Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 12-10-2015, 09:38 PM   #21
QB
Senior Member
 
QB's Avatar
 
City: San Diego and Gabriola
Country: USA and Canada
Vessel Name: Skookum Maru
Vessel Model: Ed Monk design #1924
Join Date: Dec 2011
Posts: 215
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tad Roberts View Post
Cook?
Yes, the third voyage. Red is before, and blue after, that little unpleasantness in the Sandwich Islands. Most cruisers these days shouldn't have the same problem.
__________________
Advertisement

QB is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-10-2015, 10:07 PM   #22
Guru
 
twistedtree's Avatar
 
City: Gloucester, MA
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2013
Posts: 3,197
With a family, I'd probably lean away from ocean crossings, so unless you have a real yearning for Europe, I'd stay around North America.

I'd head north first and explore the Pacific North West. How far north you get will depend on where on the West coast you begin. Alaska would be great, but BC is amazing too.

Then I would head south for the winter exploring Mexico and S America, go through the canal, explore the caribean and/or Bahamas.

Then come May or so I would head up the east coast as far as time allows, including Nova Scotia if possible.

Wrap up the end of August and head back to school with the kids. Sell the boat in Boston or somewhere on the east coast.

That's a lot of ground to cover, but I think would be a great experience for all involved and show you a wide variety of different places.

If you are looking for spend less time moving and more time exploring each location, then I'd go north the first summer and explore Puget Sound and southern BC, head south for the winter, but don't go through the canal. Then go back north the next summer and focus on northern BC and Alaska. Then sell the boat in Seattle and send the kids back to school.

A Nordhavn 55 would be a very comfortable boat for that trip.
__________________

__________________
www.MVTanglewood.com
twistedtree is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-10-2015, 11:05 PM   #23
Guru
 
BandB's Avatar
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 13,165
Having done a similar trip to this one in 2014-15, here would be my recommendation for consideration.

June, July and half of August to Alaska. Not just the SE portion, but all the way to at least Seward, Kodiak and Valdez. Then back to Vancouver, Victoria and some of the Canadian Islands and all of Washington. October head south. Spend two months in Oregon and California. December to Mexico. I would spend two months down the coast including Ensenada, Cabo San Lucas, La Paz, Mazatlan, Vallarta, Acapulco, Bahias de Huatulco, Guatemala, El Salvador, Nicaragua, Costa Rica and Panama City. That brings us to February. February and March, the Panama Canal, the Caribbean Coast of Panama and a side journey to Grand Cayman and Jamaica.

April, on up the coast to Belize, Puerto Aventuras and Cancun. June a quick trip across to Key West. Then May and June exploring Florida and the Bahamas. July on up the East Coast to the Chesapeake area or so as remaining time permits.

There are many ways to do it, but there is so much to see in all those areas. You could hurry some of the other areas and leave more time for the East Coast and perhaps time to explore the Gulf of Mexico and the coast there.

14 months seems like so long, but when you do it you realize you can only schedule so much.
BandB is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2015, 11:33 AM   #24
Veteran Member
 
City: SoCal
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Long Time Dead
Vessel Model: Nordhavn 55
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 74
What 14 month itineraries would you all suggest if we launched from Florida/ east coast rather than from California? Since we haven't bought the boat we could start elsewhere. Thanks for the help.
bigpoppop is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2015, 11:59 AM   #25
Guru
 
City: Carefree, Arizona
Country: usa
Vessel Name: sunchaser V
Vessel Model: DeFever 48
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 6,371
We did the same planning a few years ago when contemplating and negotiating for new Ns or the N55 used. Twistedtree is one to certainly listen to but have you gone to the Nordhavn site and looked at all the trips already logged in, hundreds if not thousands of them.

The journey is an investment into a large vessel that will eventually be sold. How you go about buying, equipping, after trip refit as required and then selling is as much a part of the journey as anything. We had a 3 year business plan with the ending point being Dana Point and Nordhavn being the broker on both ends.

Where you go is limitless in scope but 14 months is way too quick unless you stay on one or both US coasts. The Ns are slow so distance is severely time limited. Have you thought of a faster blue water vessel so the 14 months is with more ports of call over say 50% additional distance?
sunchaser is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 12-17-2015, 01:15 PM   #26
Guru
 
BandB's Avatar
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 13,165
Assuming the same June start. I wish you had more like a March or April start.

I'm not going to make an assumption on where you buy the boat but just outline areas by the time of year. You'd have to adjust based on starting location.

The following areas are best for May through September.

I'd want a month in Massachusetts, between Cape Cod, Martha's Vineyard, Nantucket, Hyannis, and Boston and ending around Plymouth with a trip through the canal to perhaps North Falmouth, South Dartmouth and then to Newport RI. From Newport, I'd want to head to the Long Island Sound and spend at least a month between Newport, Long Island Sound and New York City. A couple of weeks along the New Jersey Coast from Atlantic City to Cape May, then to Ocean City. While Ocean City is a bit out of the way to what I'll suggest next, it's more than worth it. Then I'd take the Delaware and the canal with perhaps a stop in Chesapeake City and into the Chesapeake. That brings us to around 12 weeks.

There is so much to see in the Chesapeake. I would go to Baltimore, then Annapolis. Then you hit the smaller towns. The Eastern Bay, St. Michael's is a don't miss to me, Kent Island, Tilghman Island, Oxford and Cambridge, both on the Choptank, Chesapeake Beach, Solomons. That is at least 5 weeks. I'd want two weeks up the Potomac and to DC. Then one of my favorite stops is Cape Charles before going to the Tidewater area of Norfolk, Hampton, Portsmouth, Newport News. So that's 20-21 weeks I've labeled North of Virginia. This is the area you're going to want to see during the summer months and perhaps May and September.

For North Carolina and South Carolina you probably have two more months of pleasant boating. Now recognize you're going to have two summer periods to use if you start in June for 14 months.

Out of NC, SC, and GA, while we love them all, NC has more different spots to see. Between Beaufort and Portsmouth, VA, you have Coinjock, Belhaven, New Bern. Manteo, Elizabeth City, Washington, NC., Oriental, Wanchese, Hatteras, and Ocracoke. That's three weeks minimum. Total to this point 24 weeks.

Beaufort and Morehead City merit an extended stop. We're not a fan of the ICW between there and Wrightsville Beach but others are. I'd allocate at least 4 weeks for Beaufort, Morehead City, Wrightsville, Wilimington and the Cape Fear, Bald Head Island and Southport. Sub total 28.

South Carolina, the next stretch south is Myrtle Beach, Georgetown, and Charleston. Perhaps a couple of stops between. Beaufort, SC, Port Royal, Port Royal Sound, lead you to Hilton Head. I'd allow 4 to 5 weeks for SC. Sub total 33.

Georgia is interesting with islands like Tybee and Jekyll and St. Simons. Then there are two mainland towns I think of. Savannah is worth going up the river and into the downtown area and spending days. Brunswick is a nice water oriented small town. I'd allow 3 weeks for GA. Sub total 36.

I'm going to cover Florida's east coast in sections. First is Georgia Border to Melbourne. Fernandina Beach and Amelia Island are worth a couple of days. Then there is Jacksonville and the St. John's River. A couple of days for the city, a couple for the river. Next major stop is St. Augustine and it's worth the better part of a week. We like a day or two stop over in Palm Coast. Then two or three days in Daytona Beach. Perhaps a quick stop in New Smyrna and then you're to Titusville and Cape Canaveral and the Kennedy Space Center. I give that entire area of Northeast FL at least 3 weeks. Sub Total 39.

Now, Melbourne to the St. Lucie Inlet. Vero Beach and Ft Pierce are brief stops. However, the St. Lucie River brings you to Stuart and it brings you across to the West Coast of FL. At some point you'll probably want to loop South Florida taking the route around the Keys one way and the Okeechobee across the other way. So, we'll a week for this section of the coast and the trip across. Sub total 40.

From Jupiter to South Miami is continuous water pleasure. Between the Palm Beaches, Fort Lauderdale, Miami and the Biscayne Bay, I can't imagine spending less than a month. Then from Miami you have a multitude of sounds and islands, places like Key Largo, Tavernier, and Marathon Bringing you to Key West. Counting several days in Key West, I would allow 6 weeks for this section and we're to 46 weeks. I'd spend at least six of the remaining weeks in the Bahamas. You won't even touch them. Just hit on Bimini, the Berry's, Nassau, Grand Bahama, the Abacos, Eleuthera, Andros and the Exumas. That brings us to 52 weeks

For the remaining 8 weeks, I'd include the west coast of Florida and the gulf. We love Naples for 2-3 days, Sanibel for a brief stop, Ft. Myers for a couple, the Charlotte Harbor for 1, Venice for 2 or 3 at least, at least 2 or 3 in the Sarasota area, a brief stop perhaps at Longboat Key. Then you reach Tampa Bay. The better part of a week between St. Petersburg and Tampa and then a few more days at Clearwater. That's at least 4 weeks. That brings us to a total of 13 out of your 14 months.

Sadly, I don't think it likely leaves time for crossing to Carabelle, Panama City, Pensacola, Mobile, Gulfport and New Orleans if you're running under 10 knots and definitely not enough to fit Texas in.

It can be a wonderful trip. How does it compare to the trip around and through the Panama Canal? Both are wonderful. On the Panama Canal route you're seeing more countries, a greater variety of culture and scenery. But the price is that you're spending more time traveling on the water and not seeing things. Taking the East Coast trip, you see a tremendous portion of the US. You'll see the sights of history from much earlier than you've seen from the west coast. If you haven't traveled this area, you'll see places you're read about only in history books. I do not like reading history, but I like hearing the story of the lost colony in Manteo or seeing Plymouth Rock or the sight of the Boston Tea Party or Ellis Island and the Statue of Liberty or seeing where the Wright Brothers made their flight and where space travel originated in the US. Seeing the Capitol, Lincoln Memorial, and White House. So many different kinds of beauty to be seen. There's a lot similar and then so much different. Then toss in the Bahamas which are like a vacation to your vacation. I still can't believe that in moving to South Florida we got this playground right off our coast of hundreds and hundreds of islands.

Who knows. By the time you make your trip, you may even go 90 miles out of your way and visit Cuba.

I think either of the paths you've thought of would be great. It's really a matter of what would you and your family like most to see. It will definitely be a time you're never forget.
BandB is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2016, 12:54 PM   #27
Veteran Member
 
City: SoCal
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Long Time Dead
Vessel Model: Nordhavn 55
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 74
Costs

Thanks to everyone for the feedback- you all are an invaluable resource.

We have penciled in the Alaska to Rhode Island itinerary for 14 months starting late 6/2015.

What should we roughly expect in terms of expenses during the 14 months? Is there a rule of thumb when budgeting expenses? Obviously repairs can change everything.

Thanks again.
bigpoppop is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2016, 01:26 PM   #28
Guru
 
City: Hotel, CA
Country: Fried
Join Date: Sep 2011
Posts: 8,328
Forgive me if this has been answered and I missed it but do you own a boat yet? 5 months ain't long to get a boat ready for a 14 month liveaboard trip.
__________________
Craig

It's easier to fool people than to convince them that they've been fooled - Mark Twain
CPseudonym is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2016, 02:31 PM   #29
Guru
 
BandB's Avatar
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 13,165
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigpoppop View Post
Thanks to everyone for the feedback- you all are an invaluable resource.

We have penciled in the Alaska to Rhode Island itinerary for 14 months starting late 6/2015.

What should we roughly expect in terms of expenses during the 14 months? Is there a rule of thumb when budgeting expenses? Obviously repairs can change everything.

Thanks again.
Can't really answer that if we don't know what type and age and condition of boat. Nor do we know how you intend to live. Do you plan marinas every night or anchoring? Meals on the boat or five star restaurants? Explore the towns inexpensively or visit every high priced site? Buy souvenirs at each stop? Then there's the loss you'll take on the boat and the maintenance. Use agents for each country or try to go without except where required? Don't overlook that there are significant entry charges plus the charges for going through the canal.

How do you normally live? Frugally or extravagantly? Now many will say this won't be much different, but this is a long vacation and most people spend more time on vacation. At home, we don't eat out more than once a week. Traveling we want to at least try one restaurant in every city we visit.
BandB is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2016, 02:42 PM   #30
Senior Member
 
bilge53's Avatar
 
City: Oriental, NC
Country: USA
Vessel Name: M/V Major Award
Vessel Model: Senator 35 w/single Lehman
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 420
Experience to date?
bilge53 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2016, 03:12 PM   #31
Veteran Member
 
City: SoCal
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Long Time Dead
Vessel Model: Nordhavn 55
Join Date: Nov 2015
Posts: 74
BandB- we will likely use marinas most everywhere we go but eat most of our meals onboard the boat. We will use agents to get in and out of the countries visited, and we will likely choose to do all great activities along the way unless they are exhorbitantly expensive.

The boat we are planning to use will be a 7-10 year old Nordhavn 55'. One of the reason for selecting a Nordhavn is more predictable resale (but I know I will lose money- just the broker commission alone will be sizable).

I expect to lose money on the boat, but I do not know what to expect with regards to maintenance.

I am looking for loose guidelines- I know the range will be large. There's fuel, insurance, marina fees, food, entertainment, customs/ entry fees, canal transit costs, maintenance, wifi, etc. etc. etc.

Thanks for all of your input.
bigpoppop is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2016, 03:27 PM   #32
Guru
 
BandB's Avatar
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 13,165
Quote:
Originally Posted by bigpoppop View Post
BandB- we will likely use marinas most everywhere we go but eat most of our meals onboard the boat. We will use agents to get in and out of the countries visited, and we will likely choose to do all great activities along the way unless they are exhorbitantly expensive.

The boat we are planning to use will be a 7-10 year old Nordhavn 55'. One of the reason for selecting a Nordhavn is more predictable resale (but I know I will lose money- just the broker commission alone will be sizable).

I expect to lose money on the boat, but I do not know what to expect with regards to maintenance.

I am looking for loose guidelines- I know the range will be large. There's fuel, insurance, marina fees, food, entertainment, customs/ entry fees, canal transit costs, maintenance, wifi, etc. etc. etc.

Thanks for all of your input.
Ok, so here's a stab in the dark to give you a range.

Loss on boat $200k.

Fuel $20k
Insurance $20k That is assuming you have the experience to get insurance.
Marina Fees $60k
Food $17k
Entertainment $15k
Customs/Entry/Canal $5k
Don't know what kind of satellite system if any you'll use but maintaining communications could easily be $20k
Maintenance on boat-Routine $14k
Maintenance unexpected large expense $10k

So, ballpark of $150-200k plus the $200k loss on boat. Perhaps you'll come in for less but I'd make sure I had that much available.
BandB is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2016, 03:32 PM   #33
Guru
 
City: Satsuma FL
Country: United States
Vessel Name: No Mo Trawla
Vessel Model: Hurricane SS188
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 1,681
Quote:
Originally Posted by BandB View Post
Ok, so here's a stab in the dark to give you a range.

Loss on boat $200k.

Fuel $20k
Insurance $20k That is assuming you have the experience to get insurance.
Marina Fees $60k
Food $17k
Entertainment $15k
Customs/Entry/Canal $5k
Don't know what kind of satellite system if any you'll use but maintaining communications could easily be $20k
Maintenance on boat-Routine $14k
Maintenance unexpected large expense $10k

So, ballpark of $150-200k plus the $200k loss on boat. Perhaps you'll come in for less but I'd make sure I had that much available.
Is your real name Mr. and Mrs. Dreambuster???
Donsan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2016, 03:56 PM   #34
Guru
 
BandB's Avatar
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 13,165
Quote:
Originally Posted by Donsan View Post
Is your real name Mr. and Mrs. Dreambuster???
No, but I'm taking into consideration the boat he's talking about. Two available on the West Coast, one for $1.025 million and one for $1.295 million. I'm taking into consideration the cost of the various marinas having been that entire route and experienced them. Anchoring would save lot's of money but that's not his plan.

Which of my numbers would you argue with and what numbers would you give him? And have you been the route he's talking about? My numbers added to $181k so I said $150-200k. So reduce my numbers by 20% and you're still at $145k.

I'm also very familiar with what Nordhavn owners find themselves spending in the first year. The $200k loss on the boat may well be high but sales commission will be $100k and you must assume some depreciation so maybe $150k.

This isn't the great loop on a 36' trawler that he's talking about. Anyone else have numbers, feel free to offer them. I'm also assuming in buying a $1+ million boat that he can afford substantial costs and has planned for an expensive 14 month trip.
BandB is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2016, 04:01 PM   #35
Guru
 
City: Satsuma FL
Country: United States
Vessel Name: No Mo Trawla
Vessel Model: Hurricane SS188
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 1,681
Quote:
Originally Posted by BandB View Post
No, but I'm taking into consideration the boat he's talking about. Two available on the West Coast, one for $1.025 million and one for $1.295 million. I'm taking into consideration the cost of the various marinas having been that entire route and experienced them. Anchoring would save lot's of money but that's not his plan.

Which of my numbers would you argue with and what numbers would you give him? And have you been the route he's talking about? My numbers added to $181k so I said $150-200k. So reduce my numbers by 20% and you're still at $145k.

I'm also very familiar with what Nordhavn owners find themselves spending in the first year. The $200k loss on the boat may well be high but sales commission will be $100k and you must assume some depreciation so maybe $150k.

This isn't the great loop on a 36' trawler that he's talking about. Anyone else have numbers, feel free to offer them. I'm also assuming in buying a $1+ million boat that he can afford substantial costs and has planned for an expensive 14 month trip.
I was joking. I would have estimated $10,000/month without considering the depreciation and without going into the details you did. Anyway you cut the muster, those are some big bucks for a little more than 12 months but some of those expenses would be there just living in their land based home.
Donsan is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2016, 04:02 PM   #36
TF Site Team
 
ksanders's Avatar
 
City: SEWARD ALASKA
Country: USA
Vessel Name: LISAS WAY
Vessel Model: BAYLINER 4788
Join Date: Feb 2011
Posts: 3,956
The way I look at expenses are...

A. Direct boat expenses

B. People expenses

Its hard to predict maintenance expenses for a cruise since it all depends where in the lifecycle you are on the various boats systems.

Fuel is in direct proportion to how far you go. Figure 1 mpg on a boat that size and you'll be over budgeted but in the ballpark.

Marina expenses are going to be a big one. Budgeting $1.50 per foot per day will be probably over budgeted but in the ballpark.

People expenses in my opinion you shouldn't even have to budget for or plan on. The reason is that you were alive, eating, going out, etc... Before you go cruising so nothing in my opinion would really change much except ticket prices to attractions along the way, and the occasional rental car.
__________________
Kevin Sanders
Bayliner 4788
Seward, Alaska
www.mvlisasway.com
ksanders is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2016, 05:04 PM   #37
Guru
 
BandB's Avatar
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 13,165
Quote:
Originally Posted by Donsan View Post
I was joking. I would have estimated $10,000/month without considering the depreciation and without going into the details you did. Anyway you cut the muster, those are some big bucks for a little more than 12 months but some of those expenses would be there just living in their land based home.
14 months...lol

Yes your $10k per month would have been close to my numbers, $140k for the trip.
BandB is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2016, 05:17 PM   #38
Guru
 
BandB's Avatar
 
City: Fort Lauderdale
Country: USA
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 13,165
Quote:
Originally Posted by ksanders View Post
The way I look at expenses are...

A. Direct boat expenses

B. People expenses

Its hard to predict maintenance expenses for a cruise since it all depends where in the lifecycle you are on the various boats systems.

Fuel is in direct proportion to how far you go. Figure 1 mpg on a boat that size and you'll be over budgeted but in the ballpark.

Marina expenses are going to be a big one. Budgeting $1.50 per foot per day will be probably over budgeted but in the ballpark.

People expenses in my opinion you shouldn't even have to budget for or plan on. The reason is that you were alive, eating, going out, etc... Before you go cruising so nothing in my opinion would really change much except ticket prices to attractions along the way, and the occasional rental car.
When cruising as a lifestyle, perhaps the people expenses don't change much, but when doing it as a long vacation, you spend money on many things you wouldn't at home.

My numbers on fuel are below 1 mpg but do take prices outside the US into consideration.

I budgeted closer to $2.60 per foot. As low as $2 might be ok, but he's going to many areas where dockage is expensive as is electricity and water (although hope he has a watermaker instead of buying water). It will not be uncommon to pay $3.00-4.00 per foot ($165-220 per night) for docking and another $40 or $50 for electric. Miami Beach Marina would be $5 per foot (up to $8 for prime location) base fee plus utilities which I believe are somewhere in the range of 40-50 cents per foot.
BandB is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 01-25-2016, 08:02 PM   #39
Guru
 
Ski in NC's Avatar
 
City: Wilmington, NC
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Louisa
Vessel Model: Custom Built 38
Join Date: Jan 2014
Posts: 3,888
In my little 38 with two people, fuel, food, dockage, restaurants, ice, beer, wine, entertainment.. comes out to around $3k/month. So for this larger boat with more folks, $10k/mo sounds in the ballpark.

Lots of latitude in those numbers. Fuel is straightforward: You travel, you pay. All else can scale vastly up and down. Beans and rice and fresh fish or restaurant meals. Anchoring overnight or high end marina. Depends on tastes and tolerance for spending.
Ski in NC is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 01-27-2016, 09:16 AM   #40
FF
Guru
 
FF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 16,530
"we will likely use marinas most everywhere we go"

Depends , $1.00 per ft per night to perhaps $10.00 a foot in superyacht places.

Many folks avoid the dirt and hassles of docksidev and anchor out and get a slip space for the tender.

Mostly the choice depends on on board power requirements and privacy desires.

depending on your skill set , hiring a captain and cook might make sense.
__________________

FF is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 08:42 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012