Thoughts on leasing out my trawler for Loopers

[Slo-Mocean]

How about looking at it along the lines of renting a $350k house ----- say $3500/mo; plus $10 per hour for each engine (WAG). Just like renting a house, renter is responsible for everything above normal wear and tear, though would have to really define what wear/tear includes.

This really isn't too complicated. All sorts of heavy equipment and complex stuff is leased all the time. It's just a matter of money.

Peter

We have a condo in Naples of that approximate value that annuals in our development our renting in that $32-3600 range, and a few on monthlys at $6000 , you can't get a room at a motel 6 for $200 a night in Naples.

Apples to oranges though as the boat is a depreciating asset and far more exposed to liability, damage and wear and tear.

 

[Mako]

I appreciate your input but I don't see any advantage to having non boaters who have no idea, using my boat as a Party Pad for $150 a night, the liability alone gives me the heebie jeebies. I currently dock it in front of a home that Air bnbs. I see the clientele.

The point is that as a floating hotel room, your boat won’t move. If you bareboat charter yours for a year the damage will be great and alot of it unseen especially to your engines.

BTW my brothers and I AirBnB’d a piece of crap Hatteras 40 in Key West for $800+ nightly. We were required to shower in the marina facilities and no cooking onboard.

If you really want to charter out your boat then give it to a professional company which will add it to their fleet.

 

[Action]

If you really want to charter out your boat then give it to a professional company which will add it to their fleet.

I think this is the best solution.
A company will know how to care for it and will be on it before and after uses to know what has been damaged. And how to cure the damage.
Insurance has got to be available.
As to depreciation, it will depreciate if you are using it or if it is in service. If it is in service the depreciation is a cost against income in the US.

 

[sunchaser]

How about listing it for sale on TF? A bunch of pictures, equipment list, boat's history, recent repairs, hurricane issues, and upgrades etc. Just curious, why were engines changed/rebuilt?

The Great Harbour Trawler Association may be a good place to list too.

 

[Portage_Bay]

I would not even consider doing it.

For me to bare boat charter my private boat? Especially for a major cruise like the loop. It would have to be a boat I am not emotionally invested in on any level. It won't be the boat I fell in love with when it comes back into my hands. If I decided to follow that path it would only be through an established charter company with a well written contract that clearly establishes liabilities and responsibilities. I wouldn't consider it without the help of a good charter company.

To handle the charter on my own I'd ask myself these questions: Can I afford to handle routine repairs and mechanical failures far from my home port? It will happen, it's a boat. Worst case could I afford to walk away following major damage after insurance pay out? And the truly worrisome. Liability. Considering the litigious nature of this country can I accept that potentially disastrous personal and financial risk?

Regarding the rate. To attract me as a customer the total cost minus consumables and fuel would have to be less than the cost of ownership. I would expect you to cover every maintenance and mechanical issue, anywhere, anytime. Why would you bare boat your boat to me when only I would benefit from the arrangement?

I just can't see the upside in this for you.

If I owned a boat I really wanted to keep but could not use for a long period such as a year I'd lay it up. I don't know what Florida dry storage costs are but here in Washington State it would run something like this for a 37 ft boat.

$4,800 annual storage. Could be done for less with some homework.
$800 round trip haul including pressure was the bottom and launch.
$2,000 wild guess for a proper lay up and re-commission
$7,600 first pass guess. Just a place to start thinking about it.

$??? insurance. I'd look into coverage for storage only, or port risk

 

[denverd0n]

I would first off have to qualify the individuals over the course of a couple days...

See, that's a problem, too. Someone who does not live in your immediate area is not going to be too thrilled about closing up their house, getting all their affairs in order, and traveling to where you are -- all with the intent of living on a boat for the next several months -- but with all of that hanging on the hope that you will ultimately consider them qualified.


Frankly, I would not go for that deal.

 

[Slo-Mocean]

The point is that as a floating hotel room, your boat won’t move. If you bareboat charter yours for a year the damage will be great and alot of it unseen especially to your engines.

BTW my brothers and I AirBnB’d a piece of crap Hatteras 40 in Key West for $800+ nightly. We were required to shower in the marina facilities and no cooking onboard.

If you really want to charter out your boat then give it to a professional company which will add it to their fleet.

Ever since the hurricane down here in SW Florida dock space is non existent, I’m lucky I have the dock I am at but it is too exposed and dire need of replacement.

Many of the marinas will not be rebuilt and I highly doubt any properly managed marina will allow ABNB .

 

[Slo-Mocean]

The former owners were friends of mine that had moved ashore after many years of living aboard and decided they wanted to live on a boat again .

They decided on a GH37 and started on their quest looking for one being there is only 19 of them built . They found mine that was on its second owner but had layed dormant in the water for 4 years because the husband had passed

On their maiden voyage taking the boat from the keys to Fort Myers one of the 4600 hour yanmars lost a piston .

After tear down it was decided the best route would be 2 brand new engines and gears that took almost 2 years to acquire because of Covid.

In the meantime they replaced and updated many systems on the boat in anticipation of going full time cruising on it.

 

[Slo-Mocean]

There is only one yard 35 miles up the Caloosahatchee that I would feel the boat would be safe during a hurricane ,but they are all booked up for storage and it is a swamp during the summer and no access to your vessel permitted for personal inspection. Mold runs rampant in boats stored down here.

I found a marina in upper Mississippi that I will be storing it at in the water if I choose not to charter it out or sell it.

 

[Fleming]

There is only one yard 35 miles up the Caloosahatchee that I would feel the boat would be safe during a hurricane ,but they are all booked up for storage and it is a swamp during the summer and no access to your vessel permitted for personal inspection. Mold runs rampant in boats stored down here.

I found a marina in upper Mississippi that I will be storing it at in the water if I choose not to charter it out or sell it.

I would also give consideration to Indiantown Marine Center. Two travel lifts, professional staff, brand new facility, lots of yard space and in-water slips, freshwater and between locks so no storm surge.

 

[Slo-Mocean]

I would also give consideration to Indiantown Marine Center. Two travel lifts, professional staff, brand new facility, lots of yard space and in-water slips, freshwater and between locks so no storm surge.

Thanks I just remembered idiantown also , I’ll have to do some checking. The marina up in northern Mississippi sounds inviting as I can put it in a covered slip for cheaper than dry storing it in Florida and my insurance should be a little happier.

I have a sailboat that fell off the stands along with my buddies 42 Grand Banks at a storage facility in Rotunda as well as my semi trailer rolling over in Arcadia.

This last hurricane got my attention after 40 years in Sw Florida.

 

[BDofMSP]

Aside from your location, I'm a great candidate for your opportunity. I love boating in the Great Lakes, and plan to do so for many years. BUT, when I retire (next couple years) I really want to take 8 months or so cruising between Washington and Alaska. I can't get my boat there for any reasonable money, and frankly it's not the right boat.
Charter fees for that duration are simply not tenable. I'm to the point that I'm seriously considering buying another boat for the trip and selling it a year later, but that's fraught with problems (and investmen) too.

I'm not going to run anything "to the pins" or put ANY use on it that I wouldn't put on my own boat. Because I'll be out in the middle of nowhere and I NEED that boat to be rock solid and properly maintained. I'll be more interested in the preparation and maintenance on the boat you did BEFORE I get it. Am I guaranteeing that I won't bump a dock, or hit a log, or any of the things that we all accept as risks when we cruise? No. But I can be insured (like most of us are) and agree to reasonable terms for "normal wear and tear".

The problem is, how do you know you're finding someone like me, and not someone who's gonna "drive it like a rental"? In FL the situation is much different. You are never far from just swimming to shore and leaving the whole mess behind you.

I wish this was more common, but I fear I'll be buying another boat for this adventure. The difference is that in buying a boat, I'm taking on something that someone is TRYING to get rid of. In your case, it's something someone is trying to keep. Big difference.

Good luck to you!
BD

 

[Jeff F]

The marina up in northern Mississippi sounds inviting as I can put it in a covered slip for cheaper than dry storing it in Florida and my insurance should be a little happier.

Yep. There are several good facilities in Iuka. My boat is in TN now and i was chatting recently with someone who had moved home marinas and his rates went up because it's in MS instead of TN. It's all relative I guess... not much danger from hurricanes but tornados can cause massive local destruction. And covered slips can be fire traps.

I guess I'm in the minority here, but my view is that if you're not using the boat it may as well be used by someone else. And there are a few very experienced boaters scattered out there that would jump at the opportunity to loop on that boat. They may even have existing yacht policies that could be extended to cover their use of your boat. So stay flexible, maybe use a broker if there's one you trust. It shouldn't be impossible.

 

[ssobol]

You have to consider what happens if the renters get half 'round the loop, run the boat aground, say "screw it" and go home. You may not find out about it for some time after it happens.

Rental car companies have to deal with cars that are abandoned or "go missing" on a regular basis.

 

[MacPhid]

I guess I'm with Jeff, in the minority here. Transport Trucks, homes, cars are leased all the time. I don't see leasing a boat as being more risky than anything else. Sure, disaster could strike anyone, leased or not, but is not normal. Install a NEBO tracker on the boat and for $10.00 a month monitor its location and journeys and receive a log of each leg. You could bill hours accordingly.

James

 

[Action]

Or Apple air tag

 

[Forever Friday]

A lot of naysayers out there…some maybe based on experience, others on speculation. Personally, if it’s a boat you haven’t gotten real attached to yet, I’d say give it a go! First consideration-as others have pointed out-would be to contact your insurance company & feel them out. If it’s a go ahead, you may want to consider forming an LLC for tax purposes. Also, join up with AGLCA (American Great Loop Cruising Association)…wealth of information & possibly a great resource for would be leases. We did the loop in 2018/19 and found there are so many people who did the loop as a “check off” on their bucket list. So many boats out there were multiple loopers, with new owners each time. Good luck!
Mike Kelley
Feisty Lady
Nordhavn 47
Bellingham, WA
Formerly “Forever Friday “
2008 American Tug 34

 

[HuffinandPuffin]

Sell, buy back?

How about if you sell the boat for, say, 350k with an agreement to buy it back in a year for 275 or 300k if it is in good condition as spelled out in detail in the agreement. ??

 

[TomandMary]

Food for thought. This is not about leasing or renting a vessel. We sold our vessel to a couple who were new to cruising. We offered phone call support for a limited time. Within 4 months they were asking us if we wanted to buy back. We agreed because we love our vessel and sold just because we moved to an area that had no slip for her. We went to pick her up and she was trashed by the new owners. We definitely bought her back because no vessel should be treated this way. We are doing a complete refit and have found a berth for her near us now that we know the area.

What I am trying to imply is that No One will treat your vessel with the same respect as you.

 

[sunchaser]

SM

Five years ago we were at the docks in Petersburg and a Bayliner 48 pulled in next to us. In chatting with the owner they had just purchased the boat in Anacortes to do a one season trip from Seattle to SE Alaska and return. He said the charter costs for a "similar" vessel were about $7K per week and over 16 weeks he figured it was cheaper to buy than to charter. There is a huge demand for nice Bayliners in the PNW of this model thus his risk was low in regards to losing money.

When you look at boats for sale many 2-4 year old boats are out there that the owners did exactly that - bought, cruised and sold a nearly new boat. We nearly did the same when contemplating a transpacific.

My point? Many smart shoppers find buying a better option than a long term charter. Thus either sell the boat, along the lines suggested in # 47, or maintain it as a hobby until you're ready to seriously cruise.

 

[SteveK]

But what about curb depreciation? I cannot see how a brand new boat can be resold at a lower than charter cost from original when you factor in sales tax for a 16 week cruise.

 

[Eli27]

Hi all newbie on the board .

I have an idea of possibly doing an annual lease on my recently purchased 2004 GH-37 to experienced individuals instead of selling it and would appreciate some feedback on the pro and the cons .

Vessel is located in SW Florida for a perfect start to do the loop and by April 1st will be out of the yard after getting some cosmetic damage repaired and new hull paint and another coat over the year old bottom job.

I think this would allow an individual to cast off with minimal worries without the time ,expense and hassles of getting a recently purchased used vessel ready to cruise .

Vessel has 2 brand new Yanmars and gears with just 50 hours on them and all new running gear components along with a bilge rerig by Diversified Yachts.
All brand new electronics and auto pilot along with rebuilt windlass on newly replaced pulpit.

Upholstery and flooring is all brand new with a brand new full size Whirlpool frig/freezer with icemaker in the door along with brand new micro/convection oven and indirect flattop range.

Recent queen size Tempurpedic mattress and washer and dryer.

Brand new electric head and shower sump with new hoses and macerator .3 New Battle Born lithium house batteries and new 3000watt inverter. Three marinair units fully serviced along with a 9kw Mase generator with less than 3 thousand hours on the 3 cylinder Yanmar.

That about wraps it all up ,not much else to mention other than the watermaker that is pickled and would need to be discussed about the use feasability.

What do you guys think about it ? Any ideas of the lease value ? I have a figure in my head .

I only read a few of the responses and they all seemed fairly negative to the idea. I would agree to them for the most part BUT,,,,

Here is how I'm looking at it. You're not renting the boat to a hundred different people. You're looking for 1 maybe 2 leases. The idea here is to find the right people for it. Obviously they will be a bit on the upper class with some money to burn.

As I say money to burn, it would actually be cheaper in the long run for them to try the lease out and see if they like it. Then they can buy there own.

I would think,,,, correct if me I'm wrong, but the insurance should be paid for by the leasee. And depending on how pricey it is you can always modify your terms.

Personally, I think it's a great idea! Especially with the condition of the boat. The big thing is hoping whoever leases it will adhere to the maintenance 100%. Again another issue that needs to be looked into. If it's just standard fluid changes,,,, maybe you supply the product and they supply the labor. Again, many things to consider but I believe they are definitely calculatable for everyone to make out in the end.

Good luck

 

[jdemere]

Try a bareboat charter as done with deep sea vessels. Agreement allows charterer to in essence lease boat with owner being the named assured. All expenses are for charterers account with ownership reverting to bareboat owner at end of contract. Boat must be redelivered to owner after survey in same condition with repair cost for charterers account secured by a deposit.
Google “bareboat charter party” for details.