Splicing Wires

[Nomad Willy]

The OP mentioned crimp connectors so I assume the wire isn't smaller than what would be appropriate for the smallest crimp connector that as far as I know is the red colored crimps.

I would use them. But not solder. In my ultralight flying days I started out using soldered connected wires thinking I was doing a good job only to find out that vibration would break the wire right at the end of the solder. Engineers would probably call that point a stress riser. The wire would break just like you were trying to break a wire by bending it back and forth. The more vibration the more soldered wires break this way. The crimp connectors don't seem to do that.

On my radar arch I crimped all the connectors minimizing their number and sealed them w 5200 or similar. Lasted 8 years at least. I think it helps to feather out the sealer so the bending part of the wire is as long as practical. If you don't like the globed on look of the sealer shrink wrapping is a positive move.

As for splicing a coaxial cable it is easily done if you know what you're doing as I did when I was an electronics technician in the Navy. That was in the 60s. Now I'd get a new cable.

 

[Tom.B]

That is a ****-ton of wires in a single bundle to try and fix if you don't have some pretty good slobbering skills. I took a college course in it and I don't know that I would attempt it. It's not that I couldn't do it, it's just that I wouldn't trust it for very long after. More importantly, it would take many hours to get right.

Can you pull the whole bundle out of the arch and get it on a bench to work on it? That would be key to me.

 

[Larry M]

We spliced our Furuno Radar. We talked to 3 different Furuno installers/specialists/etc. The answer was, "it's done all the time". Right or wrong, here's what we did. The original installers left a service loop under the seat by the fly bridge. We had 24 wires in varying gauges. A water proof box and 2 euro type terminal strips. The coax was a bit of pain. The shields I tied together. This was 2 years ago and it has work.

 

[Tom.B]

Hey! That's pretty slick, Larry. Nice.

 

[SCOTTEDAVIS]

Can you tell me what you use? I have only ever used the standard automotive crimps. I have tried them but after sometime they ALWAYS end up corroded. I have even the 'marine corrosion resistant' terminals would always come up corroded. Not so much the terminals themselves but the wires inside.

Every one that i have ever put on i have either filled the barrel of the terminal with solder or cut off the connector and soldered the wire.

If there is a better way i am open to learning. I may have a hard time parting with a c-note for a wire crimper. But if the tool makes the difference i could be convinced...Do you loan yours?

I have soldered everything from generator wiring for my camper, to race cars instrumentation, trailer lights (think road salt), to various things in our fresh water boats.

Not one of my solder joints have ever got a crack, split or failed. If they do that then they were cold jointed or disturbed. it is a skill and just sticking it together isn't good enough.


admittedly, The marine environment is still somewhat new to me. I do try to do things the 'right' way.

I use a heat shrink with sealer/adhesive butt connecter (Anchor brand) and a ratcheting crimp-set with the correct size dies for the connecter, this is for all "inside" connections.

For "out side and bilge" I do as above but add an adhesive lined heat shrink sleeve to the connection.

I buy my connectors from any good marine supply house and have found Anchor to be of very satisfactory quality, pricey yes, but like I said, only do it once.

Saltwater spray, mist, vapor, smell is the most nasty thing to electrical stuff and will destroy a poor connection quite fast.

When I flip a switch I want whats connected to it to work.

 

[Richard W]

No problem splicing power wires, but as ksanders said, one of the cables is signal cable. It's either RF coax cable, or a twisted pairs network cable similar to today's CAT5E Ethernet cables. I suspect the latest as you indicated seeing "telephone" wires.

If it is a twisted pairs cable you can splice it or install RJ45 male and female connectors (specialized tools required).

If splicing make note how the individual pairs of wires are twisted and retain it while splicing. The twisting protects pairs from each other and from external interference. This might be a bit finicky as each wire and each pair soldering points must be stacked and insulated from each other. If there is any external shielding, recreate it too.

I think you will find terminating the ends with RJ45 connectors easier. Again, these could be male and female connectors, or two male connectors, one on each side of the signal cable plus double female mating piece.

 

[rwidman]

Lots of advice here, some pretty good and some not so good.

Certainly twisting the wires together and putting a drop of solder on them is in the "not so good" category. If you don't know how to solder wires neatly and correctly, soldering should be off the table unless you hire someone to do it.

Wrapping the connections in electrical tape for insulation or "mechanical fastening" is also in the "not so good" category. Tape is not permanent and doesn't stand up to heat, cold and moisture.

Repairing these conductors as a way to put new skills to work could result in failure at the worst time. If one wants to try out new skills, practicing on scraps of wire would be best.

Additional plugs and sockets are additional potential points of failure.

Anything 18 gauge or larger should be spliced with marine grade crimp connectors appropriate for the wire gauge. The best are the ones with the adhesive filled heat shrink tubing attached. Done correctly they are waterproof and vibration proof.

Smaller conductors can be spliced with the ScotchLok connectors shown above but again, be sure they are the appropriate size for the conductors. Keep in mind that they are heavy enough that when subject to vibration they could eventually fatigue the wires. It would be best to secure them in place to avoid this.

Personally, I would solder the very small wires and cover the joint with heat shrink tubing but I have many years experience as an electronic technician and have made thousands of soldered connections. I wouldn't suggest that a beginner do this on a boat and a critical system.

 

[SCOTTEDAVIS]

Lots of advice here, some pretty good and some not so good.

Certainly twisting the wires together and putting a drop of solder on them is in the "not so good" category. If you don't know how to solder wires neatly and correctly, soldering should be off the table unless you hire someone to do it.

Wrapping the connections in electrical tape for insulation or "mechanical fastening" is also in the "not so good" category. Tape is not permanent and doesn't stand up to heat, cold and moisture.

Repairing these conductors as a way to put new skills to work could result in failure at the worst time. If one wants to try out new skills, practicing on scraps of wire would be best.

Additional plugs and sockets are additional potential points of failure.

Anything 18 gauge or larger should be spliced with marine grade crimp connectors appropriate for the wire gauge. The best are the ones with the adhesive filled heat shrink tubing attached. Done correctly they are waterproof and vibration proof.

Smaller conductors can be spliced with the ScotchLok connectors shown above but again, be sure they are the appropriate size for the conductors. Keep in mind that they are heavy enough that when subject to vibration they could eventually fatigue the wires. It would be best to secure them in place to avoid this.

Personally, I would solder the very small wires and cover the joint with heat shrink tubing but I have many years experience as an electronic technician and have made thousands of soldered connections. I wouldn't suggest that a beginner do this on a boat and a critical system.

May I add a +1 to this post. I agree completely.

 

[kevmiami]

I used to routinely splice 12v bilge pump wires with anchor adhesive butt connectors. They were often submerged & always damp - never had a single failure. Trick is to use good crimper, pull firmly to test (good crimp is actually fusing wires physically) and slowly rotate crimp while you heat; making sure you visually see adhesive seep out fully around wire. Never fails :^)

 

[motion30]

,I was forced to repair a cable on a Raymarine radar the same as you. A trip to Radio Shack will get you the proper size connectors. use quality heat shrink tubing of the correct size and you will not have any problems

 

[MC Escher]

I think the determining factor here is that it is a very old unit that I plan on replacing in the next year or so at the most. I'll take a stab at a repair first. Gives me a chance to practice a new skill.

That's certainly your prerogative, but if you do that and it DOES fail, you do know WHEN it will fail, right?

 

[psneeld]

Folks...it's only a RADAR and unless he's a diehard..many don't cruise at night or foul weather....even then RADAR is nice but hardly an emergency if it doesn't work....especially if you even think it might and plan around it's possible failure.

I see any of the suggestions as possibles...

Me...like LarryM did ( a very well travelled long distance cruiser)....I'd use a euro style terminal strip for future disconnects and put it in a weather proof housing. And that's after doing all the different ways already suggested when installing gear for a marine electronics firm.

 

[rwidman]

,I was forced to repair a cable on a Raymarine radar the same as you. A trip to Radio Shack will get you the proper size connectors. use quality heat shrink tubing of the correct size and you will not have any problems

I would not use Radio Shack terminals if there's any possibility of finding another brand. When I did this sort of thing for a living, Radio Shack was our last resort. We didn't want to have to go back and do work over again because of faulty materials.

Take a Anchor brand connector with you to Radio Shack and you'll see the difference.

 

[MC Escher]

Folks...it's only a RADAR and unless he's a diehard..many don't cruise at night or foul weather....even then RADAR is nice but hardly an emergency if it doesn't work....especially if you even think it might and plan around it's possible failure.

Let me ask you a hypothetical question...

Suppose you found yourself in the absurdly contrived position of being in a room with 100 pretty girls and you could kiss any one of them. Kissing 99 of them carries no consequence whatsoever, but ONE of them is carrying a terrible disease and if you contract it you will die in hideous suffering.

Do you kiss any of them?



Please understand that I am not disagreeing with what you said. I just don't want my concern to be misunderstood.

I'm simply pointing out that risk is a function of multiple variables. Low Risk + High Consequence and High Risk + Low Consequence both produce an undesirable outcome.


It's like homeowner's insurance. Nobody buys it because they REALLY believe their house is going to burn down. They buy it because if it does, they want to be protected.



One last thing...
My concern is really based on the types of cable being used and the implications of their use. I suspect that if there if there is any UTP being used that it is part of something like an RS-232 cable or something similar. Or even higher rate. That's all. If that's not the case then what I said is irrelevant.

Anyway, everyone have a good weekend. I've got to run.

 

[Ski in NC]

I'd just splice it using your favorite methods, seal it with shrink wrap and see if it works.

If it works and the connections are sealed, I think the risk of it failing unexpectedly are pretty low. How much vibration do you really think the repair is exposed to?

Radars poop all the time. It's a nav aid, rarely is it vital.

 

[psneeld]

Let me ask you a hypothetical question...

Suppose you found yourself in the absurdly contrived position of being in a room with 100 pretty girls and you could kiss any one of them. Kissing 99 of them carries no consequence whatsoever, but ONE of them is carrying a terrible disease and if you contract it you will die in hideous suffering.

Do you kiss any of them?



Please understand that I am not disagreeing with what you said. I just don't want my concern to be misunderstood.

I'm simply pointing out that risk is a function of multiple variables. Low Risk + High Consequence and High Risk + Low Consequence both produce an undesirable outcome.


It's like homeowner's insurance. Nobody buys it because they REALLY believe their house is going to burn down. They buy it because if it does, they want to be protected.



One last thing...
My concern is really based on the types of cable being used and the implications of their use. I suspect that if there if there is any UTP being used that it is part of something like an RS-232 cable or something similar. Or even higher rate. That's all. If that's not the case then what I said is irrelevant.

Anyway, everyone have a good weekend. I've got to run.

having my experience at sea and boats..and the number of radar cables that I have installed and spliced...your hypothetical is just that...

I was underway today for 10 hours into my annual trip of 2500 miles and then 8 months solid of commercial marine work....how about you?

Plus the number one thin I push here on TF is that recreational boating can be an X-treme sport if you make it or as benign as a friendly game of golf...depends how you approach it...not evey time you get underway is it a mission to Mars.

 

[BobH]

If at all possible I would go with a terminal strip if a new cable is not an option. That way you have a way to disconnect the cable in the future if needed.

Bob

 

[psneeld]

I'd just splice it using your favorite methods, seal it with shrink wrap and see if it works.

If it works and the connections are sealed, I think the risk of it failing unexpectedly are pretty low. How much vibration do you really think the repair is exposed to?

Radars poop all the time. It's a nav aid, rarely is it vital.

Thank you...very good point.

Plus from my experience...most small boat radars really aren't all that useful when you REALLY need them...like picking out the buoys in a foggy, breaking inlet at night....I just pray the chatplotter is 100%. Even if the radar works OK, the skipper is just barely up to it....maybe....

 

[psneeld]

If at all possible I would go with a terminal strip if a new cable is not an option. That way you have a way to disconnect the cable in the future if needed.

Bob

Absolutely...it's what I have seen dozens of times by many a pro marine electronics outfit once the cable was cut for shipping (radar arch removed).

Their opinion...will be ready for the next time.

And why would a well protected (and visible for inspection versus crimps and heat shrink) terminal strip be any diff than a plug on an extension cable?

And from my installer days.... all the major brands said repair was OK as long as the cable length wasn't substantially changed...especially on the older Raytheon models.

 

[CaptTom]

I've had the misfortune to have to splice a radar cable twice. Both times, I didn't have ANY extra cable to allow a "proper" splice using terminal strips and a waterproof box.

The wires will be all shapes and sizes. Some will be twisted pairs, one might be shielded. The whole bundle may be shielded. None should be solid conductors, all should be stranded wire. You should try to keep the separation of the twisted pairs to a bare minimum. Make absolutely sure you maintain the continuity of the shielding.

Most of these wires are just too small for a proper heat-shrink crimped butt splice. I was forced to go with a soldered connection on those. Staggered to the extent possible, and well insulated; heat-shrink tubing where possible.

The first one I did lasted at least 7 years, and was still going strong last I knew.

The biggest problem with solder is that it makes a stiff connection, and vibrations cause the strands to flex just at the point where the solder ends. This causes a weak spot that could eventually break. My thought is that with these tiny wires, all insulated and tightly wrapped in a bundle, the lateral movement at these points will be minimal.