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Old 08-12-2015, 11:35 PM   #21
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I'm sorry but the only way the op will get close to what he wants at a presumably modest budget(deduced from the op's suggested boat brands) will be if he goes with his Bayliner or Carver option. They are both planing hulls and with a couple compromises can easily tick off most of the other boxes.
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Old 08-12-2015, 11:57 PM   #22
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The big thing here is fuel economy. I think you are making too big of a deal about it. ANd if you can't afford it you might need to look at a smaller boat. It takes a lot of power to push 25,000 pounds of plastic and iron through the water at planing speeds. The Powercat option is pretty much your only option. That or a very small boat. My Mainship 30 Pilot came close on fuel economy but does not meet most of your criteria. Get rid of the fuel economy criteria or settle on slow speed....or get a powercat!!!!
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Old 08-13-2015, 12:11 AM   #23
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I think we've found several boats that come close but without the aft cabin. That makes it a cruising boat for a couple and a weekend boat for two couples.
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Old 08-13-2015, 07:25 AM   #24
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Thanks all for the great leads.
It seems like the aft cabin knocks out a lot of options, and thinking about it, a better arrangement would be to sleep in the salon when just us, and use the forward berth only with guests.

The 4 mpg is only something to aim for, and 12 knots would probably be a more realistic requirement, use less fuel, and still get us places faster than a true FD hull boat.

So, any additional recommendations if we disregard an aft cabin and look at lower top speed?

RClark: Thanks for the boattest website. I'd looked at that in the past but forgotten about it.
Ranger: Do you recall what kind of mpg you got with your Mainship?
Blissboat: I'm not opposed to Cats. I actually like the looks and layout of the PDQ. I'd be concerned about increased slips fees with such a wide boat, as well, as difficulty in some marinas.

Thanks for the info on the Camano; I had not come across that yet.

Again, I really appreciate all the helpful advice and knowledge. Also, appreciate the patience as I try to focus in on what's realistic to expect. I realize all boats are a compromise and I need to figure what I think will be our best option(s).
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Old 08-13-2015, 07:42 AM   #25
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ToddS View Post
It seems like the aft cabin knocks out a lot of options, and thinking about it, a better arrangement would be to sleep in the salon when just us, and use the forward berth only with guests.



Ranger: Do you recall what kind of mpg you got with your Mainship?

I'm afraid I don't, sorry. Never actually paid any attention to it, just added more when we needed it. Fuel wasn't really one of our higher-cost budget items...

FWIW, today with our current boat, fuel isn't really highest on our expense list.


Why would you want to sleep in the saloon instead of a forward berth?


FWIW, a real pull-out sleeper in a saloon eats up beam pretty quickly. Our current beam is something like 2' wider than the Mainship was, and there's only a small bit of room to walk around our sleeper when it's pulled out into bed form. We've allowed guests to use it a couple times, but it's very disruptive... at least for us.

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Old 08-13-2015, 07:47 AM   #26
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Again, I really appreciate all the helpful advice and knowledge. Also, appreciate the patience as I try to focus in on what's realistic to expect. I realize all boats are a compromise and I need to figure what I think will be our best option(s)
Hi Tod,

Just to give you a framework to explore the sort of boats that might meet your criteria, here is a modern common rail super efficient trawler design:

Swift trawler 34: 34' x 13' beam.
http://www.beneteau.com/Motorboats/S...ift-Trawler-34
Displ. Loaded: 8.5 tons.
Single engine: 425 HP.

Fuel no's:
1200 revs/ 7kts / 2gal/3.5 mpg.
2500 rev/ 15kts/10gal/1.5 mpg.

So you can see the general rule of about 50hp/ ton on a semi- displ hull is a very good guide.

Conclusion:
The problem is finding a boat that's light enough...
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Old 08-13-2015, 09:33 AM   #27
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The PDQ will do that if you're willing to go slow. For real first hand numbers, check this blog: Golden Trawler
Interesting blog. They reported 3.6 piles per gallon over almost 6000 miles. Not bad at all. We looked at an Endeavour 44' trawlercat (powercat???) and it was really roomy. I still think about that boat but was intimidated by the 19' beam. One of the local marinas said we would need to rent a 60' slip to get a wide enough berth.

Also on the blog, I found it interesting they were doing a delivery on a Searay and sheared the shaft losing the prop. There was no mention of hitting anything.
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Old 08-13-2015, 09:57 AM   #28
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We'd be using it for mostly day trips, and occasional weekends on the Chesapeake Bay, based out of the Annapolis areas....Reviewing the forums, looking like a Albin, Tollycraft, Island Gypsy, or Mainship might be in line. Also, Bayliner or Carver seem to be possibilities..
If only day trips, why not look at a Sunbridge instead of a command bridge? Bayliner, Sea Ray and others have even produced aft cabin (some say coffin cabin) models.

Why are you steering away from your Albin, Tollycraft, Island Gypsy, or Mainship possibilities?
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Old 08-13-2015, 10:13 AM   #29
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ToddS,
Light and narrow and some rocker will deliver but a contemporary boat will not find these charicteristics available. And objective real fuel consumption numbers are rare.

Perhaps an Albin 27 would come close. No FB and not quite the speed though but not sure about the latter. Aft cabin though.
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Old 08-13-2015, 10:19 AM   #30
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Also on the blog, I found it interesting they were doing a delivery on a Searay and sheared the shaft losing the prop. There was no mention of hitting anything.
Shafts that aren't maintained(zincs) become pitted and therefore weaken. A severely pitted shaft can break without hitting anything. When I bought this boat, it came out of the water during survey and the condition of the running gear was so bad that we ended the survey right there and deemed the boat unseaworthy even to ride home on. One of the many issues was pitted shafts. When a catain went to rescue the boat a few days later one of the props broke off while she was maneuvered into the slip. So....it can happen.
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Old 08-13-2015, 10:24 AM   #31
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Nordic Tug 32/34:
- 270 HP Cummins.
- normal cruise at 8 knots.
- cruise all day at 12+ knots (2000-2200 rpm).
- WOT 2600 rpm top end of 18 knots.
- 10 year average of 1.5 GPH.
- 200 gallons fuel, 100 gallons water
- no flybridge, but a chariot bridge option is available.
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Old 08-13-2015, 10:35 AM   #32
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Shafts that aren't maintained(zincs) become pitted and therefore weaken. A severely pitted shaft can break without hitting anything. When I bought this boat, it came out of the water during survey and the condition of the running gear was so bad that we ended the survey right there and deemed the boat unseaworthy even to ride home on. One of the many issues was pitted shafts. When a catain went to rescue the boat a few days later one of the props broke off while she was maneuvered into the slip. So....it can happen.
The delivery was on he Great Lakes and the buyer was a marina owner and he ended up replacing the shaft himself so I would discount pitting issues but it is possible. There was a delivery involved since the buyer had too much work at his marina during peak boating season.
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Old 08-13-2015, 10:58 AM   #33
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Blissboat you beat me to it.


Rafe
Rafe: Glad to know that I'm not the only cat fancier on the TF. There is something salty and purposeful-looking about PDQs. Other power cats have many of the same virtues, but they just don't draw the eye as boats like yours do.

No matter what boat you decide to marry, when you are pulling away in your dinghy, you should be able to glance back over your shoulder with satisfaction, thinking to yourself, "Yep - that's my boat."
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Old 08-13-2015, 11:12 AM   #34
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If only day trips, why not look at a Sunbridge instead of a command bridge? Bayliner, Sea Ray and others have even produced aft cabin (some say coffin cabin) models.

Why are you steering away from your Albin, Tollycraft, Island Gypsy, or Mainship possibilities?

Hawgwash: Hadn't thought about the sunbridge. In all likelihood, we wouldn't (intentionally) be out in foul/cold weather requiring a helm 'inside'. Any specific examples of a model with a sunbridge? Reading through all the great posts, it makes me re-think my needs based on intended use, and is changing some (wrong) assumptions.



Sorry for the confusion if you thought I was steering away from those models. Those are the ones that seem to be the most likely candidates at this point.
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Old 08-13-2015, 11:15 AM   #35
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I'm afraid I don't, sorry. Never actually paid any attention to it, just added more when we needed it. Fuel wasn't really one of our higher-cost budget items...

Why would you want to sleep in the saloon instead of a forward berth?


FWIW, a real pull-out sleeper in a saloon eats up beam pretty quickly. Our current beam is something like 2' wider than the Mainship was, and there's only a small bit of room to walk around our sleeper when it's pulled out into bed form. We've allowed guests to use it a couple times, but it's very disruptive... at least for us.

-Chris
I'm assuming (we know what happens later) that a v-berth with an insert would be harder to maneuver in/out of at night for that late night trips to the head and that something in the salon would be easier to walk around. Sounds like that's not the case.

I'd prefer some sort of insert for the vberth just for comfort sake, but I'm basing this off of sleeping in a friends v-berth many years ago.

Maybe any guests should just sleep in the dinghy.
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Old 08-13-2015, 11:29 AM   #36
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Nordic Tug 32/34:
- 270 HP Cummins.
- normal cruise at 8 knots.
- cruise all day at 12+ knots (2000-2200 rpm).
- WOT 2600 rpm top end of 18 knots.
- 10 year average of 1.5 GPH.
- 200 gallons fuel, 100 gallons water
- no flybridge, but a chariot bridge option is available.

I started to say as much but then remembered the lack of FB and aborted. But the NT32 is probably closer than most or all the others. However doubt your fuel burn of 1.5 gph. Suspect it to be much closer to two. That would be a power loading of 10% (30hp). But I've been wrong w my numbers before.

Efficiency wise the Nordic Tug is a good bet as her beam is not excessive like most all other trawlers and they have some rocker. At least I've noticed it on the 32.
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Old 08-13-2015, 11:50 AM   #37
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I'm assuming (we know what happens later) that a v-berth with an insert would be harder to maneuver in/out of at night for that late night trips to the head and that something in the salon would be easier to walk around. Sounds like that's not the case.

I'd prefer some sort of insert for the vberth just for comfort sake, but I'm basing this off of sleeping in a friends v-berth many years ago.

Maybe any guests should just sleep in the dinghy.

It's a fair assumption. Actually we found it easy to get in and out of the V-berth WITHOUT the insert. More difficult, with the insert mounted. We eventually gravitated toward using the insert... er... sometimes... and then removing it afterwards.

We eschew overnight guests as much as possible, so can't speak too much about that. OTOH, not having berth space gave us a reasonably graceful excuse.

-Chris
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Old 08-13-2015, 12:53 PM   #38
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...a better arrangement would be to sleep in the salon when just us, and use the forward berth only with guests.
I meant to say this before...sleeping in the kitchen will grow old real quick.
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Old 08-13-2015, 02:58 PM   #39
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Chris wrote;
"It's a fair assumption. Actually we found it easy to get in and out of the V-berth WITHOUT the insert. More difficult, with the insert mounted. We eventually gravitated toward using the insert... er... sometimes... and then removing it afterwards."

Couldn't have said it better and it applies to us as well.
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Old 08-13-2015, 05:59 PM   #40
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And don't automatically assume that just because the master berth is up front that it is a V-berth configuration. There are many sedan cruisers(like MS350/390) that have an island queen up front.

Check out my boat. I will get 2mpg at 8 knots. Or 1mpg or gpm at 17knots. You can find a nice ne for under $100k. It has basically everything you want except the fuel economy....which is a pipedream IMO....unless you get a cat.
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