly for universal licensing and MUCH more training than any state, to my knowledge, requires for pleasure boaters? Don't think anybody here wants that but come on folks, please stop arguing against knowing the rules. Bill
I have freely admitted that I have a hard time remembering the sound signal rules. I have also stated that I should remember them and have taken steps to have a cheat sheet readily available while under way.

I haven't really heard anyone arguing against knowing the rules but folks have pointed out the realities that a few of us (well od, me) don't remember them all the time and that those of you who know then all and use them all correctly may run into boaters who don't.

The argument has been made, or at least implied in this thread that any sound signal that does not conform to the Maneuvering and Warning signals is worse than useless. That argument does make a lot of sense.

So back to JDs situation. It seems to me that in regards to sound signals, he had a couple of options that would conform to the COLREGS.
1. He could (should?) have made the 5 short blast signal in accordance with Rule 34 (d)
2. He could have used any combination of sound signals (other than Morse code SOS) using say 3 second blasts since those that know the COLREGS would immediately understand that those are not signals otherwise authorized in the COLREGS hence can be used simply to attract attention. Rule 36.

I am sure those that know and use the sound signals make sure to always make their long blasts between 4 and 6 seconds in length. Right?
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Old 09-22-2015, 06:39 PM   #131
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...
I am sure those that know and use the sound signals make sure to always make their long blasts between 4 and 6 seconds in length. Right?
Some boaters seem to be embarrassed or miserly to "lean" on the horn since they make a half-second toot when a prolonged, 4 to 6 second blast is called for.
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Old 09-22-2015, 07:53 PM   #132
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For the most part, the sound signals are fairly simple to learn and should be employed by all if not in the actual signal but in the thought process. If you are meeting (head on) or overtaking another vessel and you are going to be watching him out of your port window during the process then that is a one whistle situation. If you will be watching a similar vessel out of your strb. window it would be a two whistle situation. If you are BEING OVERTAKEN think of the physics involved and pretend that you are actually heading towards the other vessel and your bow is now your stern and the same applies. Practice it while driving your car, it will come to you pretty naturally.
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Old 09-22-2015, 08:16 PM   #133
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I only know the five blasts but thought they were supposed to be long or not short or?
For a number of years I've been in Alaska and boat trafic is light enough so there's really not much motivation for AIS or correct horn blasts. And in the lower 48 states so few know them that learning them and using them is basically a waste of time. Imagine how confusing it would be if we had 5 or 6 different horn signals necessary to drive our cars. Somehow I don't feel terribly guilty about now knowing the horn blasts.
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Old 09-22-2015, 08:47 PM   #134
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While not always blown it is very common down here to use the one or two whistle to indicate over the VHF your intentions. As in "see you on the one".

Forget the port and strb. window thing and look at it this way: Do not point your hand across your body, use either your right hand or your left hand to point to the other vessel and then track its proposed relationship with you through your meeting or passing situation. If the boat is overtaking you then you have to turn around to point at it and track through the situation. If you are using your right hand its a two whistle situation if you are using your left its a one whistle. If the vessel is ahead of you whether meeting or passing it you do not have to turn around to see it. Same thing though, left or right hand tracking through the proposed meeting no pointing across your body.

Knowing the one a two may save from having to blow the five.
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Old 09-22-2015, 09:29 PM   #135
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I think the main difference here is the frame of reference of the professional mariner and that of the amateur mariner. Certainly not universal, but one's past experience can dictate what one might expect of others. And definitely not directed at any person in particular.

If you are a pro and have always been a pro and your peers are pros, you expect others to behave in a professional manner wrt the Navrules...know them and comply. There's no excuse for not knowing the rules you're required to comply with, regardless of your pro or amateur status.

If your roots in boating are as a recreational boater who once didn't (maybe still don't?) know the Navrules but you got by, you might expect others you encounter on the water to have a similar familiarity or lack thereof with the Navrules. Maybe you do or maybe you don't know all the rules. Maybe you just know the ones that you think will apply to you in your vessel and circumstances. Your expectation of others understanding rules you consider irrelevant are probably not too high. You could very well be right!

It's each of our responsibilities to know and comply with the NavRules, expect the others to do the same and be prepared to act safely when the other vessel doesn't.
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Old 09-22-2015, 09:47 PM   #136
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Do not point your hand across your body, use either your right hand or your left hand to point to the other vessel and then track its proposed relationship with you through your meeting or passing situation. If the boat is overtaking you then you have to turn around to point at it and track through the situation. If you are using your right hand its a two whistle situation if you are using your left its a one whistle. If the vessel is ahead of you whether meeting or passing it you do not have to turn around to see it. Same thing though, left or right hand tracking through the proposed meeting no pointing across your body.
Great suggestion. A question though, why would I need to signal to a vessel that is overtaking me? Would I be asking them to pass on a given side of me? Generally, I have always assumed that the burden to avoid any conflict is on the overtaking vessel.

One thing that is interesting up here in the PNW is that afaik, the entire Puget Sound region is under International Rules, while just north of us the Canadians are under their version of the Inland rules.

So if I am overtaking someone to starboard on the South side of the Strait of Juan de Fuca I would blow 2 long and 1 short. If I am North of the Strait, I would blow 1 short.

Amazingly, I actually do overtake powerboats on rare occasions. I run at just under 7 knots burning under 1 gph and sometimes pass a FD or SD slow boat.
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Old 09-22-2015, 09:48 PM   #137
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A large ship going down current and constrained by draft trumps any sailboat or powerboat, under power or sail. That and the fact that it will squash your little tub makes it a good idea to avoid contact at all cost. But, one thing that really ammuses me is that on countless accounts of sail and powerboats at sea when encountering a ship, if it gets within a mile of them it becomes "scary" and "we were almost run down" then in the channell at home they will cut across the bow like its a bass boat. go figure.
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Old 09-22-2015, 09:48 PM   #138
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At least brush up on them before the depositions.
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Old 09-22-2015, 10:02 PM   #139
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Dave: yes, the burden is on the vessel doing the overtaking. it would not be uncommon down here for him to contact you and ask what whistle would you prefer me to overtake you on ? Most of my experience is on rivers and it is the descending vessel that usually dictates which whistle in meeting situations, as far as overtaking situations the burden is still on the one doing the overtaking and most of the time the one being overtaken will want the slacker water naturally when up river bound.

I would have to study up on the Canadian rules, no...never mind too cold.

We have both International, and U.S. Inland, and then they throw in Western River Rules (above the H.P. Long Bridge in Red Stick). One, two, and five blast are still the same though.
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Old 09-22-2015, 10:06 PM   #140
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To correct the last the western river and great lake rules have now been included in the Inland rules for the most part.
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