Reply
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
 
Old 10-29-2017, 12:53 PM   #1
Senior Member
 
City: Marion, Massachusetts
Country: United States
Vessel Name: Wanderer
Vessel Model: Pilgrim 40
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 267
Travel though NY help

After many self induced delays Wanderer is off to Jacksonville from Buzzards Bay. After a really pitchy, rolling and yawing trip to Long Island Sound we are spending a few days in Mystic to wait out a storm.

Looking ahead to traveling though NY City, I think there are too many variables for a first timer without some hints.

So some information about my parameters:

Wanderer is a Pilgrim 40, not really an open water boat.

Has a displacement hull, so top speed is 7.5 knots.

I have a favorble tide coming out of the Mystic River going down the eastern end of Long Island Sound

Have to do the Race during daylight hours, and need to make the trip to Manasquan Inlet in fair weather.

The hint I have so far is to follow a tug through Hells Gate as it bumps the refrigerators out of the way and smooths the sea a little

John
__________________
Advertisement

PMF1984 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2017, 01:16 PM   #2
Dauntless Award
 
Wxx3's Avatar
 
City: New York, NY
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Dauntless
Vessel Model: Kadey Krogen 42 - 148
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 2,694
At 7+ knots you will have no problem.
Just look at the time 1 hour BEFORE the current changes at Ambrose Light, then backup the time to determine what time you MUST leave from Throg's Neck Bridge.

I did the calculations for a friend a few weeks ago. You should have an hour or even two to play with once you are in the Upper Bay. Even leaving an hour after the current has turned (You your favor).

Richard on Dauntless
__________________

__________________
Richard on Dauntless,
New York

a Kadey Krogen 42 currently: https://share.garmin.com/dauntless
Blog:
https://dauntlessatsea.com
Wxx3 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2017, 01:32 PM   #3
Guru
 
jleonard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 3,289
From Mystic going down L I sound you do NOT pass thru "the race" if you are talking the area between Fisher's Island and Long Island.
I think you should plan on stopping in Manhassett Bay for the night before going thru NYC. (I know I cannot make it thru NYC in a day, especially this time of year) They have several free town moorings (I think there are 12).
__________________
Jay Leonard
Attitude Adjustment
40 Albin
Mystic,Ct. /New Port Richey,Fl
jleonard is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2017, 01:40 PM   #4
Guru
 
caltexflanc's Avatar
 
City: North Carolina for now
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Small Incentive
Vessel Model: Boston Whaler 130 Sport
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 4,840
Having done this a few times ourselves, I will say the above are two very good pieces of advice. Manhasset is a good stop, and the moorings there are cheap or free depending (call the harbor master, it is getting late in the season).

I'd also suggest stopping in Great Kills, Staten Island or Atlantic Highlands if you have to wait for weather to Manasquan, or regardless, the extra time to go up the Hudson a bit, at least see the west side of Manhattan if nothing else (and there is no other experience like it).
__________________
George

"There's the Right Way, the Wrong Way, and what some guy says he's gotten away with"
caltexflanc is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2017, 01:41 PM   #5
Senior Member
 
City: Marion, Massachusetts
Country: United States
Vessel Name: Wanderer
Vessel Model: Pilgrim 40
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 267
Sorry about. The reference to the Race, I meant Hells Gate
PMF1984 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2017, 01:45 PM   #6
Guru
 
jleonard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 3,289
Quote:
Originally Posted by PMF1984 View Post
Sorry about. The reference to the Race, I meant Hells Gate
Ok that makes more sense. I have never purposely timed going thru Hell Gate.
Sometimes it's 2 knots of headway, but I'd rather move than sit and wait for the current.

Have a nice trip.
__________________
Jay Leonard
Attitude Adjustment
40 Albin
Mystic,Ct. /New Port Richey,Fl
jleonard is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2017, 01:52 PM   #7
Guru
 
djmarchand's Avatar
 
City: Litchfield, Ct/Punta Gorda, Fl
Country: USA
Vessel Model: Atlas Pompano 23
Join Date: Aug 2012
Posts: 4,496
Manhassett would be a good stop and you should be able to make Manasquan the next day. I did Manhassett to Barnegat easily in one day, but in summer daylight. You should be able to easily make Manasquan even now.

If the tides don't work favorably, you can just go anytime. 7 kts will make it through Hells Gate just fine. I did it against full flood in a 6.5 kt boat. You may only do 4 kts net down the East River, but it beats just waiting IMO.

David
djmarchand is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2017, 03:33 PM   #8
Guru
 
caltexflanc's Avatar
 
City: North Carolina for now
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Small Incentive
Vessel Model: Boston Whaler 130 Sport
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 4,840
[QUOTE]Manhassett would be a good stop and you should be able to make Manasquan the next day. I did Manhassett to Barnegat easily in one day, but in summer daylight. You should be able to easily make Manasquan even now.
[QUOTE]

Yeah, but why miss some incredible cruising and sight seeing?
__________________
George

"There's the Right Way, the Wrong Way, and what some guy says he's gotten away with"
caltexflanc is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2017, 05:54 PM   #9
Guru
 
Pgitug's Avatar
 
City: Punta Gorda, fl
Country: Usa
Vessel Name: Escapade
Vessel Model: Nordic Tug 37 2002
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 1,137
Leave Atlantic High Lands at first light you should be able to make Atlantic City before dark.
Pgitug is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2017, 05:54 PM   #10
Senior Member
 
City: Marion, Massachusetts
Country: United States
Vessel Name: Wanderer
Vessel Model: Pilgrim 40
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 267
So thanks all for the advice. I look to start off the hells gate trip from manhassett, I have to hit the throngs narrows bridge at 9:15 so that gives me an opportunity for a late start to make it by then
PMF1984 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2017, 06:47 PM   #11
Guru
 
caltexflanc's Avatar
 
City: North Carolina for now
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Small Incentive
Vessel Model: Boston Whaler 130 Sport
Join Date: Aug 2011
Posts: 4,840
Typical for this time of year, conditions look spotty along the Jersey coast.

https://www.wunderground.com/MAR/AN/450.html
__________________
George

"There's the Right Way, the Wrong Way, and what some guy says he's gotten away with"
caltexflanc is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2017, 07:27 PM   #12
Senior Member
 
Roger Long's Avatar
 
City: Albany, NY
Country: Albany
Vessel Name: Gypsy Star
Vessel Model: Gulf Star 43
Join Date: Jul 2015
Posts: 284
I've been through Hell Gate at maximum flow in a 32 foot sailboat. Forget about it. If it had a different name, you never would have heard of it. OTOH, make sure you have a fair current or it will be a slow and expensive run down the river.

Don't plan on taking a Pilgrim 40 into Manasquan or anywhere before Atlantic City with what sounds like your level of experience, please. Wait at Atlantic Highlands or a great little spot just behind the western end of Coney Island for a westerly wind and run right through to Atlantic City just off the dotted line indicating fish trap areas (about three miles out).
__________________
Roger and Patsy
"Gypsy Star" Where are we?
https://share.findmespot.com/shared/...BunICxVztYVRlg
Roger Long is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2017, 07:44 PM   #13
Guru
 
hmason's Avatar
 
City: Stuart FL
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Magic
Vessel Model: Grand Banks 46 Europa
Join Date: Aug 2013
Posts: 2,217
Having made this trip many times with two weeks ago being the most recent I can give you a good rule of thumb.
1. Enter at Throgs Neck at time of "Slack Water-Ebb Begins" at Hell Gate for a fair current all the way down the East River.

2. Entering at Throgs Neck at 1 hour and 45 minutes after high water at the Battery will give you the same result.

When I did this trip in a 36' boat I had no problem entering Manasquan Inlet. My current boat cruises at 10 - 11 kts and so I run straight to Atlantic City. You might find that run a bit long for you with daylight being short now.
__________________
Howard
Magic, 1996 Grand Banks Europa
Westport, CT and Stuart, FL
hmason is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2017, 07:44 PM   #14
Senior Member
 
City: Marion, Massachusetts
Country: United States
Vessel Name: Wanderer
Vessel Model: Pilgrim 40
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 267
Quote:
Originally Posted by caltexflanc View Post
Typical for this time of year, conditions look spotty along the Jersey coast.

https://www.wunderground.com/MAR/AN/450.html


Looking like Wednesday before I can get out of mystic. When I get to Sandy Hook time and sea conditions will determine if I press on to Manasquan.

( Right now in a stinky blow tied up just north of RR bridge in Mystic. Very well protected - no sea at all - but every time a train comes by it is unnerving as the first sound is the same as an oncoming bust from hell)

John
PMF1984 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-29-2017, 08:29 PM   #15
Senior Member
 
City: Marion, Massachusetts
Country: United States
Vessel Name: Wanderer
Vessel Model: Pilgrim 40
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 267
[QUOTE=

Don't plan on taking a Pilgrim 40 into Manasquan or anywhere before Atlantic City with what sounds like your level of experience, please. Wait at Atlantic Highlands or a great little spot just behind the western end of Coney Island for a westerly wind and run right through to Atlantic City just off the dotted line indicating fish trap areas (about three miles out).[/QUOTE]



Well I've been reading that the NJ ICW section is very shallow, I draw just under 4 feet, so I was thinking picking either a day of mid-tide or higher, or outside friendly weather whatever came first.

As for the Manasquan inlet entrance I would think its not friendly if the tide is going out and the wind is southeast.

I seem to remember some issue though ( this year?) about shoaling and the ACOE handed it over to the locals.

And just to let you know, I do have in front of me a "Cruise Guide no. 3, New York Harbor to Cape Henry, VA." It was published by Phillips Petroleum in 1971. It's very handy, as it tells me where the Phillips 66 stations are (well to be truthful - were).

I keep this as a reminder of the first shipwreck I witnessed when I was 20 years old. An Egg Harbor went up on Sow and Pigs reef off of Cuttyhunk Island. The reef was not on his map - an Esso version of my Phillips map. (I think I have his water tank in my garage somewhere.)

So I try to over prepare a little and get too much information, and sometimes it does become TMI. So it's best to quash my male qualities sometimes and ask for directions.

John
PMF1984 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2017, 06:52 AM   #16
Guru
 
psneeld's Avatar
 
City: ACIW
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Freedom
Vessel Model: Albin 40
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 18,971
The NJ intracoastal is shallow but certainly an option for under 4 foot draft boats.

Travel on anything but the last 2 of a falling and first 2 of a rising tide. Go slow in areas where you are not sure where shallows are lurking.

I have never seen "fish traps" along the Jersey coast, other than a few pot buoys, but not even close to the density found elsewhere. Just look for lines of them and run parallel to most.

So even if there is a stiff Westerly or Northwesterly wind, you can hug the coast just offshore the shoal areas and be fine. Even when the forecast is calling for 5 footers, the waves within a couple miles of the beach are 2 or less and smaller if closer. Those are wind waves, if swell is forecast, different but not necessarily a show stopper. The swell can make inlets dangerous if big enough and an outgoing tide.
psneeld is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2017, 07:10 AM   #17
Senior Member
 
City: Marion, Massachusetts
Country: United States
Vessel Name: Wanderer
Vessel Model: Pilgrim 40
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 267
Quote:
Originally Posted by psneeld View Post
The NJ intracoastal is shallow but certainly an option for under 4 foot draft boats.

Travel on anything but the last 2 of a falling and first 2 of a rising tide. Go slow in areas where you are not sure where shallows are lurking.

I have never seen "fish traps" along the Jersey coast, other than a few pot buoys, but not even close to the density found elsewhere. Just look for lines of them and run parallel to most.

So even if there is a stiff Westerly or Northwesterly wind, you can hug the coast just offshore the shoal areas and be fine. Even when the forecast is calling for 5 footers, the waves within a couple miles of the beach are 2 or less and smaller if closer. Those are wind waves, if swell is forecast, different but not necessarily a show stopper. The swell can make inlets dangerous if big enough and an outgoing tide.


Thanks for the input. (Last night was one of those nights where the cost of an overpriced marina is worth every cent. If one is concerned about the wind increase, change in direction, you simply step on the dock- and add another line. Easy peasy.

John
PMF1984 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2017, 07:12 AM   #18
Guru
 
jleonard's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 3,289
Quote:
Originally Posted by PMF1984 View Post
( Right now in a stinky blow tied up just north of RR bridge in Mystic. Very well protected - no sea at all - but every time a train comes by it is unnerving as the first sound is the same as an oncoming bust from hell)

John
LOL Yes that is very close to the tracks.
My summer slip just on the opposite side of the tracks at Gwenmor. I barely hear the train any more after 25 years.
Good luck on your trip.
__________________
Jay Leonard
Attitude Adjustment
40 Albin
Mystic,Ct. /New Port Richey,Fl
jleonard is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2017, 07:27 AM   #19
Senior Member
 
City: Marion, Massachusetts
Country: United States
Vessel Name: Wanderer
Vessel Model: Pilgrim 40
Join Date: Sep 2016
Posts: 267
Quote:
Originally Posted by jleonard View Post
LOL Yes that is very close to the tracks.

My summer slip just on the opposite side of the tracks at Gwenmor. I barely hear the train any more after 25 years.

Good luck on your trip.


No trains now as the New Haven/Boston line has been closed due to storm damage

Good day to walk around town
PMF1984 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-30-2017, 03:04 PM   #20
Veteran Member
 
captain465's Avatar
 
City: FORT LAUDERDALE,FL
Country: USA
Vessel Name: MERIDIAN^2 (squared)
Vessel Model: 1984 Pilgrim 40
Join Date: Jan 2016
Posts: 55
PMF1984,
I just want to jump in here and say Howdy to a fellow Pilgrim 40 owner.
I purchased hull #13 last November (I bought a Pilgrim on Thanksgiving!).
Ex THIN BLUE LINE, now MERIDIAN^2 (squared).
Hopefully will get to meeet you in the near future. We plan on starting the Great Loop next April.

Fred and Becky
__________________

captain465 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 05:33 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012