Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
 
Old 10-02-2015, 09:38 AM   #61
Guru
 
Pgitug's Avatar
 
City: Punta Gorda, fl
Country: Usa
Vessel Name: Escapade
Vessel Model: Nordic Tug 37 2002
Join Date: Jan 2015
Posts: 989
Quote:
Originally Posted by jungpeter View Post
Well, I'm far from an "expert", but here's my experience with exactly your conundrum.



My previous boat had 2" shafts, with conventional packing glands. It was easy-peasy to back off the packing nuts, twist out the old packing (using a purpose-made packing removal tool), and re-pack. Not positive of the exact product I used, but believe it was GTU Graftex Ultra-Shaft packing from Western Pacific Trading, which allows almost a leak-tight seal, both underway and at rest. All this while in the water.



Yup, water floods the boat while you work. Not as much as you'd think, and easily controllable with your bilge pump, assuming it's properly sized and working. Make sure you have the correct packing on hand before you start. Pre-cut the new packing to size before you begin, so you are ready to install ASAP the old stuff is reefed out. And have all your tools close at hand also.



If you haven't done this before, you may want to get a boatwright to do the first one while you watch, to glean any tricks of the trade I haven't mentioned. It should take about one hour per shaft, so you'd invest whatever the boatwright charged, but might be cheap insurance for your peace of mind.



My current boat has a PYI dripless seal on a single shaft, as well as the rudder post. No leaking on the driveshaft to date, but basically unserviceable in the water, either. My rudder shaft is leaking, and will have to wait for my next haulout to remove and R&R.



In my opinion, I would not replace conventional packing glands with dripless. They cost far more than they're worth.



Regards,



Pete

Just a heads up on your leaking PYI drip less seal. Talk with PYI, don't assume. I had my PYI drip less seal leaking and was told to take some wet/dry 600 grit sand paper, cut into 4"x4" square, fold in half, pull open the seal surface towards the bellows, insert the folded sand paper and drag it around the seal surface two or three times in one direction. This cleans off the contaminants that are causing the drips.
__________________
Advertisement

Pgitug is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2015, 09:57 AM   #62
Guru
 
City: gulf coast
Country: pinellas
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 2,199
the amount of water flow will depend on the gap between the shaft and the stuffing box itself without packing. In my case with 3" shafts flow was minimal. I kept a rag tied around the shaft to push into the gap temporarily if needed. Having the rings pre cut helps because you can stuff the first on in quickly and most of the water flow will be stopped. I never experienced any time when I was dependent on pumps to keep the boat afloat. I really like the idea of a pre cut piece of PVC pipe to settle the rings evenly but you will have to have the right size shafts and box. I just pushed the rings in with fingers then tightened down the box lightly to seat the ring. Clearing off the box threads with water and wire brush before disassembly makes things go easier. A good soaking with WD 40 helps as well.


Getting out the old rings took the most time. The corkscrew tool and dental pics did the job. Scrape the pic along the empty box to make sure there are no small pieces of packing left. T
__________________

bayview is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2015, 09:58 AM   #63
Guru
 
Hawgwash's Avatar
 
City: Sidney
Country: Canada
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 2,265
Quote:
Originally Posted by Capt.Bill11 View Post
Changing your packing while your boat is in the water makes for a good controlled test for your bilge pump system. If your pump/s can't more than handle the flow of one or two open stuffing boxes, you need some more and/or bigger pumps.
Good point. This is a freaky scary job for some the first time so that's why I suggested putting the pump(s) to the test before opening the spillway gates.
Hawgwash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2015, 10:29 AM   #64
Scraping Paint
 
City: -
Country: -
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 13,748
Quote:
Originally Posted by Capt.Bill11 View Post
Has your dog ever heard of a bore scope? Compression test? Leak down test? Or fluid analysis?
Wow, these are the tests you run on your vehicles after every time you use them? I guess if you think this is necessary that's fine but it seems way overkill to me. Unless, of course, you buy totally crap vehicles in which case perhaps it's necessary. But my reality is that I've never owned a vehicle yet that had its engine fail, even after close to 300,000 miles on a couple of them And all I ever do is change the oil and filters regularly. Water pumps crap out from time to time, and other ancillary stuff conks out occasionally but the engines juat go and go even without the plethora of tests you apparently run all the time. But perhaps I'm just not paranoid enough.


Quote:
If your dog is judging the quality of a boatyard by the size of their lift, I guess he needs to start bringing your boat to S FL.

A) My dog is WAY too smart to want anything to do with Florida, which he doesn't even consider part of the US and B) I mention the Travelift size merely as a way of pointing out that this particular yard caters to much more than the typical toy boat crowd but serves people whose livlihood depends on their vessels operating correctly and reliably. If they weren't very good at what they do the commercial boat folks wouldn't use them.
Marin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2015, 10:43 AM   #65
Guru
 
Hawgwash's Avatar
 
City: Sidney
Country: Canada
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 2,265
This might be fun to watch...
Attached Images
 
Hawgwash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2015, 10:45 AM   #66
Guru
 
City: Carefree, Arizona
Country: usa
Vessel Name: sunchaser V
Vessel Model: DeFever 48
Join Date: Apr 2008
Posts: 6,372
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alaskan Sea-Duction View Post
What say the TF experts?
I assume you will be hauling your vessel for various tasks prior to taking off for the PNW? If so, other than adding a few rings at this time -if needed- maybe wait until haul out time so a thorough 100% safe job can be done?
sunchaser is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2015, 10:50 AM   #67
Guru
 
Hawgwash's Avatar
 
City: Sidney
Country: Canada
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 2,265
Quote:
Originally Posted by sunchaser View Post
I assume you will be hauling your vessel for various tasks prior to taking off for the PNW? If so, other than adding a few rings at this time -if needed- maybe wait until haul out time so a thorough 100% safe job can be done?
Naw, everyone needs to put their pacemaker to the test by doing it in the water at least once.
Hawgwash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2015, 10:58 AM   #68
Scraping Paint
 
City: -
Country: -
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 13,748
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawgwash View Post
This might be fun to watch...
This is why, Hawg, I put zero stock in what people on amateur forums such as this one recommend or claim is th "right way" to do somethng. Because for every "expert " opinion there will always be someone claiming that their totally opposite opinion is the "correct" way.

Forums like this are highly entertaining which is why I play on it but as far as getting information you can truly bank on, with the very few and far between experts like Peggie Hall and Rick Boggs, an amateur-hour forum like this is not something I use to get actual correct answers to questions I might have. We have built up a whole bank of truly knowledgeable and experienced resources in this area we use for that.

And now I'm going to go off here in Toronto to talk to Air Canada about a 777.
Marin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2015, 11:04 AM   #69
Guru
 
Capt.Bill11's Avatar
 
City: Sarasota/Ft. Lauderdale
Country: USA
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 5,422
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marin View Post
Wow, these are the tests you run on your vehicles after every time you use them? I guess if you think this is necessary that's fine but it seems way overkill to me. Unless, of course, you buy totally crap vehicles in which case perhaps it's necessary. But my reality is that I've never owned a vehicle yet that had its engine fail, even after close to 300,000 miles on a couple of them And all I ever do is change the oil and filters regularly. Water pumps crap out from time to time, and other ancillary stuff conks out occasionally but the engines juat go and go even without the plethora of tests you apparently run all the time. But perhaps I'm just not paranoid enough.





A) My dog is WAY too smart to want anything to do with Florida, which he doesn't even consider part of the US and B) I mention the Travelift size merely as a way of pointing out that this particular yard caters to much more than the typical toy boat crowd but serves people whose livlihood depends on their vessels operating correctly and reliably. If they weren't very good at what they do the commercial boat folks wouldn't use them.
Yeah, that's it, I own crap vehicles and live in a state with lots of transplanted foreigners in it. Sorry if that last fact makes you and your dog uncomfortable.

So what's next? Your going to say something bad about my mother?

And if you think just because a yard caters to commercial fishing boats that means they do top notch work, you need to get out more.

But you still haven't answered the question. Is it just GFO packing they are seeing people over tightening? Or are people over tightening flax as well?
Capt.Bill11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2015, 11:08 AM   #70
Guru
 
Capt.Bill11's Avatar
 
City: Sarasota/Ft. Lauderdale
Country: USA
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 5,422
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hawgwash View Post
This might be fun to watch...
I'd be the taller one on the left.
Capt.Bill11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2015, 11:16 AM   #71
Guru
 
City: gulf coast
Country: pinellas
Join Date: Jun 2014
Posts: 2,199
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marin View Post
This is why, Hawg, I put zero stock in what people on amateur forums such as this one recommend or claim is th "right way" to do somethng. Because for every "expert " opinion there will always be someone claiming that their totally opposite opinion is the "correct" way.

Forums like this are highly entertaining which is why I play on it but as far as getting information you can truly bank on, with the very few and far between experts like Peggie Hall and Rick Boggs, an amateur-hour forum like this is not something I use to get actual correct answers to questions I might have. We have built up a whole bank of truly knowledgeable and experienced resources in this area we use for that.

And now I'm going to go off here in Toronto to talk to Air Canada about a 777.

What does that say about your 13,000 posts here???
bayview is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2015, 11:47 AM   #72
Enigma
 
RT Firefly's Avatar
 
City: Slicker?
Country: Bumpkin?
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 9,996
C'mon guys. This thread is about stuffing box options.
__________________
RTF
RT Firefly is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2015, 12:01 PM   #73
Guru
 
Hawgwash's Avatar
 
City: Sidney
Country: Canada
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 2,265
Quote:
Originally Posted by RT Firefly View Post
C'mon guys. This thread is about stuffing box options.
Stuffing box options are all played out, now let the boys have at 'er.
Besides we got a threesome goin' now.
Attached Images
 
Hawgwash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2015, 12:46 PM   #74
Guru
 
Alaskan Sea-Duction's Avatar
 
City: Inside Passage Summer/Columbia River Winter
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Alaskan Sea-Duction
Vessel Model: 1988 M/Y Camargue YachtFisher
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 3,154
Thanks all for your suggestions and comments.
__________________
1988 M/Y Camargue Yacht Fisher
Alaskan Sea-Duction
MMSI: 338131469
Blog: http://alaskanseaduction.blogspot.com/
Alaskan Sea-Duction is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2015, 12:49 PM   #75
Guru
 
Alaskan Sea-Duction's Avatar
 
City: Inside Passage Summer/Columbia River Winter
Country: USA
Vessel Name: Alaskan Sea-Duction
Vessel Model: 1988 M/Y Camargue YachtFisher
Join Date: Jul 2012
Posts: 3,154
Quote:
Originally Posted by sunchaser View Post
I assume you will be hauling your vessel for various tasks prior to taking off for the PNW? If so, other than adding a few rings at this time -if needed- maybe wait until haul out time so a thorough 100% safe job can be done?
Good point. I was planning a haulout in November. I will use Astoria as Englund marine is right around the corner.....


Then it is a 6 hour run back to the dock. enough time to adjust and break in the new seal.....
__________________
1988 M/Y Camargue Yacht Fisher
Alaskan Sea-Duction
MMSI: 338131469
Blog: http://alaskanseaduction.blogspot.com/
Alaskan Sea-Duction is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2015, 01:03 PM   #76
Guru
 
Hawgwash's Avatar
 
City: Sidney
Country: Canada
Join Date: Feb 2015
Posts: 2,265
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alaskan Sea-Duction
I was planning a haulout in November. Then it is a 6 hour run back to the dock. enough time to adjust and break in the new seal.....
Well there you go.
Just get them to let you watch the repack.
Hawgwash is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2015, 02:10 PM   #77
FF
Guru
 
FF's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 16,531
"Or does his rudimentary logic just end at, "Well it ran fine yesterday, so I don't see why we need to monitor it's condition? Let's just run it till it fails catastrophically".

IT Flew In didn't it?

USN Ferry Pilot song,
FF is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2015, 03:38 PM   #78
Scraping Paint
 
City: -
Country: -
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 13,748
Quote:
Originally Posted by bayview View Post
What does that say about your 13,000 posts here???
That I have a lot of fun here. Sort of like watching Family Guy.
Marin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2015, 03:50 PM   #79
Scraping Paint
 
City: -
Country: -
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 13,748
Quote:
Originally Posted by Capt.Bill11 View Post
Is it just GFO packing they are seeing people over tightening? Or are people over tightening flax as well?
They didn't differentiate between the kinds of people doing the wrong thing. They simply said that when Gore/synthetics are overtightened to the point of running too hot they tend to become brittle and crack. Flax, they said, doesn't do this.

They are NOT saying that this is an excuse to overtighten flax, only that when someone adjusts the nuts incorrectly or fails to monitor or check the packng glands in their boat and they are running too hot, Gore/synthetics are prone to damage and potential failure under conditions that flax will stand up to. And they say they have seen the problems with Gore/synthetics enough to not recommend its use although they will install it if an owner desires.

They do, however, like Gore/synthetics for packing rudder shafts.
Marin is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 10-02-2015, 04:17 PM   #80
Guru
 
Capt.Bill11's Avatar
 
City: Sarasota/Ft. Lauderdale
Country: USA
Join Date: Apr 2014
Posts: 5,422
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marin View Post

They are NOT saying that this is an excuse to overtighten flax, only that when someone adjusts the nuts incorrectly or fails to monitor or check the packng glands in their boat and they are running too hot, Gore/synthetics are prone to damage and potential failure under conditions that flax will stand up to.

Sorry I'm not buying it. GFO has a lower coefficient of friction than flax. Flax needs water flowing around it to cool it in most cases. GFO can be run dripless. If you get flax packing hot the "wax" in it melts right out and the fiction heat climbs way up. I've even seen misadjusted boxes packed with flax start smoking from the friction.

But whatever. People can make their own choice on what to use.
__________________

Capt.Bill11 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off





All times are GMT -5. The time now is 11:58 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.8 Beta 4
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
Search Engine Optimization by vBSEO 3.6.0
Copyright 2006 - 2012