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Old 08-21-2014, 09:20 PM   #21
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Now me, on the other hand....I look for something that will keep me totally occupied with laborious projects instead of enjoyment. When I was younger, it took perhaps a dozen or more land vehicles to do that, but now that I'm older, a single boat works perfectly!
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Old 08-21-2014, 09:25 PM   #22
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Greetings,
Mr. Marin. I concur and might I add: "Gee willikers...I had a so many foot brand X years ago. I wish I had it now". I've heard that on several occasions.
Inciteful observation, Mr. Marx, and a very valid one. We, too, have heard a lot of boaters over the years who have "moved up" from their original cruising boat to newer, larger, and fancier boats say, "We love our [current] boat but you, know, the best boat we've ever had was that first one."

I've personally heard this the most from various Grand Banks owners over the years. They talk to us from the decks of their GB42s or 46s or 52s or brand new Eastbays, and the boat they invariably speak of as their favorite is the little GB32 they started out with.

I believe this has a lot more to do with the sense of new adventure and new experiences they had with that first boat rather than the boat itself.

My wife and I have taken a whole lot of narrowboat holidays in the UK since 1990. We've used a variety of boats, the last several cruises with a wonderful 60-footer that is patterned after the famous working boats of the 1930s. Our very first trip was with an old, 50-foot, soon-to-be-retired, wood-topsides boat named Ash. (The owner of the hire-boat company named all his boats after trees).

Ash's transmission crapped out toward the end of our two-week cruise (they are designed to break in forward gear so you can always move the boat), and it took a couple of mechanic's visits to where we had tied up to set it right again.

But when we look back at all the narrowboat cruises we've taken so far, while all the trips have been great, the one we remember most fondly is that first one in tired old Ash. The later boats eclipsed it in every way, but nothing has ever equalled that very first time we tackled something new and met the challenges, and Ash was the boat that helped us do it.
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Old 08-21-2014, 09:45 PM   #23
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Hello fellow boaters, well it appears my post worked in that it generated discussion and even a little debate. I would like to comment on one post related to those who forever chase their dream boat and never go boating. While it may appear to some that we may fall into this category believe me we do not. We use all our boats extensively, some differently then others but each boat has met is intended use flawlessly brining us great memories and because we do our homework we never take a major hit when we sell. An example is our 22' Mako Center Console we purchased from a dealer in northern California back in 1995 who couldn't give the boats away. We paid his cost, used the boat for five years and sold it for what we paid for it. We have been fortunate to repeat this to varying degrees with another small boat and our first Nordhavn. Now things get interesting for us.

A little background information on our Nordhavn ownership. Soon after building and owning our first N40 my wife advised she just couldn't get us to the slow (6 knot) speed and asked for a quicker boat. Knowing who is boss we put N4050 up for sale expecting the process to take about a year only to receive a full offer within a month. We weren't sure what to do but we decided best to accept the offer and worry about the next boat later. A few boat shows and sea trials on go fast boats resulted in the boss realizing it is difficult to cook, walk around or do just about anything when traveling fast so it was decided slower was better. Back to Nordhavn and N4061 was built. Life was good for about three years until health issues forced us to sell the boat. It should be noted that both boats served our purpose of part time live aboard and coastal cruising when time permitted. N4061 was sold in the worst of times but still did ok minimizing the pain of selling. When we decided it was time to "test the waters" I knew a used boat was in order and we found N3522 which served its purpose of getting us both "back on the water". With that mission accomplished it was time to sell the boat and look for the next boat. I will add that we sold this boat for a price that covered our investment (again we did our homework so not to take a major financial hit).

So when we look for a boat we use the 90% rule which has served us well and take our time going through the process since we cannot afford to make mistakes with our limited budget. While we are still in the process finalizing the next boat and unable to advise the make/model I can say that unless we feel the boat will meet the mission at a price we feel is fair and safe we will not sign a contract. I will also admit that I do enjoy designing / modifying existing designs and making a boat "our boat" which is all in the front end of the journey. Life has worked out that we have been able to do this a few times and have enjoyed the ride. Again, I hope what I have shared helps others starting out realize that doing your homework can pay benefits in the long run.

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Old 08-21-2014, 11:18 PM   #24
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Hello fellow boaters, well it appears my post worked in that it generated discussion and even a little debate. I would like to comment on one post related to those who forever chase their dream boat and never go boating.

John
John

My remarks were not directed specifically at you. They were partially meant to further the previous post that boats mean something different to each person, and each of us gets his and her joy out of boats in different ways.

Every boat in every harbor represents someones dreams. It may be the dream of the single dad like the one I chatted with this last weekend that wants to have something he and his adolescent sons can enjoy together. Or it can be the dreams of world cruising that the owner of the N46 four slips down from me has. Or my dreams of cruising the coastlines of the americas that I keep bugging my wife about getting started on.

The point of my comment was twofold. It was also meant to make people think. To make people realize that its not the lack of a specific brand or type of boat thats holding back their long distance cruising dreams. Its them. Its that life that has a nasty way of getting in the way of ones dreams.

I myself realized that two years ago. I had a dream of cruising to Mexico from Alaska and exploring all along the way. Then going further, through the canal and on to the eastern seaboard. So I bought a boat that could make the trip. Its not the best boat nor is it the worst. But It can make the trip safely. Then I looked myself in the mirror, wondered why I wasn't setting sail and realized that now that I had the boat, life had to catch up with me to realize my cruising dreams. I realized that having the boat didn't make me ready, it just took away an excuse for not cruising.

So, while my comment was not aimed at you specifically, it was aimed at all of us that have long distance cruising dreams, myself included. I am keeping the dream alive and nurturing it through regular boating, skill building, spare parts stocking, and preparing my self and my wife to be able to live those dreams while we are still young enough to actually accomplish them. You are nurturing your boating dreams in your own way, as is every other boater out there.

The ones that I applaud are the Larrys, and the Richards, and the Melanies, and Johns that take off, set sail, and actually live their dreams. They are the inspiration for the rest of us that are waiting for our turn.
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Old 08-22-2014, 08:37 PM   #25
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[QUOTE=ksanders;259715]John

My remarks were not directed specifically at you. They were partially meant to further the previous post that boats mean something different to each person, and each of us gets his and her joy out of boats in different ways.


Kevin, no worries or need for the post. Like you we have a passion for boating and feel blessed we have been able to live a life that included boats. Our main objective with our posts is to share experiences, mistakes and future plans for others to learn from.

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Old 08-22-2014, 08:53 PM   #26
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After a week of business travel which included delayed flights, cancelled flights and ending up in a different airport then which I left only to get close to home its nice to talk about boats again. If nothing else this trip did confirm that we are doing down the right road related to the size, make and cost of the boat we focused upon. The older I get the more I realize how short life is and the desire to retire while I'm still young enough to do things keeps the boating budget in check. Talk about a balancing act of doing it now and still planning for tomorrow. Not easy for the average guy without deep pockets.
A quick update on our search: we selected the engine today and should have final cost numbers by next weekend which will then allow us to make the final decision. We have made over 50 changes to the basic boat spec sheet (a few changes that will impact tooling) and while we could go on forever I think we did enough. Will keep you posted!

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Old 08-25-2014, 10:15 PM   #27
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Electric versus Gas Appliance

Well our search for an electric range went out the window this weekend after learning that the few units we were interested in were all 240V thus we didn't want to stretch the boat wiring costs. We have refocused on LP gas and looking at our options. We are looking at Miele and Thermador. For refrigerator / freezers we are also looking at U-line. Would appreciate any input on these or other brands.

John
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Old 08-26-2014, 05:49 AM   #28
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>We have refocused on LP gas and looking at our options.<

A Marine stove should have a different operating style from a home or RV unit.

The knob should require a push to go on , and the low setting will have an adjustment to prevent inadvertant flame outs from a puff of wind.

You may have to look to euroland for a genuine marine burner set.

IN our RV we have a 120v unit and it is fine , multiple burners and oven.

The 120v elements are surprising in their heat output.

An RV unit could have fiddles or rails added and functioning pot clamps for the bumpy days.
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Old 08-26-2014, 07:24 AM   #29
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Well our search for an electric range went out the window this weekend after learning that the few units we were interested in were all 240V thus we didn't want to stretch the boat wiring costs. We have refocused on LP gas and looking at our options. We are looking at Miele and Thermador. For refrigerator / freezers we are also looking at U-line. Would appreciate any input on these or other brands.

John


None of the 110V induction cooktops float your boat?

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Old 08-26-2014, 08:51 AM   #30
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Things should be getting better for propane because 1 January no more open pilot lights on any gas appliances manufactured or imported in the USA. Long overdue. An RV oven-cooktop is just fine with me if I have a way to light the oven and burners manually w/o pilot lite. Lighting pilot lights is generally not easy needing to heat the bimetal device first and NO WAY will I allow an open flame in the cabin unattended. I like battery powered igniters. As for brackets and so forth, if it is too rough to cook with out brackets and guards it is time for microwave, ham sandwiches and so forth for it is too rough to cook anyway. 95%+ is at the dock or on the hook. PO put in an RV unit with a pilot lite for the oven......useless. New range is on the list, currently waiting to see the offerings are after the regulations kick in. I have solenoid remote gas control, safety bilge sniffer-alarm and exterior ventilated tanks. Currently using electric toaster oven, rail mounted Weber Q 100 grill.
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Old 08-26-2014, 09:09 AM   #31
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Playing ones cards close to the vest is smart if considering entering negotiations. Boat names, listing links, make & model are all popular Google keywords.

A "savvy" seller would do well to Google search those keywords on his "own" boat whenever an offer comes in to gather possible intel on the potential buyers motivation. Likewise a "savvy" buyer would do well to avoid chatting up his choice in advance of the close.
Yeah, but now it turns out that it's a build to order so where's the need for all the secrecy...

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Old 08-26-2014, 07:47 PM   #32
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Not A Custom Boat

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Yeah, but now it turns out that it's a build to order so where's the need for all the secrecy...

Dave
Dave, good observation but the boat is not a custom oneoff build. Looked into that with a Downeast some time ago. The boat is one that any of us could purchase, we are just very fortunate the builder respects our experience and is working with us to build a better boat. This is one of the reasons we have focused with this builder and passed on other better known builders who have become too big for the little guy like myself. The deal is not done and I don't want to risk causing any harm to the building thus the tight lip. What I'm trying do is educate others on the process of looking and planning for their builds. Thanks
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Old 08-26-2014, 08:02 PM   #33
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Dave, good observation but the boat is not a custom oneoff build. Looked into that with a Downeast some time ago. The boat is one that any of us could purchase, we are just very fortunate the builder respects our experience and is working with us to build a better boat. This is one of the reasons we have focused with this builder and passed on other better known builders who have become too big for the little guy like myself. The deal is not done and I don't want to risk causing any harm to the building thus the tight lip. What I'm trying do is educate others on the process of looking and planning for their builds. Thanks
I didn't mean custom one-off by any means... any more than your last 3 Nordies were one-off builds. It would seem that you are simply doing that again, modifying a production boat to suit you. Nothing wrong with that but I'd be shocked if a production manufacturer would be adverse to the free advertising of you explaining why you chose their line and as you explained how they worked with you to build your dream. Heck, maybe you could cut an advertising deal with them.

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Old 08-26-2014, 09:49 PM   #34
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I fully respect your right and their right to privacy and am not sure why anyone would have a problem with that. I figure if one wants to share more information they will and it's not really my business why they choose not to. I think working quietly with builders is great too. Certainly how we've done it. Plus until a deal is finalized, there is no deal and everything said until that point can have an influence.

Besides you're building suspense....

We've built much as you are. I'm a strong proponent of semi-custom where the hull and basic structure are proven and then you can modify the interior and decks to your preferences. I also believe in going with the equipment the builder uses most and is most expert in matching where that is possible. Engine combinations that have worked well for them in other boats. And never try to push a builder out of their comfort zone. The best thing that can happen is they say no and send you on your way. The worst is they say yes and the nightmares come later. I can name three builders instantly that in recent years have undertaken something unique and different from their norm and they ended up in litigation.
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Old 08-27-2014, 07:37 AM   #35
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Well, I'm with Magicbus, frankly. You've lost me as to why all this is all that interesting when we are denied the possibility of knowing what the heck type, size, of vessel you are talking about. I also don't see the need for secrecy at this point. Frankly, I feel that once again, you are being a bit precious...
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Old 08-27-2014, 07:44 AM   #36
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Well, I'm with Magicbus, frankly. You've lost me as to why all this is all that interesting when we are denied the possibility of knowing what the heck type, size, of vessel you are talking about. I also don't see the need for secrecy at this point. Frankly, I feel that once again, you are being a bit precious...

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Old 08-27-2014, 09:47 AM   #37
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It sure seems to be his decision, his money and his boat. We are only spectators.
On another note, I love to buy and sell real estate (I'm not an agent). The people around me always know when I'm on the hunt for something new because I share with them what I'm looking for, not specifically what I'm looking at. The reason I stay tight lipped about it is that more that a few times my deals have gone south due to others poking around. Just one mans thoughts...
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Old 08-27-2014, 10:16 AM   #38
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Well, I'm with Magicbus, frankly. You've lost me as to why all this is all that interesting when we are denied the possibility of knowing what the heck type, size, of vessel you are talking about. I also don't see the need for secrecy at this point.
I'd suggest if one doesn't find it all that interesting, then why are they reading it? Now if he's being paid to post with an understanding he'll make it interesting, then that might be another thing.

Maybe the need for secrecy is a secret and that's the secret that must remain secret....lol.

I just accept what he shares as what he shares. It's his narrative and he can tell it like he wishes.
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Old 08-28-2014, 06:14 AM   #39
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That's fine, if he feels the need to keep it close to the body because of delicacy of negotiation, I have no issue with that. So why not just stay silent until the deal is done, then bring us in on it. Otherwise it's just a tease exercise…

Thus far, he sounds like a wily old politician we had here in Queensland who was the Premier for years, called Joh Bjelke-Peterson, who when asked questions was a legend for smiling and saying, "aha, that's for me to know, and you to find out".
Really pissed people off, that did…he was legend for a lot of weird sayings actually, so while you are all waiting with baited breath, (careful a fish does not grab your tongue), to hear what the boat is...enjoy some light entertainment by having a laugh at some of Joh's other 'notable' sayings…

Feeding the chooks: a selection of well-known sayings of former Queensland Premier, Sir Joh Bjelke-Petersen | Queensland Historical Atlas

Cheers,
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Old 08-29-2014, 11:32 PM   #40
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Well it appears our post has run into some rough waters and our intentions to provide a little insight related to finding the right boat and some of the decisions involved during the process has rubbed a few the wrong way. I have a lot of respect for this great site and it members so to insure we do not cause any more disruption this will be our last post until we sign a contact.

One last comment that may help explain why we are tight lipped. A little over a year ago bout a year ago we singed a LOI with PAE to build a new Nordhavn and unbeknown to us the company posted this on their web-site. Due to unforeseen circumstances we decided to cancel the LOI and felt bad that PAE jumped the gun and made the post. We did end up purchasing a used Nordhavn a few months later. I do not want to have this happen again for the sake of the builder since any LOI or contract cancellation can be viewed as a negative for the company. Thanks to everyone who has responded to date.
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