Racor 10 vs 30

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Portuguese

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Joined
Jun 10, 2011
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Location
Brazil
Vessel Name
Rainha Jannota
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Curruira 46
Gents

It looks like high bio-diesel content has a very bad relationship with the 2 or 30 microns Racor filter element. I am going now for the 10 microns

What you all think?

Thank you
 
Wheeewie!!!! I do believe there was a thread on this with extensive resources footnoted. One particular article was excellent. I have Cummins and use 10 micron on the primary Racor and then the Fleetguard Cumins spec on engine filter. That is what is recommeded from the Cummins camp!
 
Lugger Bob told us 30, so we run 30.
 
Every one has an opinion, but go with what your engine manufacturer recommends. Generally they call for less filtration on the primary, moving to more (finer) filtration closer to the engine. For example, Cummins recommendation for my 6BTA 5.9 JWAC engine calls for a 30 micron primary (Racor), and a 10 micron FleetGuard on-engine secondary. Good enough for me.

John Baczek
Puffin, NT32-266
Watch Hill RI
 
Gents

It looks like high bio-diesel content has a very bad relationship with the 2 or 30 microns Racor filter element. I am going now for the 10 microns

Specifically, what is bad about the 2 and 30 micron elements that you expect 10 micron to solve?

I am curious about this.
 
Started out w two but decided that was too fine. I use 10 now.

jleonard,
I thought 2 may clog the filter prematurely and w stuff not an issue. After all the idea is to stop stuff that could be a problem so the largest "mesh" that will stop the bad stuff should be best. Perhaps 100 to 200 micron would cover us ???
JL re your question I don't understand why the 30 micron is in the question.
 
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Started out w two but decided that was too fine. I use 10 now.

jleonard,
I thought 2 may clog the filter prematurely and w stuff not an issue. After all the idea is to stop stuff that could be a problem so the largest "mesh" that will stop the bad stuff should be best. Perhaps 100 to 200 micron would cover us ???
JL re your question I don't understand why the 30 micron is in the question.

Read the original post. It said 2 and 30 micron are a problem.
From MY limited knowledge of biodiesel in trucks, the first few tanksful clog filters badly. So yes 2 would likely give problems, but I want to know why the poster is choosing 10 over 30 that's all.
 
Agree with using what the engine manufacturer tells you to use. Also, like others, mystified by the OP.
 
Like Jay L., my limited exposure to bio diesel suggests some differences in filtration.

The beginning use of it does tend to plug filters because of it qualities in cleaning systems and in cooler climes it thickens a bit...and there are several other issues...but why certain micron ratings are avoided long term....???
 
If you are going to start using biodiesel there are two things you might consider. #1 put what is known as a high capacity spin on mud filter with vacuum gauge and closed loop out board priming bulb fuel pump in the fuel line before your first filter and carry a half dozen spin on filters. This is a technique fishing boats with dirty old tanks that get stirred up in bad weather use. #2 your second option carry a lot of spare filter elements for your present filter. The problem with #2 is that you may not get warning before filter gets overloaded and most likely the capacity of your present filter is not near the spin on mud filter's capacity.
 

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30 micron in Racors X2 with changeover valve as primary then 15mic. spin on high cap then on to the two on-engine filters whatever they are (120 Ford/Saber).

Change Racors at vacuum indication and spin on at oil change and on-engine at 300 hours/ yearly.

works
 
It looks like high bio-diesel content has a very bad relationship with the 2 or 30 microns Racor filter element. I am going now for the 10 microns

What you all think?


What is the nature of the "very bad relationship" ?

Our engine manufacturer (Cummins) recommends 30μ for primary, and I understand the Fleetguard secondaries are 10μ... so that's what we use.

Don't know whether that would change for bio, but would assume Cummins would be best to answer that question (in our case), should it arise.

I think my point is that the "best" filtration is perhaps engine-specific -- i.e., including for specific variants (N, T, TA, etc.), not just brand-specific, and very likely not generic -- in nature, perhaps best answered directly by your engine manufacturer.

-Chris
 
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There's also the standard recommendations the for other "special" considerations...

Bio fuel may get different recommendations so make dang sure the big picture is presented, especially if you use multiple fuel types.
 
Don't use Bio Diesel. It leaves nasty, gooey, waxy residue in your tank. NO micron of any size will help biodiesel. If I had a stove at home, furnace in my cellar or a generator at home I would use biodiesel. But since my life (and that of my guests) depend upon a good running engine in a floating environment I skip the thought of trying to save a few bucks with biodiesel. It just ain't worth it.
 
@ Portuguese: If I may be so bold as to hijack the thread for a bit... You have a VERY interesting hull. Double chine and nice fairing. Who built her? Quite impressed with the design. Notice the rolling chocks. Were those put on as an afterthought to help with the rolling? or was it a planned design? Who was the designer?
 
Portuguese

I just looked at all the pics from your fliker link. Wow! what an incredible build. You should be very proud. You are definitely a more patient than me.
 
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if this is the boat you just launched then you probably have a new common rail engine. Filter advice from guys running 40 YO slow diesels doesn't apply. Your engine maker will have very specific advice regarding bio fuel and filtration. These are critical issues on common rail engines.
 
if this is the boat you just launched then you probably have a new common rail engine. Filter advice from guys running 40 YO slow diesels doesn't apply. Your engine maker will have very specific advice regarding bio fuel and filtration. These are critical issues on common rail engines.

That's true to a point. But what has changed is the viscosity and make up of Biodiesel. It has random amounts of coagulants in it. It is a blend of vegetable, used cooking oil and diesel. They sometimes do not get the blend just right. The only way to get it to thin out is to keep it heated. A boat that is using biodiesel and keep running (with the return heating up the tank) sees almost no issues. But a boat with a tank full, and just sitting there will be crudded up in no time, and get filled with a 'gelatin' coating. Almost like wax or paraffin. The mentioned 'pre filter' of a centrifuge type filter is most often seen installed to combat this. BUT, the best way to avoid it is to not buy biodiesel.

What the manual says is often trumped with what is seen in the field. I frequently haul biodiesel in 4.2 million gallon lots. More often than not our tanks are a complete mess. The bio additive part is literally hanging off the frames and ladders in the tanks like strands of goo. The stuff is tenacious. It takes several hours of hot water washing to clean the tanks for the next load. Customers have to pay extra for cleaning to get rid of the stuff so it doesn't contaminate the next cargo. This was a huge issue several years ago when it was introduced, since no one knew about these qualities. The operators were left holding the financial bag since there had never been anything like this residue before, to deal with when switching cargoes. Now it is routinely put into the contracts that tanks with bio blends are subject to being professionally cleaned after haulage.
 
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if this is the boat you just launched then you probably have a new common rail engine. Filter advice from guys running 40 YO slow diesels doesn't apply. Your engine maker will have very specific advice regarding bio fuel and filtration. These are critical issues on common rail engines.

+1

I don't know what kind of motor is in the boat. If it is a Cummins, they provide instructions on how to use biodiesel in their motors and how to properly filter the fuel.

Cummins Engines
 
That's true to a point. But what has changed is the viscosity and make up of Biodiesel. It has random amounts of coagulants in it. It is a blend of vegetable, used cooking oil and diesel. They sometimes do not get the blend just right. The only way to get it to thin out is to keep it heated. A boat that is using biodiesel and keep running (with the return heating up the tank) sees almost no issues. But a boat with a tank full, and just sitting there will be crudded up in no time, and get filled with a 'gelatin' coating. Almost like wax or paraffin. The mentioned 'pre filter' of a centrifuge type filter is most often seen installed to combat this. BUT, the best way to avoid it is to not buy biodiesel.

What the manual says is often trumped with what is seen in the field. I frequently haul biodiesel in 4.2 million gallon lots. More often than not our tanks are a complete mess. The bio additive part is literally hanging off the frames and ladders in the tanks like strands of goo. The stuff is tenacious. It takes several hours of hot water washing to clean the tanks for the next load. Customers have to pay extra for cleaning to get rid of the stuff so it doesn't contaminate the next cargo. This was a huge issue several years ago when it was introduced, since no one knew about these qualities. The operators were left holding the financial bag since there had never been anything like this residue before, to deal with when switching cargoes. Now it is routinely put into the contracts that tanks with bio blends are subject to being professionally cleaned after haulage.

:thumb:

It's always nice to get some low inference data for a change.
THANKS.:dance:
 
:thumb:

It's always nice to get some low inference data for a change.
THANKS.:dance:
The nice thing about low inference data is, the receptor has to be cognizant of how to receive it, and how to use it! (or even if they can understand the data!)
 
The original question was about biodiesel and filters. The manufacturers make filter specs to run their engines. Bio diesel is an 'emerging' product. In the U.S. The specs have been under just about constant review, morphing into different (usually lesser quality) standards. I can only imagine what the QC is like in Brazil. It is just about impossible to state with certainty what anyone should do concerning filters or biodiesel (except to find straight diesel) when the base product has so many different viscosities, ingredients and need for filtering.

Just because someone isn't aware of the differences in fuel quality does not mean it isn't giving people 'fits' around the globe.

A true centrifugal fuel purifier is very labor intensive to clean. Sort of takes away any benefit to using bio fuel as a lure to reduce carbon.
 
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