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Old 09-20-2010, 10:19 PM   #21
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RE: Total rookie

Anyone have an opinion on Sundowner tugs, like this one?

http://www.yachtworld.com/core/listi..._id=56609&url=

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Old 09-21-2010, 05:05 AM   #22
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RE: Total rookie

"Anyone have an opinion on Sundowner tugs, like this one?"

We love ours.
The one you listed on Yachtworld appears to be a nice original boat. It has had the teak decks removed (they did make a few w/o). That's a BIG plus. It won't go 12 knots. Maybe 7 1/2.
Check out my photo album of our SD30.
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Old 09-21-2010, 05:41 AM   #23
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RE: Total rookie

Pineapple Girl and Keith are dead on. Tugs do have a tendency to be small for the same length of other boats. For some reason, the Sundowner 30 seems bigger than Nordic 32...maybe it is the seperation of space...or the beam.

Anyway, I highly caution you about buying a boat because it is charming. Of course it needs to have a little curb appeal...I mean after all, you do want to proud of the money you spent. But "charming" is an emotion and when you buy on emotion you are potentially setting yourself up for shortfalls in the "practicality" department.

I have always loved the Tugs but to get the amount of Space that, for example, Pineapple Girl has in her boat, you would need at least a Nordic 42. I am not saying this is good/bad/indifferent....but just a warning. If it is just you and your SO and that is pretty much all that will be on the boat, then I understand. But if you have visions of entertaining, a Tug is not the way to go unless it is bigger. There just isn't that much outside useable space.

I have nothing against the Tugs and am more of a fan of the Sundowners than I am the Nordics simply from a value standpoint.

Just a warning. There are lot of emotions flying around when you buy a boat. Just try to keep them under control and choose the boat based on the right reasons....much the same way you would choose a partner to spend the rest of your life with. The emotion WILL settle down and then there you are............
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Old 09-21-2010, 07:03 AM   #24
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RE: Total rookie

Correct John! I'm 6'4" 225# and that's a big consideration in a boat. The Sundowner30 accommodates my size much better that the Nordic 32 or even some of*the larger ones. The almost 12' beam is the ticket. It also has the head room and the V-birth*is more than adequate.*Transporting is another plus for the SD30. We trucked Scout home on a hydraulic* trailer. No escort required and 12'6" overall height with the mast down. Overwidth permit only.
After a lifetime of*owning and maintaining boats I'm a member of the 'smallest I can be*comfortable on' club. Our*boat should 'drink 6, feed 4 and sleep 2'. The SD30 is perfect.*
We have no plans to sell out and move on to the boat but rather have a boat with all the amenities to do the loop and river/coastal cruising etc. Month or so on the boat with time at home.
We've also stripped the SD30 of the teak decks and most of the gingerbread teak trim that Taiwanese boats are famous for. Gone is the 'charming' faux stack and mast, replaced with a ss radar arch on the pilot house. While this is blasphemy to many tug owners, I'm going for a minimal maintenance 'utility' look.
The more time we spend working/rebuilding Scout the more we love the boat. It has taken on a personality of its' own, as boats do.
Emotions evolve into realities and realities evolve into challenges.
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Old 09-21-2010, 08:44 AM   #25
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RE: Total rookie

Quote:
Marin wrote:

It's like flying.* Over the course of the last almost 40 years I've spent tens of thousands of dollars on flying. I never bothered to keep track of any of it and I could care less what the total is.* To fly a de Havilland Beaver on floats up and down the Inside Passage more times than we can remember with my wife and experience the things we experienced was worth whatever money we spent doing it.

In my opinion, you have to approach boating the same way

-- Edited by Marin on Sunday 19th of September 2010 01:49:59 PM
What do the airplane pilots call it?* a $100 hamburger?* Boating is the same way, take the boat up to another marina or someplace and eat lunch and if you add up the fuel and other costs you ended up with a very expensive lunch.* But it was worth it!



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Old 09-21-2010, 09:09 AM   #26
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RE: Total rookie

Quote:
Anode wrote:

"After a lifetime of*owning and maintaining boats I'm a member of the 'smallest I can be*comfortable on' club. Our*boat should 'drink 6, feed 4 and sleep 2'. The SD30 is perfect."

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My philosophy exactly! I'm sure not knocking the folks that have big boats but over the years and 8 boats later, my views on boats and having fun on the water have definitely changed. Of course the phrase "the smallest I can be comfortable on" is a relative one. Some people cannot be comfortable on a small boat , no matter how many amenities it has.
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Old 09-21-2010, 11:35 PM   #27
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RE: Total rookie

About 15 yrs ago my brother in law had one, blue trim, teak decks. Lovely boat and he kept it really nice.
He repowered from the 50HP Pathfinder to a 100HP Yanmar. Boat ran reliabley at 8knots, with the 100. 12 K would have been flat out, not cruise.

Getting in and out of the engine compartment was doable, he's 6'3" and about 190#, but tight.

He added a bunch of stuff, inverter, buss heater, A/P. and other bits I don't remember now.

One thing to watch is the mounting of the steer cylinder. It was attached to a flat plate mounted to 4 only 1/2" diam. rods. Pretty cheesy and they were bending with the A/P working. It was easy to brace but just poor.

Can't remember much more now.
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Old 09-26-2010, 02:02 PM   #28
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RE: Total rookie

What does everybody think of the Ranger Tugs? Too small to be comfy?** (They have scored very high on the "charm" factor).* How about the older Nordic 26s?
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Old 09-26-2010, 05:58 PM   #29
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RE: Total rookie

I don't have a Ranger Tug, but know a bunch of people that do have them.* There are several advantages to buying one if you're a rookie.* They have an incredibly active owners group that will give you all kinds of support.* Here in the NW they have rendezvous that have included more than 50 boats.* They also have the most responsive factory team that I've every seen, that takes input from the owners.* The boats that I have been on (25, 27 and 29) have great fit and finish and some clever design features.*

They are selling a lot of new boats and developing a fanatic owner's group because of the design and build, after market support and active owners.* The downside to them that a 29 new will be over $240,000 and it is still a small boat.* A very nice boat, but in my opinion too small to cruise with more than one couple.* In this market, you can buy a lot of boat used for $240,000+.
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Old 09-26-2010, 09:47 PM   #30
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RE: Total rookie

We are starting to get into "what do you want"???? I personally think the Ranger tugs offer great value....very neat boats....BUT...their primary purpose is trailerablity!!! ANd because of that, you forfeit a good amount of beam(8'6") so the the boat can be trailered. Are you looking for a trailerable boat? If not, you can likely get more boat with more beam. Their stated prices may likely include the trailer. So you might be paying for a trailer that you may not use and sacrafice beam for no reason.....just a thought. Other than that, I think they are really cool boats and offer an exceptional option if you are willing to tow the boat to non-native waters.
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Old 09-26-2010, 10:06 PM   #31
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RE: Total rookie

Quote:
JC wrote:

What does everybody think of the Ranger Tugs? Too small to be comfy?** (They have scored very high on the "charm" factor).* How about the older Nordic 26s?
They are nice little boats if trailering is a must. Otherwise, you can buy a lot more boat for less money in the used market.*

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Old 09-26-2010, 11:06 PM   #32
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RE: Total rookie

Another smaller trailerable boat that one could buy and use for a year or two and sell w little loss would be the McGreggor 26 motor sailer. They employ a 50 hp outboard and cruise at 14 knots or so. They seem to make a good family boat. Could be a very user friendly boat but like most sail boats they have an open cockpit aft so would be wet in the rain. But when I think how easy it would be to manage it looks good.
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Old 09-27-2010, 03:49 AM   #33
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RE: Total rookie

Start by reading as much of this website ,

www.yachtsurvey.com/

as you can.

Probably your first boat wont be a "trawler".

No problem , get a boat with a low "Round Trip" cost (what you purchase it for --- what you sell it for)

This will get your feet wet , anmdd let you decide what portion of the boating hobby you enjoy.

Is it the vessel, or the destination ? an ongoing question.

Enjoy,.
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Old 09-27-2010, 08:06 AM   #34
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RE: Total rookie

During my visits to the last three boat shows in San Diego, I found myself onboard the various models of Ranger Tugs. Impressive little boats but the operative word is LITTLE.
Though these boats have a nifty list of "extras", they are quite small for anything other than a day outing. Like others have eluded to, if your main concern is trailering, then these just might be the ticket although the price of going new is quite high.
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Old 09-27-2010, 08:10 AM   #35
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RE: Total rookie

My choice for a 26' seaworthy vessel is not the "trawler" wannabees. It is something along the lines of a C Dory that can get up and move while still getting 2 mpg. Lots to choose from out there.*This summer I spent time on a 30' twin diesel I/O*Osprey and it was really something. It could fish six, sleep two for ever in style and got an honest 1.75 mpg at a 75% cruise at 25 knots. It easily can be hauled*on interstates with a 2500 series pickup. These types of boats are made for the PNW waters and climate.
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Old 09-27-2010, 10:36 AM   #36
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RE: Total rookie

Walt,The ranger 29 is 10' wide. But it's light. Enough throttle will bare all of it's stem and a bit of her keel. I won't call it a trawler but Passage Maker magazine did. I agree w Fred * ...good round trip cost.
Tom,
What makes you think the Osprey is more seaworthy than the average boat? They are popular and good boats (I hear) and frequently charter boats but I don't see anything special about them. The efficiency will only prevail in fairly flat water. Three foot seas and the pounding and fuel sucking begins. The Sea Dory is somewhat popular here and I don't understand it. Why would anyone want to go any distance in a place like Clarence Strait
w such a light and flat bottomed boat * * .....but they do. You can buy three 26' Bayliners instead and that's a lot more seaworthy and comfortable boat (if without FB). I think they sell because ther'e good looking. I love the cabin lines.
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Old 09-27-2010, 12:51 PM   #37
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RE: Total rookie

If I were going C-dory....I would go Tomcat!!!!
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Old 09-27-2010, 12:58 PM   #38
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Total rookie

While not trailer-able, the Nordic 32 or 37 could be good choices for the semi-protected waters (often subject to*strong winds, high chop, and*fast tides)*of the San Francisco Bay and Delta area.* There are a lot of shallow areas, so it is wise to have a keel fully protecting the propeller and shaft.**Nordics have engines three-times*more powerful*than necessary for a trawler, but*are capable of*higher-than-trawler speeds*if you don't mind large fuel bills*when/if operating at higher RPMs.* There is an active, supportive*Nordic Tug group in the area if you want some comradeship.* That could be a big plus for you.* San Francisco Bay Area Nordic Tug Association:

http://www.sfbanta.org/

In my recent search for a trawler for use in the Bay Area, I seriously considered Nordic Tugs; however, there were some desired features I wanted, such as a 360-degree deck, the Nordics didn't provide.* Still, that doesn't mean they wouldn't be right for you.


-- Edited by markpierce on Monday 27th of September 2010 01:49:50 PM

-- Edited by markpierce on Monday 27th of September 2010 03:36:15 PM

-- Edited by markpierce on Monday 27th of September 2010 03:39:06 PM
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Old 09-27-2010, 02:30 PM   #39
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RE: Total rookie

OK, here is where we are:

1. I am enrolling in a Power Station class (thanks, Eric).
2. Boat show was fun, but small.* It did highlight the appeal of a tug.
3. Trailing is NOT a big concern...in fact no concern at all.
4. The tugs do seem expensive...is this just supply/demand, or is something else going on?* Have the prices fallen less for tugs than for trawlers in general, or are there just fewer tugs around?* Tugs in general seem more "loaded" with extras than the other trawlers, but that could be my imagination.
5. Tugs appeal because of the "charm" factor, and the fact that (to parphrase a poster) we really only want a boat big enough to entertain 8, feed 4-6, and/or sleep 2.* One berth seems plenty.
6. How big of a deal is it to ship a boat from out of the area?* I see quotes around $1500 from socal up to the Bay area, and $5k to ship from the east coast.* Bad idea?
7. Probably going to try and visit a Ranger and a Nordic dealer next weekend and see if we can bum a ride, even tho the new ones are very pricey.

JC
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Old 09-27-2010, 02:41 PM   #40
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RE: Total rookie

Quote:
JC wrote:

5.*... we really only want a boat big enough to entertain 8, feed 4-6, and/or sleep 2.* One berth seems plenty.

That was the philosophy of George Buehler who designed my under-construction 35x13-foot trawler.* Quoting George: "Oddly, the RV industry figured out years ago that most rigs are used by a couple, a fact that the boating industry still hasnt caught on to. Rather than emphasize multiple sleeping quarters and bathrooms, practically all RVs, from 22' 5th wheels to monster half-million dollar diesel pusher motorhomes, will have just one bathroom, big enough for a westerner to use, a kitchen big enough to actually cook in, one comfortable bed for the owners, and a couch that converts to a guest bed. The typical RV is designed to be comfortable for the owners! COOT follows this philosophy to the letter."
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