Stern tie - I need your opinion

[carvendive]

I use a stern tie when I'm in deep water anchoring locations here in the northwest. I have a 600' spool of 1/2" yellow poly that I take from my stern to shore, wrap around a tree or large rock and then bring it back to the stern. On departure I let loose one end and retrieve all the line while staying onboard. In the past I've used some 1-1/2" scrap hose to prevent chafe but then I've had to go ashore to retrieve it.

My untested solution is to use a smaller dia hose for chafeguard - probably 3/4" garden hose. Run the line through it and then when retrieving it, attach a caribener to it to insure the hose comes back home.

For those of you that do this successfully;

How do you keep the chafe guard in place while bring the line back to your vessel that insures that when you retireve the stern tie everything comes home?

Do you use something other than the carabiner to insure that the hose comes home without snagging?

How long of a chafe guard do you use?

Do you tie to just trees or will you sometimes use a large rock?

 

[skipperdude]

What about just tying a large stopper not on the end of the shore line.**If I understand correctly you have both ends aboard. That way the hose could not slide off.

SD

 

[Carey]

carvendive said:



For those of you that do this successfully;

How do you keep the chafe guard in place while bring the line back to your vessel that insures that when you retireve the stern tie everything comes home?

Do you use something other than the carabiner to insure that the hose comes home without snagging?

How long of a chafe guard do you use?

Do you tie to just trees or will you sometimes use a large rock?



Carey said:


I have never used a chafe guard. I have only used trees or steel eyes set into rock (Princess Cove, Wallace Island, BC). I, also use polypropylene line. It floats, and is pretty chafe resistant, and slides nicely across most materials. I haven't tried it, but my concern would be that the hose and or stop knot or caribiner would snag as I tried to remove my line. I also carry a 600' spool of sternline on a garden hose reel. Makes it easy to reel back on board.

 

[Larry M]

carvendive wrote:


...How long of a chafe guard do you use?...



We have never used a chafe guard.* Every time we stern tie,*the actual distance to shore is different and so there is not one spot that chafes.* Our stern*line seems to wear evenly.*

Larry/Lena
Hobo KK42
La Cruz,*Nayarit, MX*

 

[skipperdude]

Poly is cheap.
*Forget the chafe guard. IMHO

SD

 

[Carey]

superdiver wrote:

Why do you do tie the stern off?

I believe you are asking why we stern tie? For one of two main reasons. First, if you are anchoring at the edge of deep water, you don't want the anchor to pull toward the deep water, where you might run out of rode and also dimish the angle of pull, thereby releasing the anchor. The inside passage from Seattle north to Alaska has limited shallow anchorages. The stern tie keeps the stern close to the beach in shallow water. The other time of need for stern tie occurs in small, busy protected anchorages, when you have so many boats that there is no room for boats to have their own personal swing arc. All boats in the anchorage must stern tie to prevent collision.

*

 

[bshanafelt]

We also do not use a chafe guard. Have tied around rocks, trees, bolts, etc. Use a 5/8" poly line, and just tie a big bowline around the tie off object.

In the morning, after starting the boat, I will hand over hand the dinghy to the bowline knot, then wave to the Admirial to slack the line and then untie the knot.

I then flake the stern tie line into the bow area of the dinghy with the end hung on a velcro loop in the dinghy for the next deployment of the stern line.

When it is time to stern tie, the end is cleated to the stern of the big boat and the dinghy is backed to shore with the line nicely deployed as we go.


I typically tow my dinghy for the summer and the stern tie line rides in the bow compartment.

 

[Carey]

There is one more appropriate time to use a stern tie or stern anchor, and that is when the tide is turning your boat into a broadside situation with the wind. It can be a very rolly situation unless you square up to the incoming waves. One thing to remember in any situation where you stern tie or anchor. THE WIND CAN CHANGE DIRECTION. For the most part, you only want to do this when there is no way you could get wind or fetch from your stern. Heavy waves over the stern can sink you.

 

[carvendive]

Like many of you I usually tow the whaler and the stern tie doubles as the dink's painter. I use a snatch block to center the painter. I have the 600' on a spool with a crank handle for quick retrieval but I also like the idea of flaking the line in situations where I might not be able to retrieve the line without a snag.

Maybe I'll just forget the chafe gear. In the several years of use I only have one spot that shows some ware and like you say, Poly is nice and cheap.

 

[FF]

Tied to a tree or rock is mostly for O'nite in a very secure harbor.

Light chain does not wear out on a boulder, and is strong enough.

 

[Capt Dan]

I might have a solution of sorts for your situation.

First off,* I would make up a bridle of sorts of some line a bit heavier that your "stern tie" line, and splice two thimbles into it, one on each end.** One thimble should be of a size that your stern tie line will pass thru and the other should be very large.* Make sure these thimbles are very fair and smooth,* maybe even the nylon type.* A step back:* before splicing your thimbles, thread a bouy onto the bridle line, one big enuf to support the weight of the thimbles.* The bouy should be tapered on each end so not to snag on anything.* Football shap would be nice.

This bridle should be long enuf to reach around the largest object you foresee tieing to.* ie,* boulder etc.

Pass your stern tie poly thru the small thimble and tie a stopper knot, figure eight whatever in the end of the stern tie line.* Make sure it cannot pass thru the smaller thimble.

Take the bridle ashore and pass it around the tree, boulder, whathaveyou, and then pass the stern tie poly thru the larger thimble.* The stopper knot should pass thru this thimble with ease.

Run the stopper end back to your stern and make fast.

Sleep well.

In the morning, let your stoppered end go from the boat (never take the stopper knot out)* and haul away on the other end.** The stopper should pass thru the large thimble and then fetch up on the small thimble and you should be able to pull the whole rig to the boat without a trip ashore.* Hopefully the bridle will not get caught on the back side of the boulder.* Pick your rock carefully.

Hopefully, the thimbles will give you a fair lead and not chafe your stern tie line.

You may not be able to use this rig with an existing eyebolt on shore as the large thimble may not pass thru the eye.* I'm still pondering that one.

Dan Pease

-- Edited by Capt Dan on Friday 26th of November 2010 08:48:42 AM

 

[koliver]

I haven't experienced any chafing on my stern tie lines, only dirt from pulling them back aboard through bark or over open dirt. I wouldn't rig any hoses or other anti-chafe gear.
When tied stern to, especially in the Desolation Sound area, where there tend to be lots of boats close by, my stern line is usually pulled taut enough that when swimming, I can't depress the middle of the line more than a few feet.
I use 1/2 inch nylon 3 strand. I have one 200 foot piece, and one 300 foot piece. I stow them in dairyland boxes and the deployment is this:
I drop the anchor, back in relatively close to shore ( to the full extent of the rode) and leave the boat at idle in reverse, with the first mate on the controls, holding position.
take the dog and the box of line into the dinghy, first tying one end off on the stern of the boat.
reverse back to the shore, letting the line pay out as I go.
take the dinghy painter and the box and jump ashore (the dog is on his own now)
carry the box up to the tie-off tree and pass it around and return to the dinghy.
take the rest of the line back to the boat and tie it off.
take the boat out of gear.
Bob's your Uncle!
unless of course you need to go back for the dog.
Only if I cant get a good spot close enough will I resort to single part line, tied off with a long loop, the bowline far enough down so I can get to it from the dinghy.
The amount of current in the anchorage sometimes is too much for the position holding skills of FM, so in those conditions there is a longer time taken in total as some retraining is necessary.* In most conditions the whole task is so quick and quiet the neighbours haven't realized our arrival until they hear the first person dive into the water.

 

[dwhatty]

koliver wrote:...take the dog and the box of line into the dinghy...

Luckily we carry a dog so will try this procedure. Will any old dog do or does it have to be one of those specialized breeds?

*

 

[Capt Dan]

TOUCHE!!!!!

Well done!

-- Edited by Capt Dan on Saturday 27th of November 2010 11:25:09 AM

 

[RT Firefly]

Hiya,
** Well, I don't know about stern tying but I do know some about dogs.
** Now you've got your Purina breds and your mutts.* Some of the Purina breds have been breaded so much they have problems like hip dispepsia or brain problems but with some like yer cockeyed spanials ya never know whether the brain problems are just normal or in breaded.
* Now they's makin' "designer dogs" like yer Affen Terrier or yer Affen Tzu.* Heck they've even got a Affen Poo.* Well, I think dogs just affen poo too much and at the most inoporortune times as well.* Other designer dogs are the Aussiedoodle, Bagle hound (for those of the Jewish persuasion), Bernedoodle, Bichomo (for those types light in their loafers I suppose), and Woodles.* Personally I think it was just some mistake the owner made taking their bitch in heat to the local dog park for a bit of exercise and they're hoping to make a few buck off the pups.* Er Ya, they's Saint Barnyard-a-wawa's.
** You really can't go too wrong with a mutt.* Designer dogs without pretensions.
** I had a Blacksmith dog for a while and made lots of money but then he dissapeared.* Blacksmith dog?* Yup, kick it in the butt, it makes a bolt for the door and then you sell the bolts.
** Nuff said.

 

[sunchaser]

A floating line is the best stern tie for me. I have 600' of 5/8" yellow poly. It doesn't snag of the bottom, it is visible, dries quickly*and is light. I have a quick release like Capt Dan - it works most of the time except when getting hung on shore rocks*during the retrieve.

 

[dwhatty]

rt firefly wrote:

hiya,
well, i don't know about stern tying but i do know some about dogs.
Now you've got your purina breds and your mutts.* some of the purina breds have been breaded so much they have problems like hip dispepsia or brain problems but with some like yer cockeyed spanials ya never know whether the brain problems are just normal or in breaded.
Now they's makin' "designer dogs" like yer affen terrier or yer affen tzu.* heck they've even got a affen poo.* well, i think dogs just affen poo too much and at the most inoporortune times as well.* other designer dogs are the aussiedoodle, bagle hound (for those of the jewish persuasion), bernedoodle, bichomo (for those types light in their loafers i suppose), and woodles.* personally i think it was just some mistake the owner made taking their bitch in heat to the local dog park for a bit of exercise and they're hoping to make a few buck off the pups.* er ya, they's saint barnyard-a-wawa's.
You really can't go too wrong with a mutt.* designer dogs without pretensions.
I had a blacksmith dog for a while and made lots of money but then he dissapeared.* blacksmith dog?* yup, kick it in the butt, it makes a bolt for the door and then you sell the bolts.
Nuff said.

woof!

*

 

[hollywood8118]

I also have a big spool of around 600' of 5/8" poly, it has a crank handle and re winds really well. I welded the spool holder out of aluminum and it has hooks that hang over the 7/8" stern rail..
Poly is a great choice...********* yellow keeps the kids from running over it ( and snow bird boaters ) it floats.. its cheap
but a word to the wise... don't store it uncovered on deck as the stuff gets really brittle very quick if stored on the spool in the sun ( personal experience speaking here).

I love backing into a tight cove and running a stern line to shore... no worry about playing bumper boats in the night... but the Admiral considers it a P.I.T.A. ....
I just tell her to row faster..it gets it over sooner!
HOLLYWOOD

 

[Keith]

They make a polypropylene line that you can get at Home Depot et al that is made just like the nylon double braid you normally use. I have two hanks that are green 1/2" and it floats, but handles just like nylon. Don't know how it compares to the UV degradation of the yellow stuff, but probably similar or a little slower. It's good if you need a floating line.

 

[markpierce]

koliver wrote:

... take the dog and the box of line into the dinghy, first tying one end off on the stern of the boat. ...

Now if the dog took the line from the boat by itself*and ran it around the tree, then swam back with the free end of line, allowing me to stay on board and not bother with the dinghy, I'd consider adopting such a dog.

*

 

[Marin]

If you read Farley Mowat's The Boat Who Wouldn't Float you'll find that there is a breed of dog that will do just that for you. I forget the name of the breed--- it's not the Portugese Water Dog--- but it's unique in the Canadian Maritimes. Among other things they would jump into the water after a boat launching and retrieve all the wooden blocks and wedges that had been used to keep the boat level in its cradle that floated free when the hull lifted off the cradle. From Farley's description, they are pretty remarkable dogs.

 

[dwhatty]

Marin wrote:

If you read Farley Mowat's The Boat Who Wouldn't Float you'll find that there is a breed of dog that will do just that for you. I forget the name of the breed--- it's not the Portugese Water Dog--- but it's unique in the Canadian Maritimes. Among other things they would jump into the water after a boat launching and retrieve all the wooden blocks and wedges that had been used to keep the boat level in its cradle that floated free when the hull lifted off the cradle. From Farley's description, they are pretty remarkable dogs.

A St. John's dog? Or a Newfoundland?

*

 

[koliver]

Retrieval of the line is not a job for the dog. Its a crew job.
Some of you have read this here before, but I will repeat:
Pendrell sound, on a hot hot day in August, I was minding my own business on the bow of my boat when a mermaid swam by. Well it was the first mate from a nearby sailboat, swimming topless. naturally she got my attention, and that of several other fellows in the fairly crowded anchorage. So I kept an eye peeled, and sure enough, was rewarded with the sight of her swimming to the shore at the stern of her boat, walking gingerly up the rocky beach to the trees, where she untied the one part stern line. She coiled it as she returned to the water's edge, swam back to her boat, climbed aboard, hauled in the line and put it away, went to the bow and hauled up the anchor. While she was doing those crew jobs, the skipper started the engine, and when she returned to the cockpit, he drove them out of the anchorage.
Now that is the "perfect crew".

 

[Phil Fill]

The nylon line that is single braid used for most ski/tow rope, the kind if you push the braid back it forms a hollow center that you can insert the end of another line into that hold tight like a Chinese finger lock.** Then you can cut the worn pieced out and slice it back together. **When we skied a lot I made different size ski rope harness.* *You can also link several lines together to make one long line and take them apart to make short lines again. So it seems learn how to splice the lines/rope is the simplest.


*
So instead of stern tie why not stern anchor?* We have a stern anchor then you do not have to go to shore? ***

 

[Carey]

Phil Fill wrote:
*


So instead of stern tie why not stern anchor?We have a stern anchor then you do not have to go to shore?

I also have a stern anchor, which I might choose to deploy rather than go to shore. However, some circumstances dictate that you get the stern so close to shore that you don't have enough distance to make for proper scope on a stern anchor.

 

[Moonstruck]

markpierce wrote:

Now if the dog took the line from the boat by itself*and ran it around the tree, then swam back with the free end of line, allowing me to stay on board and not bother with the dinghy, I'd consider adopting such a dog.


*

I'm going to try that, and give up on trying to teach our dog, Troy, to tie a bowline.

*

 

[RT Firefly]

Hiya,
** Mr. Moonstruck.* Maybe Troy can tie a "boneline"?

 

[Marin]

dwhatty wrote:
A St. John's dog? Or a Newfoundland?

It's not a Newfoundland.* I'd have remebered that.* St. John's dog sounds familiar, though.* I don't know where my copy of the book is so I can't look up what he wrote.

*

 

[Budds Outlet]

Marin wrote:


dwhatty wrote:
A St. John's dog? Or a Newfoundland?

It's not a Newfoundland.* I'd have remebered that.* St. John's dog sounds familiar, though.* I don't know where my copy of the book is so I can't look up what he wrote.

*

I've also misplaced my copy of the book and I can't remeber the dog's breed,*but I can vouch for the dog's stated abilities.* That is probably the most engaging boat book I've ever read.* Highly recomended to the experianced or aspiring cruiser.*

*

 

[Capt Dan]

Only book better would be London's* "Sea Wolf",* But no dog in that one that I remember