shore power cord problems

[tinped]

Corrosion is not the big enemy of copper inhibiting its ability to conduct electricity,oxidation is,which boeshield makes no claim on.Think your water mains at your house,they are copper,and corrosion was the big enemy,copper would never have been used for that purpose,in fact,there ability to resist corrosion was why copper was chosen.Im not saying that copper doesn't corrode,but that it has a high resistance properties.From the boeshield website,they claim to inhibit corrosion,displace water,and lubricate.No mention of oxidation.Sounds very close to the claims of wd-40 to me.It may be superior to wd 40,no argument here with some additional capabilities over wd-40.I just feel that there are better alternatives.IMHO.

 

[rwidman]

........... There is something to be said for following the herd and sticking with the industry standard, even if there are better options out there. ..

The other side is that the "leading edge" is also known as the "bleeding edge".

BTW: My good friend who was repairing VCRs back in the day told me that the Beta design was slightly better technically than the VHS design . We all know how that turned out.

 

[Capt.Bill11]

Corrosion is not the big enemy of copper inhibiting its ability to conduct electricity,oxidation is,which boeshield makes no claim on.

But if the surface is coated it can't oxidize, yes?

Just like if you polish and coat copper.

 

[tinped]

Not necessarily.Corrosion would be the effects of salt,and moisture.Oxidation is a deposit of carbon that is a natural reaction.Black color is indication of oxidation,whereas copper usually turns green with corrosion.That is why I was saying couldn't hurt with the boeshield.But if there are two potential problems with copper,in the marine environment,both considered harmful,why mitigate one,and not the other?Especially when there are products that specifically inhibit both?

 

[Jeffrey S]

Because you could lose or damage your cord and need one this afternoon.

I guess I only considered the possibility of a plug burning up. And the moment you switch to SmartPlug is the moment that alternative is taken off the table.

If you're going around losing your 50 amp power cable, you likely have other problems and perhaps you shouldn't be plugging things into sockets.

I had two SmartPlug inlets on aCappella for 5+ years. They're still on now and behaving perfectly (lucky next owner). My only problem with an inlet on a boat I owned happened recently with Red Head and one of those old, crappy Marinco inlets that burned up before I got around to checking them for the first time. I can't wait to change the 4 power inlets to SmartPlugs...

 

[tinped]

Unless someone steals it,same problem,just not caused by the boat! lol

 

[Jeffrey S]

Unless someone steals it,same problem,just not caused by the boat! lol

I guess I just stay in a better class of marinas. I've never heard of someone having their 50 amp cord stolen.

 

[tinped]

come to new jersey,there were three breakins at our marina this past spring.Many boats vandalized.

 

[FF]

"come to new jersey,there were three breakins at our marina this past spring.Many boats vandalized."

NJ motto,

If you cant Steal it Destroy it!

 

[tinped]

so true!!

 

[tinped]

Ironically,the SSCA just posted on facebook a post about chaining your y-adapter to prevent theft of it.Not sure if they only meant new jersey!!!

 

[rwidman]

I guess I only considered the possibility of a plug burning up. And the moment you switch to SmartPlug is the moment that alternative is taken off the table.

If you're going around losing your 50 amp power cable, you likely have other problems and perhaps you shouldn't be plugging things into sockets.
..

Jeffery, it's a shame you can't find the words to make your point without having to add a personal insult.

It is possible to lose a power cord by theft, dropping it in the water or just taking off without it. It's also possible to damage a shorepower cord or for someone else to damage it.

And remember, this new plug does nothing to improve the dock connection. It's still the same old twist lock and doesn't even have the retaining ring.

Jeffery, everyone who doesn't think like you isn't an idiot. We consider the options as they apply to our needs and wants, then we pay our money and take our choice.

 

[Codger2]

If you're going around losing your 50 amp power cable, you likely have other problems and perhaps you shouldn't be plugging things into sockets.

 

[Jeffrey S]

Jeffery, it's a shame you can't find the words to make your point without having to add a personal insult.

Why is it an insult to point out that the only realistic damage is when it burns up.

I've never experienced or heard of a power cord theft. Although the recent Facebook postings with the lock and Y-adapter had some people saying they had experienced it. Again, I just think I must be staying at better quality marinas, free docks, municipal walls, or something because I've never seen it. It's not an insult. It's my experience.

I've also never forgotten a cable or pulled away from the dock with it still plugged in. There are a myriad of things you can do to damage your own boat. I sort of thought the discussion was about the more common things that can happen when you think everything is OK.

And remember, this new plug does nothing to improve the dock connection. It's still the same old twist lock and doesn't even have the retaining ring.

But if that catches fire, it's off my boat. And I have witnessed a pedastal on fire from the boat next to me. The result was no damage to any boat. That wouldn't happen if an onboard inlet connector caught fire.

Jeffery, everyone who doesn't think like you isn't an idiot. We consider the options as they apply to our needs and wants, then we pay our money and take our choice.

Look, I realize that no matter what I say, there are some people who are going to fight my comment and parse every little word of it. But the only one here insulting someone is you.

 

[rwidman]

Jeffery, when I saw that you had replied to this thread, I was hoping for an apology or at the least some sort of retraction of your insult.


Alas, I expected too much of you.

 

[tinped]

clearly while its much easier to think inside the box to possible scenarios,I am a murphys law kind of person.Just me.Cant help it,so I wont apologize.The discussion evolves around possible scenarios that would have to cause you to replace the cord,and the convienence of quickly obtaining the smart plug option.While an actuary might only consider the most likely situations to occur by odds,we live in the real world ,and "s" happens.

 

[smitty477]

Twist lock connectors are used extensively in many commercial applications at larger factories I have worked at. Similarly they are utilized at mining operations and also at the never ending huge amounts of traveling fairs in the Northeast area where we live. Most all of these larger fairs have 1,000's of these connectors utilized in a temporary use in the immediate area of a huge visiting public. Like any device it relies upon a person to do an install. a de-install, and to maintain it.

 

[dhays]

The other side is that the "leading edge" is also known as the "bleeding edge".

BTW: My good friend who was repairing VCRs back in the day told me that the Beta design was slightly better technically than the VHS design . We all know how that turned out.

? Yup.

 

[dhays]

clearly while its much easier to think inside the box to possible scenarios,I am a murphys law kind of person.Just me.Cant help it,so I wont apologize.The discussion evolves around possible scenarios that would have to cause you to replace the cord,and the convienence of quickly obtaining the smart plug option.While an actuary might only consider the most likely situations to occur by odds,we live in the real world ,and "s" happens.

This is a good point. On my sailboat I bought a Smartplug cord and converted my existing 30amp cord. Both are being sold with the boat. I kept one on the dock and one on the boat. However, if I was to lose or damage the cord while away, it would be very difficult to replace.

OTOH, the most likely scenario would be to damage the pedestal end of the cord. Since that is a standard twist lock, a replacement end could be found quickly and replaced with existing tools on the boat. The cord itself is much less likely to be stolen than a standard cord for the very reason it might be a problem. It is non-standard and therefore much less useful to a financially challenged boater.

 

[tinped]

good point about the likelihood of who would steal it,unless it is just someone looking for copper.

 

[Codger2]

Look, I realize that no matter what I say, there are some people who are going to fight my comment and parse every little word of it. But the only one here insulting someone is you.

Hang in there Jeffrey! In the boating world, the "not invented here" syndrome is rampant. People tend to believe that their approach to anything marine is the correct (& only) approach & nothing you can say will change their minds. The beauty of this forum is the exchange of information and it's up to the user as to whether or not he/she accepts and utilizes that info. I must say that based on my own experience I've read some posts on here that are down right dangerous!

 

[psneeld]

50 A 125/250 corded plugs...splits the difference of reliability...maybe even closer to smart plug reliability and they are too heavy to run with....

Can't ever see owning a boat above 30 feet without 50A 125/250 unless I hardly use it or all I ever run at the dock is a battery charger, fridge and water heater.

So it costs a lot more...then the old argument by the box thinkers....more than a fire?

 

[tinped]

need a bigger fridge with more beer storage,that might justify a larger shore power cord. LOL

 

[smitty477]

"This is a good point. On my sailboat I bought a Smartplug cord and converted my existing 30amp cord. Both are being sold with the boat. I kept one on the dock and one on the boat. However, if I was to lose or damage the cord while away, it would be very difficult to replace."


Perhaps another option for those very concerned about the boat side connector and/or theft is to hard wire the boat side inside where it is safe a provide a water tight seal where the cord leaves the boat. Could be similar to the auto reel Glendenning system without the complexity and cost - just role it up inside a seat or container.
Then you do not have the cost or replacement problems of the smart plug, the contacts of the twist lock and the theft potential of either.
And as you point out easy to repair if that becomes necessary.


"Since that is a standard twist lock, a replacement end could be found quickly and replaced with existing tools on the boat."

 

[tinped]

Not sure that is legal by abyc standards,but not sure.On land based electrical,Rubber cord is not legal to be used with a permanent connection point when it comes to a sub-feeder.I am not abyc certified,and even though abyc takes most of its direction from the nec,there are variations.Perhaps someone else has access to,or knowledge of these particular standards. Good question.

 

[smitty477]

"Not sure that is legal by abyc standards,but not sure.On land based electrical,Rubber cord is not legal to be used with a permanent connection point when it comes to a sub-feeder"


How do all the glendenning systems so it then? Are they not to up to the abyc standards?
Never had one so I would not know myself.

 

[tinped]

"Not sure that is legal by abyc standards,but not sure.On land based electrical,Rubber cord is not legal to be used with a permanent connection point when it comes to a sub-feeder"


How do all the glendenning systems so it then? Are they not to up to the abyc standards?
Never had one so I would not know myself.

sorry,needed to check codebook on this one.According to the nec,not abyc,and I quote from 400-8 as to uses not permitted,Flexible cords are not to be used as a substitute for fixed wiring of a structure.Attaching it permanently to the boat creates a fixed wiring situation.There are also addendums as to protection,and supports needed.The cablemasters complies with these nec codes by creating a retractible system that is independently hooked up by the cablemaster,while also complying with the protection issued by reeling the wire up when not in use.In other words,the other end of the shore power cable from the glennmaster is attached to the glennmaster,by approved methods,then the cablemaster connects to the power source.The shore power cable does not go directly to the boat buss.Hope that helps.

 

[Bacchus]

WOW! It Seems Shore Power Cords Have Taken Over for Anchors!!!

I'd be willing to bet None of the 175+ posts have changed anyone's mind but the arguments sure are interesting...

I urge everyone to look over the Compass Marine article & photos and make your own decision - for what ever reasons you like.

I thought the discussion re: copper corrosion / oxidation particularly interesting but wonder what copper are folks referring to?
Wire - it's tinned to prevent / reduce it
Plugs / inlets - they aren't copper (NIckel plated brass I believe?)

Some suggest rewiring to 50A plugs / cord / inlet which can get pretty expensive and dangerous if done by an amateur.
For those obsessed w/ needing a replacement anything - carry a spare like we do w/ many boat parts

Take a deep breath and give it a rest

 

[Tom.B]

I have a question (in an attempt to get us back on track)...

Would it make sense to have both connectors on the boat side? You know, in case you DO drop one overboard or something. I don't imagine it would be safe to just parallel the plugs because when one was energized, the pins of the other would be passing current, but I don't see it and an extremely difficult problem to solve. Have a smart plug as primary, but maintain the old Hubble connector.

But you know... As I sit here and type this, I suppose a pigtail from SmartPlug to twist would be safer, easier, and cheaper to do sould something horrible happen to your primary and you need to borrow or buy one in a rush.

Nevermind.

 

[tinped]

you could ,but unfortunately another can of worms,as a separate disconnect(boat side)would by required,and possibly a transfer switch,because you have the potential to feepower into power inlets,doubling the amperage,exceeding the mains,etc.