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Old 12-13-2016, 10:32 PM   #1
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Thinking About Better Offshore Motorboats

This is a blog I follow. Its written by a sailor, who like me is thinking about the longer term benefits of a power boat. Perhaps of interest to others here:

Thinking About Better Offshore Motorboats

https://www.morganscloud.com/2016/12...re-motorboats/
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Old 12-14-2016, 12:11 AM   #2
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Who would have thought it?
It`s about Artnautica.
Again.
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Old 12-14-2016, 09:29 AM   #3
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Yes, everyone would like to have a cheap FPB. Even the used ones are not cheap.

The blogger could satisfy his goals by buying a used acceptable 60 foot sailing vessel, install much bigger tanks, furl the sails and go after it. Of course 10 knots may be a bit of a reach.

Or buy a very nice Nordhavn and go slow.
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Old 12-18-2016, 01:51 PM   #4
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Different people different approaches to the same issue. Having spent over 50 of my 78 years dealing with both sail and power( always both together) I really have trouble understanding people who wish to cross oceans in pure power craft when a combined approach has so many advantages. The argument that sail management while under way is a problem for some has almost been completely negated by technical advances in this department. The multihull option has changed the concept of living in a cave to some extent. Since many ocean crossing power craft must go slow to deal with fuel capacity issues a motor sailor or relatively fast mono or multi hull sail craft can be faster and have the full time stabilization of sail. I do get it that some people just cant relate to sail that aside why not a sail power combo?
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Old 12-18-2016, 03:25 PM   #5
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There are some very nice center cockpit sail boats that would make fairly comfortable passage makers. Maybe not as warm and cozy as a typical trawler PH, but certainly better than the typical aft, open cockpit in most sailboats. Some of these are Yawls with some decent sail options for a variety of conditions.
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Old 12-18-2016, 03:25 PM   #6
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Something like "BURMA"? Modernized.
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Old 12-18-2016, 03:31 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by eyschulman View Post
Different people different approaches to the same issue. Having spent over 50 of my 78 years dealing with both sail and power( always both together) I really have trouble understanding people who wish to cross oceans in pure power craft when a combined approach has so many advantages. The argument that sail management while under way is a problem for some has almost been completely negated by technical advances in this department. The multihull option has changed the concept of living in a cave to some extent. Since many ocean crossing power craft must go slow to deal with fuel capacity issues a motor sailor or relatively fast mono or multi hull sail craft can be faster and have the full time stabilization of sail. I do get it that some people just cant relate to sail that aside why not a sail power combo?


Having a motorsailer, I get criticism from the "purists" on both sides who have never experienced a motorsailer.

The beauty of motorsailing is how the motor and sails work together and complement each other to increase efficiency, comfort and safety. It is nice to have a choice of motor, sail, or motorsail for propulsion depending on conditions, direction or preference.
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Old 12-18-2016, 03:57 PM   #8
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. The beauty of motorsailing is how the motor and sails work together and complement each other to increase efficiency, comfort and safety. It is nice to have a choice of motor, sail, or motorsail for propulsion depending on conditions, direction or preference.
We lived and cruised on a sailboat for 10 years. We put over 3500 hours on the engine. We sold the sailboat and bought Hobo when we decided we weren't crossing oceans anymore. Since we went over to the dark side, I've sometimes missed the quiet, back up power source and vertical stabilizer.
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Old 12-18-2016, 06:56 PM   #9
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Something like "BURMA"? Modernized.

If I was going to do world cruising, I would try to find something like this
http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1993...s#.WFcvT7Q76hA
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Old 12-18-2016, 07:19 PM   #10
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I like the idea of a motorsailer. Sadly, they remind me of an IO (inboard outboard). Instead of taking the best of both, they seem to be a compromise of the less desirable features of both.

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Old 12-18-2016, 07:24 PM   #11
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It's all about intended purpose and the owner/buyer's priorities. Where the priorities are heavily focused on a boat's off-shore passage making characteristics, one pretty quickly arrives at a Dashew boat or whatever the boat is that's being promoted in this thread. Here's the Morgan's Cloud list of priorities:

  • Able to cruise offshore at 8 knots or better with a top cruise speed of 10 knots.
  • Fuel efficient at that speed—two to four times better than trawlers currently available.
  • As safe offshore as a well-found sailboat.
It's only about passage making. That's why there are what, a dozen such boats in existence?

For most people buying long range cruising boats, including boats intended to cross oceans, the passage making portion of the boat's use is very, very small. Even the hardest core, round the world cruisers spend only a small fraction of their boat time doing off-shore passages. As a result, it's off-shore performance is only one of many important criteria for the boat.

Most of us moving from sail boats to power boats want to shed more of the characteristics of a sail boat, not just the sails themselves. We want more space, more amenities, rooms with a view, comfort while cruising, easy launching of a tender, etc., etc.
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Old 12-19-2016, 03:59 PM   #12
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I like the idea of a motorsailer. Sadly, they remind me of an IO (inboard outboard). Instead of taking the best of both, they seem to be a compromise of the less desirable features of both.

Ted
I would say the older design motor sailors would fit your description but not a new design aimed at close to 100/100 % power and sail ability made of modern materials. These boats can be fast under sail and power and dynamite with sail up and some power especially going to wind. Marine architects have learned a thing or two over the last 50 years and if you have the $ to let one in cahoots with a good builder loose you can have it both ways.
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Old 12-19-2016, 06:29 PM   #13
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Originally Posted by eyschulman View Post
I would say the older design motor sailors would fit your description but not a new design aimed at close to 100/100 % power and sail ability made of modern materials. These boats can be fast under sail and power and dynamite with sail up and some power especially going to wind. Marine architects have learned a thing or two over the last 50 years and if you have the $ to let one in cahoots with a good builder loose you can have it both ways.
Ok, here's what I want in a 42 to 48' boat.

From the sail boat:

1. A boat that sails like a passage maker and can point well.
2. Stabilization coming from it's mast, hull and keel(s).

From the power boat:

1. A roomy pilothouse with an unobstructed view (no mast and jib in the way).
2. Comfortable rooms (no cramped staterooms, living in the cave or catamaran hull).
3. An engine that can cruise at hull speed for days.
4. A big enough propeller, shaft, and gear to drive the boat into wind and seas without loosing speed.
5. Fuel capacity in hundreds of gallons so you can go somewhere without sailing.
6. Fresh water capacity in hundreds of gallons.
7. A galley that looks like it came from a trawler not a sailboat.
8. A generator, air conditioning, and a washer / drier.
9. 5' draft; 48' air draft.

Ted
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Old 12-19-2016, 06:36 PM   #14
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I like the idea of a motorsailer. Sadly, they remind me of an IO (inboard outboard). Instead of taking the best of both, they seem to be a compromise of the less desirable features of both.

Ted
The first thought that came to my mind as I read this was "Island Packet"
Sorry...
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Old 12-19-2016, 08:36 PM   #15
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Ok, here's what I want in a 42 to 48' boat.

From the sail boat:

1. A boat that sails like a passage maker and can point well.
2. Stabilization coming from it's mast, hull and keel(s).

From the power boat:

1. A roomy pilothouse with an unobstructed view (no mast and jib in the way).
2. Comfortable rooms (no cramped staterooms, living in the cave or catamaran hull).
3. An engine that can cruise at hull speed for days.
4. A big enough propeller, shaft, and gear to drive the boat into wind and seas without loosing speed.
5. Fuel capacity in hundreds of gallons so you can go somewhere without sailing.
6. Fresh water capacity in hundreds of gallons.
7. A galley that looks like it came from a trawler not a sailboat.
8. A generator, air conditioning, and a washer / drier.
9. 5' draft; 48' air draft.

Ted
There are two low volume production or semi custom boats that come to mind Bruckman 50 and a similar modern motor sailor with Hoods name attached. Both can cruise at 9+ K under power and sail well with the engine off. The Amel 54 no pilot house more in the sail catagory but a very capable ocean hopper that will travel at trawler speeds sail or power.
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Old 12-19-2016, 09:50 PM   #16
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If I was going to do world cruising, I would try to find something like this
1993 Amel Super Maramu Sail Boat For Sale - www.yachtworld.com

Those are nice sailboats. And that looks like a very good example of a used one.
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Old 12-19-2016, 10:04 PM   #17
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Those are nice sailboats. And that looks like a very good example of a used one.


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It reminds me too much of this refrigerator

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Old 12-19-2016, 10:46 PM   #18
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Thinking About Better Offshore Motorboats

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http://www.yachtworld.com/boats/1992...s#.WFi29YZOKEc

This seems like a decent candidate-- good size pilothouse, Cummins power.
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Old 12-19-2016, 11:13 PM   #19
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Originally Posted by O C Diver View Post
Ok, here's what I want in a 42 to 48' boat.

From the sail boat:

1. A boat that sails like a passage maker and can point well.
2. Stabilization coming from it's mast, hull and keel(s).

From the power boat:

1. A roomy pilothouse with an unobstructed view (no mast and jib in the way).
2. Comfortable rooms (no cramped staterooms, living in the cave or catamaran hull).
3. An engine that can cruise at hull speed for days.
4. A big enough propeller, shaft, and gear to drive the boat into wind and seas without loosing speed.
5. Fuel capacity in hundreds of gallons so you can go somewhere without sailing.
6. Fresh water capacity in hundreds of gallons.
7. A galley that looks like it came from a trawler not a sailboat.
8. A generator, air conditioning, and a washer / drier.
9. 5' draft; 48' air draft.

Ted
Could be Nauticat 441 made in Finland





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Old 12-20-2016, 05:34 AM   #20
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Not to forget the Nordy 56 motorsailer, designed exactly for this purpose. If one could afford one, that is..?

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