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Old 12-28-2014, 06:37 PM   #61
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Four is better than two!
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Old 12-28-2014, 06:37 PM   #62
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Don't two engines have twice the failure rate of a single engine?
No, only 1.95 times.

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Old 12-28-2014, 06:57 PM   #63
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Four is better than two!
8 is better than 4!
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Old 12-28-2014, 07:13 PM   #64
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Originally Posted by markpierce View Post
Don't two engines have twice the failure rate of a single engine?
Mark as you have read here on YF, singles never break down. Following that logic, two won't ever break down either.
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Old 12-28-2014, 07:18 PM   #65
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Mark as you have read here on YF, singles never break down. Following that logic, two won't ever break down either.
That's very reassuring.
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Old 12-29-2014, 12:00 AM   #66
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Should I just tack this thread onto the back of this thread Single vs Twin: It's Baaaaack! ?
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Old 12-29-2014, 12:26 AM   #67
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Should I just tack this thread onto the back of this thread Single vs Twin: It's Baaaaack! ?
Sorry - I got told in no uncertain terms that I was not allowed to shut it down.

I didn't actually ask or state which was better - not that it made any difference.

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Old 12-29-2014, 12:39 AM   #68
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Sorry - I got told in no uncertain terms that I was not allowed to shut it down..

Richard
Richard, you couldn`t know where the words "single" and "twin" in one sentence lead. Now leave it alone, it might go back to sleep.
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Old 12-29-2014, 12:40 AM   #69
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8 is better than 4!
Is this... real??? That can't be real... Please tell me that's photoshopped.
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Old 12-29-2014, 02:52 AM   #70
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Well, I had a single engine failure on Saturday morning.

Ok, it was dirtside in my Mercedes ML320 CDI but it was still disconcerting as the engine died completely and without warning halfway across an intersection on a major road. I coasted to the side, largely clear of the intersection. Now I quite like the engine, a common rail V6, but was perplexed as to why it died when it did.

Roadside assistance could not figure out the issue either. The starter would not engage even though the battery tested OK. A jumper pack would not get the starter to turn over, there were no error codes when the guy connected his diagnostic unit. So, it towed to the dealer who needed several hours this morning to find the problem.

It turns out that an Esky I had in the back the day before was not watertight and a bag of ice eventually melted, and the water ran down to the lowest point in the car. That happens to be the battery compartment under the drivers seat. That compartment also houses an electronic control unit. It got wet and shorted.

Now no-one would install a non-waterproof ECU in the bilge of a boat, so what were those damn Germans thinking putting one in the bilge of an SUV?

The good news is that I'll have the car back on the road tomorrow. My daughters will be happy too. They are only just getting organised to manage with one car after the Mazda 3 was totalled in the recent hailstorm, and my commandeering of the Golf for very important trips was tolerated but a little annoying. Oh, and speaking of annoying, the new ECU cost for the ML is $2,700.
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Old 12-29-2014, 04:39 AM   #71
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Brian,
Exactly what I was saying about these modern electronic engines.
But I am in the same boat (car) as you, but gotta luv that ML320 electronics or not.

My daughter was in the same situation , her car got written off during that storm in Bris, but they paid her out (agreed value) very quickly and she picked up her new Mazda 3 last week, one happy girl.

Cheers
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Old 12-29-2014, 05:56 AM   #72
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Insequent View Post
Well, I had a single engine failure on Saturday morning.

Ok, it was dirtside in my Mercedes ML320 CDI but it was still disconcerting as the engine died completely and without warning halfway across an intersection on a major road. I coasted to the side, largely clear of the intersection. Now I quite like the engine, a common rail V6, but was perplexed as to why it died when it did.

Roadside assistance could not figure out the issue either. The starter would not engage even though the battery tested OK. A jumper pack would not get the starter to turn over, there were no error codes when the guy connected his diagnostic unit. So, it towed to the dealer who needed several hours this morning to find the problem.

It turns out that an Esky I had in the back the day before was not watertight and a bag of ice eventually melted, and the water ran down to the lowest point in the car. That happens to be the battery compartment under the drivers seat. That compartment also houses an electronic control unit. It got wet and shorted.

Now no-one would install a non-waterproof ECU in the bilge of a boat, so what were those damn Germans thinking putting one in the bilge of an SUV?

The good news is that I'll have the car back on the road tomorrow. My daughters will be happy too. They are only just getting organised to manage with one car after the Mazda 3 was totalled in the recent hailstorm, and my commandeering of the Golf for very important trips was tolerated but a little annoying. Oh, and speaking of annoying, the new ECU cost for the ML is $2,700.

Holy sh1t !!!
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Old 12-29-2014, 08:51 AM   #73
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mark: Indeed the chance of a failure with two engines is greater than with one however the consequences of failure is significantly reduced.


With engines set up to be independent you can shut one down and continue on without interruption. Other than being beside a noisy engine I could do any work on one engine with the other running. Hopefully someone else would be driving the boat and on watch.
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Old 12-29-2014, 09:28 AM   #74
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Reliability (twin or single) is a direct result of design, the design for remote cruising would have structure and machinery extremely robust along with full complement of spares the owner could replace in addition keeping a vessel reliable a very comprehensive maintenance plan. Take a good look at Norhavn and you can see it.
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Old 12-29-2014, 09:28 AM   #75
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Greetings,
The chance of failure of a twin engined vessel is exactly the same as for two single engined vessels and as Mr. bayview so rightly observes, the consequences are MUCH different. To suggest otherwise seems to be based on personal bias.
To re-answer the PO's question "... what do people do when they're single engine breaks down?" Either, wait for assistance or fix the problem in place given the spares, tools and abilities of the people on board. Case closed.
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Old 12-29-2014, 09:54 AM   #76
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I promise I'm not a troller in the trawler forum. I understand that the single vs twin engine (or get home) is a quasi-religious question. However, it's going to factor into my decision and I'd love some input.

So here's my question - and it's not "which is better?" Rather, what do people do when they're single engine breaks down? Here are some options that come to my mind

1) Call for a tow home - this is ok if you're in range of a tow company. I have had the BoatUS Gold Towing service for over a decade and wouldn't be without it

[Let's assume you're making a coastal passage and not in tow boat range]

2) Fix the engine. The most likely things to stop a well maintained cruising engine can be fixed by the well-prepared skipper who has spares (fuel filters, pumps, hoses, impellers, etc)

3) Is there a number 3?

It's a serious concern for me - since I intend on making coastal passages and expect to be out of tow boat range. However, if people do this without undue risk then I'd like to be able to consider single engine boats.

Thanks

Richard
Richard,

Having read all of the above, I hope what you take from it is that's there is no right or wrong.

Find the boat that works for you; in most cases, that alone will make the decision for you.
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Old 12-29-2014, 10:05 AM   #77
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Old 12-29-2014, 10:11 AM   #78
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Take a good look at Norhavn and you can see it.
Yes indeed, I can see a very well laid out ER you can move around in and standing proud is a SPARE decent sized engine with separate prop shaft.
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Old 12-29-2014, 10:12 AM   #79
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Is this... real??? That can't be real... Please tell me that's photoshopped.
It's real!
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Think you'd need those drugs before you open the throttles.
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Old 12-29-2014, 12:37 PM   #80
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The chance of failure of a twin engined vessel is exactly the same as for two single engined vessels
Assuming you are referring to JUST the engines, then - theoretically - yes.

But in the real world, off-side maintenance on twins suffers from accessibility. Out of sight, out of mind may apply - if not to you, then to the POs. It's easy (on my boat) to get all around the engine with an IR thermometer while running - I cannot imagine a twin owner attempting that. Off-side coolant leaks? Oil leaks? Corrosion? Any type of connection at all? Definitely not equivalent to single.

And then we get into maintenance costs. Some folks here do everything "by the book", others are on a budget - or their POs were on budgets.

And that's just the engines themselves. Running gear...there is truly no comparison to a single keel-protected prop.

And then there's the real world maneuverability of a twin with small rudders running with one engine.

Honestly, I (personally) wouldn't be more confident with twin engines - and suspect that they may bring a false confidence to the less experienced.
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