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Old 10-25-2012, 06:18 AM   #21
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Aesthetically there might be but that's a subjective call. __________________

Sorta like tiny imitation tug boats with stacks , of no use except as deck dock box?
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Old 10-25-2012, 06:40 AM   #22
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Does anybody just ditch the mast altogether?
Our mast is an integral part of our paravane system. An addtion, the radar, weather instuments, TV antenna, radar deflector, GPS, anchor light and the deck lights are all mounted on the mast.

We did see a 1981 Krogen 42 that had a radar arch in place of the mast to mount their electronics. It looked pretty good.
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Old 10-25-2012, 12:08 PM   #23
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Aesthetically there might be but that's a subjective call. __________________

Sorta like tiny imitation tug boats with stacks , of no use except as deck dock box?
Yes. My imitation stack provides for headroom over the stairs between pilothouse and saloon as well as holding the propane bottle.

Besides carrying sails, its mast supports the radar, VHF antenna, running light, anchor light, spreader lights, flag halyards, and lightning rod.

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Old 10-26-2012, 06:31 AM   #24
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as well as holding the propane bottle

So if the propane bottle overheated and all the gas was released in a min , it would vent down the stairs into the vessel?

Unique !
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Old 10-26-2012, 02:01 PM   #25
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as well as holding the propane bottle

So if the propane bottle overheated and all the gas was released in a min , it would vent down the stairs into the vessel?

Unique !
Not quite!

The bottle sits on the lower part of the "stack" which is part of the saloon's strong, solid steel roof. The bottle is covered with the weaker, plastic, upper part of the "stack" with small gaps at the edges.


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Old 10-26-2012, 10:44 PM   #26
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Hate to be a nit picker, but some nautical nomenclature review might be in order here. Unless I am mistaken, a staysail is a sail inboard of the jib or headsail. If you have a staysail, you by definition have a jib, otherwise the "staysail" is a jib. The steadying sail shown above is a mainsail, not a staysail, which always flies forward from the main mast. I'm sure everyone already knows this, but in the interest of not having to endure listening to sailors alleging that trawler owners can't tell port from starboard I point this out.
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Old 10-26-2012, 10:56 PM   #27
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Dictionary Definition

staysail n : a fore-and-aft sail set on a stay (as between two masts)

English

Noun A fore-and-aftrigged sail whose luff can be affixed to a stay running forward from a mast to the deck, the bowspritor to another mast.

Extensive Definition

A staysail is a fore-and-aft rigged sail whoseluffcan be affixed to a stayrunning forward (and most often but not always downwards) from amast to the deck, thebowsprit or to another mast.
Most staysails are bob triangular, however some are four-cornered, notably some fishermans staysails.
Any triangular staysail set forward of the foremost mast is called a jib. Confusingly, the innermost jib on a cutter,schooner and many other rigs having two or more jibs is referred to simply as the staysail, and another of the jibs on such a rig is referred to simply as the jib.
Types of staysail include - the Tallboy Staysail (a narrow staysail carried between the spinnaker and the mainsail on racing yachts), the Genoa Staysail (a larger staysail carried inside the spinnaker when broad reaching), and the Bigboy Staysail (another name for the Shooter or Blooper, carried on the leeward side of the spinnaker). Unlike the Cutter staysail, none of these staysails have the luff affixed to a stay.
On large rigs, staysails other than jibs are named according to the mast and mast section on which they are hoisted. Thus, the staysail hoisted on a stay that runs forward and downwards from the top of the mizzen topgallant mast is the mizzen topgallant staysail. If two staysails are hoisted to different points on this mast, they would be the mizzen upper topgallant staysail and the mizzen lower topgallant staysail.

...

With a "handkerchief" sail, it's hard to say "mainsail." "Staysail" sounds less ostentatious, I suppose...
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Old 10-27-2012, 12:00 AM   #28
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Dictionary Definition

staysail n : a fore-and-aft sail set on a stay (as between two masts)

English

Noun A fore-and-aftrigged sail whose luff can be affixed to a stay running forward from a mast to the deck, the bowspritor to another mast.

Extensive Definition

A staysail is a fore-and-aft rigged sail whoseluffcan be affixed to a stayrunning forward (and most often but not always downwards) from amast to the deck, thebowsprit or to another mast.
Most staysails are bob triangular, however some are four-cornered, notably some fishermans staysails.
Any triangular staysail set forward of the foremost mast is called a jib. Confusingly, the innermost jib on a cutter,schooner and many other rigs having two or more jibs is referred to simply as the staysail, and another of the jibs on such a rig is referred to simply as the jib.
Types of staysail include - the Tallboy Staysail (a narrow staysail carried between the spinnaker and the mainsail on racing yachts), the Genoa Staysail (a larger staysail carried inside the spinnaker when broad reaching), and the Bigboy Staysail (another name for the Shooter or Blooper, carried on the leeward side of the spinnaker). Unlike the Cutter staysail, none of these staysails have the luff affixed to a stay.
On large rigs, staysails other than jibs are named according to the mast and mast section on which they are hoisted. Thus, the staysail hoisted on a stay that runs forward and downwards from the top of the mizzen topgallant mast is the mizzen topgallant staysail. If two staysails are hoisted to different points on this mast, they would be the mizzen upper topgallant staysail and the mizzen lower topgallant staysail.

...

With a "handkerchief" sail, it's hard to say "mainsail." "Staysail" sounds less ostentatious, I suppose...
Yes, a staysail is a fore and aft sail set off the main mast inside the jib. And while it might be less ostentatious to refer to a hankerchief headsail as a staysail, you trade ostentation for inaccuracy.
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Old 10-27-2012, 12:06 AM   #29
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The two terms I have heard and read and that I use for the sail in question are "steady sail" and "riding sail."
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Old 10-27-2012, 12:26 AM   #30
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With all this talk, think I'll put up my sails tomorrow even if there's no reason.

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Old 10-27-2012, 11:07 AM   #31
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The two terms I have heard and read and that I use for the sail in question are "steady sail" and "riding sail."
Marin, that is what a GB has. The primary purpose is slowing the period of roll or weather cocking the vessel at anchor. It would always fly aft of the main if that's all you got. If you have a mizzen as well the steadying sail flies off the main and the riding sail off the mizzen. A staysail always flies forward of the mainmast and always inside another sail, be it another staysail, jib, Genoa, etc. On smaller boats they are used to breakup the sailplan to make it easier to handle, which is a feature hardly needed on a trawlers whose sails, if any, are dinky.
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Old 10-27-2012, 12:37 PM   #32
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Greetings,
The ONLY experience I've had with a steadying sail is an aprox. 30 sq.' "fabric" I flew from a mast on the FB and amidships of a 34' Marine Trader DC and the ONLY time I noticed any effect was with a following and quartering steady wind of aprox. 25 knts. The wind induced a heel of 10 degrees or so and seemed to dampen the roll. The BAD thing was the boom impeded access to the cooler where all the cold drinks were stored and the mate kept banging her head on it....enough said.
The GOOD thing about it was I could yell and scream "right of way" to all our boating buddies arising in nasty replies and a substantial amount of hilarity.
So I suppose there IS some advantage under specific conditions and one could always hold a cold container of drink to the newly induced cranial topography.
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Old 10-27-2012, 01:57 PM   #33
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The GOOD thing about it was I could yell and scream "right of way" to all our boating buddies...
I think, but I'd have to go look it up, that if a sailboat has its sails up but is also under power that the basic powerboat stand-on, give-way rules apply.

Delfin--- I understand your explanation, thanks. I've posted this shot that I took in Maine before, but I'm assuming that this would be considered a steady sail?
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Old 10-27-2012, 03:41 PM   #34
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Greetings,
Mr. Farin. You're absolutely correct. If a boat is motor-sailing, it is considered a power boat. THAT's what made it all the more hilarious.
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Old 10-27-2012, 03:49 PM   #35
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Aha! I get it. Slow on the uptake today.
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Old 10-27-2012, 07:34 PM   #36
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I think, but I'd have to go look it up, that if a sailboat has its sails up but is also under power that the basic powerboat stand-on, give-way rules apply.

Delfin--- I understand your explanation, thanks. I've posted this shot that I took in Maine before, but I'm assuming that this would be considered a steady sail?
Marin, since they are at anchor, the sail is a "riding sail". If they were underway, it would be a "steadying sail", although with the mast so far aft, it would more like be a "pain in the ass sail", a nautical term not yet discussed.
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Old 10-27-2012, 07:57 PM   #37
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A pain would be right. But as I'm sure you know and as it was explained to me by the owner of the boat pictured these masts and sails are made to be quickly set up once the boat is on a mooring or at anchor. They use them to keep the boats pointed into the winds, rain, and waves. My guess is that, like the mast on our saiing dingy, the mast pictured comes apart into a couple of sections for stowage. Quite a few of the boats moored in this bay had them when I took this shot.
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Old 10-28-2012, 12:44 AM   #38
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A pain would be right. But as I'm sure you know and as it was explained to me by the owner of the boat pictured these masts and sails are made to be quickly set up once the boat is on a mooring or at anchor. They use them to keep the boats pointed into the winds, rain, and waves. My guess is that, like the mast on our saiing dingy, the mast pictured comes apart into a couple of sections for stowage. Quite a few of the boats moored in this bay had them when I took this shot.
I wonder if that sail doesn't help them in fishing for whatever they're going after. It might be useful to be weather cocked while doing their work. Know what they're fishing for? I don't see a puller....
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Old 10-28-2012, 02:54 AM   #39
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It's a lobsterboat. The pot puller on most of them is on the starboard side next to the helm and that side of the pilothouse is open. Occasionally one sees a lobsterboat with the pot puller on the port side. And on Prince Edward Island and perhaps otehr areas in the Maritimes and Maine the port side side of the pilothouse has a hinged side and a sliding aft bulkhead so te pilothouse can be closed of when the boat is running in crummy weather.

My first shot is a new port-puller lobsterboat in Maine, second shot is a PEI boat with the aft and starboard sides of the pilothouse opened, third shot is a PEI boat with them closed.

The pot puller if you don't know already is the small powered drum next to the helm. In this position the fellow running the boat can also pull the pots up.

The boat in the riding sail shot has a closed-off aft bulkhead. I don't know if it opens nor do I know if the starboard side of the pilothouse is open or can be closed off, too.
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Old 10-28-2012, 06:36 AM   #40
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Fishing trawlers used them:
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