Wannabee Windows

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Marin wrote:

*
nomadwilly wrote:Marin,
*
I didn't notice the fwd raked windows on the 247 untill I ckicked on it. Wow. That must have caused all manner of heavy turbulence on the rudder.
No, I don't think it did.**Both planes were put into production and sold to airlines and operated in passenger service*with the reverse-raked windshield panels.* The design made it*through flight testing with no problems so I have to assume they did not cause any control issues.

They probably caused some drag issues, however, and there may have been other reasons for their discontinuation in later versions of the planes.* They certainly LOOK draggy, don't they?
I understand that a full Raised Pilot House is being considered as a revision to the 787. There is even a boat deck for a dink in case of a water landing.

*
 
Why do I like the statement "serious boats have their pilot house toward the rear"?
 
Carey wrote:I understand that a full Raised Pilot House is being considered as a revision to the 787. There is even a boat deck for a dink in case of a water landing.
Don't know about that one.* Right now we're just trying to get the 787 delivered and into*service.* We'll worry about modifications like flying bridges, piothouses, and boat decks later if the airlines want them.

The 777, however, is available with a boat deck.* Above the aft cabin*overhead is a wonderful crew rest area.* We moved all the systems--- ducting, wiring, etc.-- outboard to make room for a long, eight or ten berth*crew rest in back and a two person*flight crew rest up front.* Best accomodations on the plane.* No windows, but the berths are great and the pilots get the aviation equivelant of Lazy Boys in their crew rest over the forward galley.

The 747 was a pilothouse design from the outset although the lines were not drawn by Aurthur deFever.* The 47 was designed as a freighter for Juan Tripp of Pan Am ( the passenger plane of the era was to be the SST) which is the reason the flight deck is above the main deck and streamlined with a hump.* More room for*cargo.* When the SST was killed the 747 became the premier passenger plane of its day but it was never intended for this purpose.*

They first tried a wannabe funnel on the 747 to go along with the "ocean liner of the skies" image but it was too draggy so they did away with it.* Eric would have liked it, though.

The 747, by the way, had nothing whatsoever in common with Boeing's losing entry in the large cargo transport aka C-5 competition which Lockheed won.* Boeing's C-5*entry looked more or less just like*Lockheed's.*
 
Moonstruck wrote:

Why do I like the statement "serious boats have their pilot house toward the rear"?

Don

I'm not surprised. The rest of us are envious, and will try to berate the concept.
 
Carey wrote:


Moonstruck wrote:

Why do I like the statement "serious boats have their pilot house toward the rear"?

Don

I'm not surprised. The rest of us are envious, and will try to berate the concept.

I'm unsure of what is meant here.* Would the meaning change if one had said "serious boats have their pilot houses near the stern"?

*
 
markpierce wrote:


Carey wrote:

*
Moonstruck wrote:

Why do I like the statement "serious boats have their pilot house toward the rear"?

Don

I'm not surprised. The rest of us are envious, and will try to berate the concept.

I'm unsure of what is meant here.* Would the meaning change if one had said "serious boats have their pilot houses near the stern"?

*

Mark, nothing was meant here.* I was making light of the statement.* My boat is not a serious ovvshore cruiser.* It is a coastal cruisers.* I consider your boat a serious offshore cruiser.* As a matter of fact, I went on the Seahorse Marine site.* I looked at the Coot and the 38 Diesel Duck.* I don't know what I will be doing in the future, but if one of those boats seemed to fit my needs, I would be very interested.* I like the idea of a steel boat.

*
 
Found this Willard "wanabee" example in the archives.
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-- Edited by healhustler on Monday 10th of January 2011 10:34:11 PM
 

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Moonstruck wrote:

* I looked at the Coot and the 38 Diesel Duck.* I don't know what I will be doing in the future, but if one of those boats seemed to fit my needs, I would be very interested.* I like the idea of a steel boat.
The builder describes the Coot as a coastal/inland cruiser.* If I had the money and planned to make long offshore cruises, I'd have gotten a 38 Diesel Duck

*
 
Well that was a bit of a shock. I, of course saw my Willy thumbnail, had'nt read any of the text but seemed to sense something strange. Even in the thumbnail I saw that the windows looked like they were slanted fwd so I suspected an optical illusion so I clicked on the thumbnail*** ...and HOLY FLIT!*** Bout fell out of my chair!
Now I've got to admit it dosn't look exactly bad*** ...but I'm so intimate w Willy I can't look at the picture without thinking how strange or weird she looks. One thing I can say for sure is that I DO like the visor. Been looking at Nordics and some of the later ones have Visors not unlike what hustlers put on Willy. Well*** ...I guess I need to be emotionally prepared to log on this site. Hey Mark***** that visor would look very good on Coot. Maybe you could talk hustler into do'in a mod on your Coot. But he's got to have an image to work with.
 
When the posts refer to "visors", are we really talking about "brows?"
 
nomadwilly wrote:

*Hey Mark***** that visor would look very good on Coot. Maybe you could talk hustler into do'in a mod on your Coot. But he's got to have an image to work with.
I don't think so, Eric.* A visor will trap the energy of waves, resulting in the tearing off of the pilothouse roof, or worse.

No visor needed here.* Because of the forward-leaning pilothouse windows, the roof makes an effective visor.



*
 
I go for forward tilting windows for two reasons:
They look right (maybe my North Sea / North Atlantic upbringing is influencing me?)
They* keep glare from the instruments off my eyes

The SAR vessel below has forward slanting front windows: NO glare
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*
Side windows are vertical. Glare from radar/charting system/you-name-it*
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I have never taken green sea*head on her. Have done a couple of**"torpedos" at*high speed*in following sea. The bow hit the back ridge of the next wave and dug in.*The sea went completely over her and hit the open array radar. It shut down itself down because of the external force on the antenna. Powered up without problem as the water flew off.

I wish I had forward slanting windows on my own boat. I will be looking at adding some sort of brow (visor?) over the engine instruments panel*to keep the reflecting lights off the front window.
 

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nomadwilly wrote:

** ...but I'm so intimate w Willy I can't look at the picture without thinking how strange or weird she looks. One thing I can say for sure is that I DO like the visor.
Watch it, Eric.* We are getting very close to eroticism here!
smile.gif


*
 
RT Firefly wrote:

Hiya,
** Mr. Moonstruck.* I think that's spelt eyachticism...
New word, but it works.* Thanks.

*
 
r-rossow,Is that your boat in the picture and the avitar? It's so beautiful it must be a Fleming.
Awhile back we here on TF decided that the Flemings *were the most beautiful boat and as I recall they NEVER have wannabee windows.
 
r-rossow wrote:

I go for forward tilting windows for two reasons:
They look right (maybe my North Sea / North Atlantic upbringing is influencing me?)
They* keep glare from the instruments off my eyes
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

*

Well, here you go. *The boat looks great either way to me. *Of course, you can't do much with an avitar.

-- Edited by healhustler on Tuesday 11th of January 2011 12:33:23 PM
 

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healhustler wrote:

*
r-rossow wrote:

I go for forward tilting windows for two reasons:
They look right (maybe my North Sea / North Atlantic upbringing is influencing me?)
They* keep glare from the instruments off my eyes
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

Well, here you go. *The boat looks great either way to me.
HustlerAs much as I love the look of your boat, I am not feeling too good about the Fleming. It just doesn't fit the theme.*
no.gif


*
 
Carey wrote:
Hustler
As much as I love the look of your boat, I am not feeling too good about the Fleming. It just doesn't fit the theme.*
no.gif


*

Carey:

LOL. *You may be right about that, although I'm sure that Flemming could do a much better job than Photoshop. *Kind-of makes you grateful for both styles, yes?

*
 
healhustler wrote:

*
Carey wrote:
Hustler
As much as I love the look of your boat, I am not feeling too good about the Fleming. It just doesn't fit the theme.*
no.gif


*

Carey:

LOL. *You may be right about that, although I'm sure that Flemming could do a much better job than Photoshop. *Kind-of makes you grateful for both styles, yes?
HustlerI don't know about that. You are pretty crafty with Photoshop.*
smile.gif


*



-- Edited by Carey on Tuesday 11th of January 2011 07:06:17 PM
 
RT Firefly wrote:

Hiya,
A "consideration".
Firefly: *Never heard such subtle wisdom on windows.







*



-- Edited by healhustler on Tuesday 11th of January 2011 06:59:32 PM

-- Edited by healhustler on Tuesday 11th of January 2011 07:00:11 PM

-- Edited by healhustler on Tuesday 11th of January 2011 07:26:21 PM
 

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Hustler---

I am guessing you are not aware that a photograph remains copyrighted to the original photogrpaher forever unless the photographer agrees to a buy-out of the rights. Even if the photographer is hired to take pictures for a client, the client can negotiate exclusive use rights for a specific time period but they will never own the photo unless they negotiate a rights buy-out. And once the time period is up the photographer can sell the photo to other clients. (None of this applies to video for whatever reason).

The photo of Carey's boat you have modified was taken by me. As such, I own the copyright. As you have used the photo without the copyright holder's permission, you are subject to a use fee payable to the copyright holder. And since you did not negotiate this fee before you used the photo, the fee will be determined by the copyright holder.

Normally I would not charge you all that much, but because you have defaced Carey's boat into a butt-ugly vessel (in my opinion, which is the only one that counts here), plus misreprented my work by flipping it, the use fee for my photo is $1.5 million, or the current price of a new, fully equipped Fleming 55, whichever is greater. My attorney will be drawing up the papers for your signature later this week.

As a point of interest we got our Rocna anchor in exactly this way. A Seattle-based magazine used one of my deHavilland Beaver photos on its cover wthout my persmission. When a friend showed me the magazine I contacted the publisher, told him it was my photo, proved it, and he said they'd pay me whatever I felt was fair. So I charged them several thousand dollars for a photo I would have let them use for a few hundred had they asked me beforehand.

-- Edited by Marin on Tuesday 11th of January 2011 07:14:44 PM
 
healhustler wrote:
RT Firefly wrote:


Hiya,
A "consideration".
Firefly: *Never heard such subtle wisdom on windows.

-- Edited by healhustler on Tuesday 11th of January 2011 06:59:32 PM

-- Edited by healhustler on Tuesday 11th of January 2011 07:00:11 PM
*
Good job HustlerI'm going to see if I can get Marin to help me with the necessary fiberglass work to make the conversion permanent. The only problem I see is that I'll have to find a new boating buddy, as Marin won't be seen with me.*
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*
 
Carey wrote:



*
Good job HustlerI'm going to see if I can get Marin to help me with the necessary fiberglass work to make the conversion permanent. The only problem I see is that I'll have to find a new boating buddy, as Marin won't be seen with me.*
biggrin.gif


*


Not sure that I would ask Marin to help with that.
smile.gif


*
 
Woops. *Well, I guess I'd better stop this play then. *I can only claim the ignorance of a well meaning, but perhaps too interested in other peoples boats old fuddy duddy. *I will stop Photoshop work on your superb GB immediately, and pray that you don't take the only things I have to my name (a 75 lb. Rocna and this old Mac laptop).*
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healhustler wrote:

I will stop Photoshop work on your superb GB immediately, and pray that you don't take the only things I have to my name (a 75 lb. Rocna and this old Mac laptop).*
ashamed.gif
1.* There's nothing you can do in Photoshop that will make a GB look all that great no matter which way the windows slant.*

2. We have a Rocna and don't need another one (although on second thought*we WILL need a larger one for that Fleming that's coming to us).

3.* Got a new(ish) Mac, don't need another old one.

4.* Actually, Carey's boat doesn't look near as ridiculous as I think*most recreational boats do*with reverse-raked windows.* I think it's because his boat looks like a true working boat to begin with, which makes sense since it's built on a true*working lobsterboat hull.**So the reverse-rake is actually*somewhat in character for the rough-water, working*design of his boat.* However,*while I am sure there are some, I have not seen a commercial*lobsterboat in Maine or on Prince Edward Island with reverse-raked*windows.*

-- Edited by Marin on Tuesday 11th of January 2011 08:02:45 PM
 
nomadwilly wrote:

r-rossow,
Is that your boat in the picture and the avitar? It's so beautiful it must be a Fleming.
Awhile back we here on TF decided that the Flemings *were the most beautiful boat and as I recall they NEVER have wannabee windows.
Eric,
I wish it was a Fleming. (Fleming 55 and 65 have been my favourite for years. The 75 looks too "stretched" to please my eye).
Met a marina staff in Northern Spain last summer*that was in insisting it was a Fleming even when I told him otherwise. That guy upped my ego!

The boat is an Ocean Alexander 50 Mk1 that*had 5 feet added to her a***by her PO a few years back. Her aft deck size has tripled making her look like a Fleming.
The powertrain was upgraded from Lehman's to Volvo Penta 63L's some 15 years back. Had 1100 hours on the clock when we took posession of her a year ago. Added 300+ hours/2500 nautical miles to her this summer bringing her from southern Portugal (200 miles west of Gibraltar) to Scandinavia.

Roger



-- Edited by r-rossow on Wednesday 12th of January 2011 02:30:52 AM

-- Edited by r-rossow on Wednesday 12th of January 2011 02:31:50 AM
 

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Just personally I must admit I have always believed in the form following function concept, and always felt forward raked windows should be de rigeur for virtually all except fast planing vessels, which is the only situation where aerodynamics are relevant, and in most vessels this is certainly not the case. Otherwise it seems the forward sloping just makes more sense all round, and I wish my boat had them. One could therefore reasonably ask, why would any displacement vessel have other than forward raked windscreens, preferably of laminated construction, which is the term I think P/F was looking for? In my experience boating, the only time I have wanted a really good view forwards and upwards is passing under bridges, and for that I definitely drive from the flybridge to be absolutely sure......
Oh, and Hustler, I officially give you permission to photshop Lotus to see what a CHB 34 with forward raked front windscreens would look like.

-- Edited by Peter B on Wednesday 12th of January 2011 04:26:03 AM
 

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PS....this could get ugly.....
 
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